Guest 1930 Posted October 14, 2012 Share Posted October 14, 2012 Anyone know, make and model would be of interest as well, thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1930 Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Surprised no-one wants to take a stab at it, no clue at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Braverman Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 My wild a** guess is the '57 GM cars with fuel injection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarFreak Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 57 & 58 Eldorado Brougham had an electric, in tank electric pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1930 Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 I googled it the other day and I got 50 era as a sorta response, maybe as definitive as need be at this point. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarlLaFong Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 SU was building electric pumps in the early 30s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Al Brass Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 From what I can see, SU started manufacturing electric fuel pumps in 1926. Here is a link to some history. http://www.vintage-sportscar-touring.ca/pdf/suhistory.pdfRegardsAl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 I would guess SU as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobb Posted April 10, 2018 Share Posted April 10, 2018 Studebaker had electric fuel pump in 1927 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff_a Posted April 11, 2018 Share Posted April 11, 2018 Peerless cars had electric fuel pumps from 1929 on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted April 11, 2018 Share Posted April 11, 2018 1928, Model J Duesenberg had three electric and one mechanical fuel pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 11, 2018 Share Posted April 11, 2018 (edited) Wills Ste Claire in 1925 and 26 used a Ireland Matthews "Autopulse" electric fuel pump. This pump is located at the Carb. It is not much larger than a fuel bowl assembly. Karl Edited April 12, 2018 by KRK Sr. add photos and info (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Wow, I just noticed this post was from 2012! It also has had over 1300 views. Karl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Karl, are there any Wills St Clair car that still have the factory pump working and running the car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Ed, I have an original, non running pump. It is in on the bench in pieces at the moment, I have had the upper casting reproduced, I still need to make bottoms. when done I will able to offer them to Wills owners as a simple pass through part, (non working). I know of a Wills owner who found one at Hershey 30 years ago NOS in the box, he has not put it on his restored car. I made 10 castings, it could be a lifetime supply with so few Wills out there! Karl 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Great Autopulse ad, Karl. It lists all the cars that came standard with the electric pump, plus all the race car drivers that use it. Does that article state where and when that ad was used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 What year was the ad? I always enjoy the true car people who go to every effort to make their car correct. Sadly it is not done very often anymore. I see so much stuff on the Concours circuit that is incorrect, and sadly the owners and restores don't often know that the car is incorrect. Recently a major multi million dollar car was on the show field. The restorer was overly proud of the restoration and very vocal about it. I pulled four points off of it from ten feet away. I kept my thoughts to myself, but the judges found more wrong than I did. It seems the new younger generation of restorers just go for the bright and shiny look, authenticity just seems to go out the window. Never mind that half the stuff cant even drive down the road without a tow truck behind it to ensure a round trip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Ed. It's not just the "new younger generation," it's also the new older generation just getting into the hobby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 West & Ed, this is a copy of a Jan. 1927 ad. The month Wills shut the doors. I have a full page copy of an other Autopulse ad from 1926 that also states who used the pump. The small ad is from an Old Cars article I cut out and saved. When I get home tonight I will scan and post it for all to read. I could not find the other ad even though it was in my hands this winter, When I do I will post it too. Wills always said he was first in 1925. Karl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Man Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 I hope I am not changing the topic.... This is my comment on electric fuel pumps...how do you shut them off in case of an accident? I do not think anybody had a shut off device till the 1990's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emjay Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Our awareness of safety and knowledge/respect of equipment was different then. In most cases unpressurized gasoline simply burns. It's not explosive until the vapor is pressurized despite what Hollywood shows. Accidents usually happen out in the wide open and car is ripped open. Unless you were unconscious the first thing you did was turn off the ignition because we were smarter than. We we okay with a 10% chance of a fire hazard. Now everything needs to be 99.99% safe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 If we go back and read the ad : It is endorsed by Underwriters Labs for safety, could we ask for more. On a Wills its running as soon as you move the Delco Ign. switch arm to the on position. Karl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike6024 Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 How did the AutoPulse work? Like an electromagnet/solenoid pushing a piston against a diaphragm? And maybe a check valve? I see many newer AutoPulse pumps pictured online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike6024 Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 (edited) Brass Bellows (?) and an electromagnet. 1926 Marine fuel pump. Edited April 12, 2018 by mike6024 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobb Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Speaking of safety this fuel pump was installed so the he driver would know if there was a problem. It was mounted to the wooden floor under under his seeat. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Mike, the lower boat autopulse pump is what Wills used, but just one. The #500 that Duesenberg and others used has a much larger electric magnet than the earlier type.(Shown in your first photo) This must have been a good one as it is used for years and years. 50's cars continued to use 1-3 pumps. Karl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 Jan 1926 Motor, Karl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 Interesting that the electric pump was used so early. The Wills was certainly an “engineers” car with all its unusual advancements. Now the big question. Why didn’t All automotive manufacturers go over to the electric pump sooner? The vacuum tank was still in popular use till 1932. And when you think about it, the V-16 Cadillacs with the dual vacuum tanks were down right primitive compared to the power plant and transmission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike6024 Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 If Karl's disassembled unit still includes the "brass bellows" I'd like to see a close-up picture of it. That would be the key to a reliable electric pump. Something like a rubber diaphragm that can be used to pump by expanding it and contracting, without it degrading and rupturing. In this case a brass bellows was used. How much elasticity and durability could that have? It seems the bellows was pulled open by the electromagnet, it would fill with fuel, then the magnet de-energized, and the bellows would contract expelling the fuel. It would have been, say, an early attempt at a self-priming plunger type pump, as opposed to centrifugal pump. I suppose it would also have had a check valve. "Autopulse is a small magnetic fuel pump that consumes very little current. It delivers clean gasoline from the reserve tank by the pumping action of a brass bellows, which is expanded by an electro-magnet." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Man Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 You might want to add a caveat to the fuel pump mix. AC had just started building the design that became the "industry standard" for fuel pumps in 1928. So these two new technologies were both in there infancy. I am guessing Cadillac decided not to risk it and went with the proven system? Interesting even today we are replacing the diaphragms on the 1928 fuel pumps, so the new fuel is not eating them.... Finding a metal (brass) diaphragm would be an engineering challenge, remember it also has to have a magnetic property so the electro-magnet will work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRK Sr. Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 Mike, the insides had been gutted long ago. There is two locations for spring discs (check valves) like most mechanical AC and Stewart pumps from the 30's and up use to keep prime and pressure in the upper casting. 1929 Pierce Arrow went with a Mechanical AC pump on the "new eight" getting rid of the vacuum tank, but they like Wills liked Delco parts for a long time so an AC pump would make sense. Wills on the other hand was looking for the most modern , best constructed parts he could use for his all new updated1925 models. Karl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinneyhill Posted April 13, 2018 Share Posted April 13, 2018 I would imagine a brass bellows would work harden in a little while with the continuous flexing, then it would crack. End of pump. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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