Car won't start but does sputter - carb problem?

[tbirdman]

I've been troubleshooting a problem with my 1912 Cadillac. A few months ago it would stall unless I choked it slightly. I started to adjust the carb, a Carter BB1 updraft. Still couldn't get it to idle without a little choke. I then took the car out for a drive. It had no power and it final quit coming home. I had it towed and haven't been able to get it started.

I won't bore you with all of the troubleshooting things we did including both electrical, fuel and compression. I went actually as far as do a valve job. Timing and spark has been checked and rechecked. All electrical components including coil, cap, rotor, condensor have been replaced. Ran 12V (car has been modified to 12v negative ground)directly to the coil. Replaced the coil also.

The car will not start. However I can get it to almost start and fire a little if I close the choke while cranking then while pumping the accelerator, I close the choke. That seems to me that I've got fuel issues. I have replaced the fuel filter and the electric fuel pump is working and putting out a strong fuel flow. I have set the idle screw to one turn and the high speed adjustment to 2 1/2. We took apart the carb and it seem clean. I took it to a carb rebuilder who said the only real issue was the float was slightly out of adjustment. Seems to me if I got fuel to the carb, but the car won't start unless I overly enrich the mixture, then I got a float problem pr some other carb issue. Comments? Fuel does drip out of the carb after cranking it a while. Plugs seem pretty dry.

I also have checked for vaccuum leaks from the carb to the intake manifolds, replacing all of the gaskets. I'm stumped.

[F&J]

Clear your mind of all the stuff you have already done, and start over with the basics.

If it showed up at my shop:

- I would first pull the plugs and do a simple comp test with just a finger in each plug hole. Sounds crude, but works.

- next, I would leave the plugs out but connected to the plug wires and visually check the spark on each one while cranking.

-next, I would visually check static timing several times by coming up slowly on #1 while having a test light hooked to the minus terminal on the coil. The test light will light up just as the points first open. Make sure you are really on the compession stroke, not the exhaust stroke.

-if all above is good; I'd try to fire it on spray carb cleaner. I have run motors that way with no known harm, especially the ancient cars that have such low compession ratios. If you can start it that way, and keep it running by quick short sprays of carb cleaner, then it is carb problems.

- Carbs can be checked by using a high volume air compessor blow gun with the carb removed. Just blow through the intake, and the venturi reaction should cause the gas to be sucked up and atomized to a fine mist.

- Any of the above should be done with safety in mind due to the chance of fire hazard. Keep good fire extinguishers handy, and do the work outside if possible.

[Friartuck]

Ken,

F&J's comments are very good, but based on the symptoms described, I think its a carb problem and more specifically, float level. Fuels in the past few years have changed their density a little which would change where the float is bouyant. Another possibility is the float itself. How do you know the float hasn't been filling up with fuel, a common problem with older brass metal that becomes porous over time. Yet another issue is recently formulated fuels have been cleaning the fuel systems where grit has been showing up in filters and fuel bowls. I don't see where you mentioned pulling the carb and thoroughly cleaning it.

If you're a little creative (and careful), you could run the engine off propane which would narrow down your area to diagnose. Use a 20 pound cylinder with regulator and rubber hose whip with seperate valve on the regulated side. One person on the propane tank at all times controlling it while someone else starts the car.

Let us know how this turns out.

[F&J]

Some more thinking about the original post: "fuel drips from carb but plugs look dry" and "carb was sent out to a carb guy"/

It almost makes me go back to the first time it broke down.."loosing power". I wonder if this is a compression problem...or something caused the timing of the distributor or cam to go screwy.

I'd still do the comp test first, even though the valves were just done.

I'd also ignore the ignition timing MARK at this point. I'd put a finger in #1 hole and do the test light deal to see if the light comes on right near where the cylinder stops making compression at the top dead center of the comp stroke. ...and then see if the rotor points to #1 wire in the cap.

I still think this is a "back to bacics" hunt.

He did not mention if he tried to start it with filling the primer cups full of gas??? I would try that also. It would at least fire up and then die out if the carb is the real culprit.

[Earl B.]

Ken, a friend was having problems with his '32 Packard. Like you, he checked and rechecked everything, someone told him to change the spark plugs, which were relatively new, but he figured ...why not??? It fired right up.. spark plugs are fairly cheap, put in some new ones, and give it a try... can't hurt...B

[Friartuck]

F&J's comment about fueling dripping is something I didn't pick-up on earlier and is a sure sign of carb problem. Perhaps the electric fuel pump is overpowering the float circuit of the carb. The Carb Rebuilder may have just assumed it was gravity pressure.

Ken, do you have a regulator on the fuel pump?

[keiser31]

A fuel regulator may help. My 1931 Dodge had the very same problems as tbirdman. Yep...Carter bb-1 carb! We found a vacuum leak on the engine side of the manifold that I could not see without a mirror. Dripped fuel and sputtered like your bb-1. Part of the reason for my problem (I believe) is that the bb-1 port was larger than the manifold port and created turbulance and therefore did not let all of the fuel through to the cylinders. Fixed the vacuum leak and off we went.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Friartuck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">F&J's comment about fueling dripping is something I didn't pick-up on earlier and is a sure sign of carb problem. Perhaps the electric fuel pump is overpowering the float circuit of the carb. The Carb Rebuilder may have just assumed it was gravity pressure.

Ken, do you have a regulator on the fuel pump? </div></div>

I do not have a regulator, but earlier in the year the car ran like a champ so I don't think I need to start adding parts. These updraft carb will leak after you crank them awhile as the fuel has no place to go put settle in the inlet of the carb.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: F&J</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Clear your mind of all the stuff you have already done, and start over with the basics.

If it showed up at my shop:

- I would first pull the plugs and do a simple comp test with just a finger in each plug hole. Sounds crude, but works. <span style="font-weight: bold">Done</span>

- next, I would leave the plugs out but connected to the plug wires and visually check the spark on each one while cranking. <span style="font-weight: bold">Done</span>

-next, I would visually check static timing several times by coming up slowly on #1 while having a test light hooked to the minus terminal on the coil. The test light will light up just as the points first open. Make sure you are really on the compession stroke, not the exhaust stroke. <span style="font-weight: bold">Done-we confirmed TDC for #1 by looking at laves which are exposed on side of engine and taken off engine side cover which exposes the piston rods. I used test light to set the points.</span>

-if all above is good; I'd try to fire it on spray carb cleaner. I have run motors that way with no known harm, especially the ancient cars that have such low compession ratios. If you can start it that way, and keep it running by quick short sprays of carb cleaner, then it is carb problems.

- Carbs can be checked by using a high volume air compessor blow gun with the carb removed. Just blow through the intake, and the venturi reaction should cause the gas to be sucked up and atomized to a fine mist.

- Any of the above should be done with safety in mind due to the chance of fire hazard. Keep good fire extinguishers handy, and do the work outside if possible. </div></div>

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Packard32</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ken, a friend was having problems with his '32 Packard. Like you, he checked and rechecked everything, someone told him to change the spark plugs, which were relatively new, but he figured ...why not??? It fired right up.. spark plugs are fairly cheap, put in some new ones, and give it a try... can't hurt...B </div></div>

Aleady bought brand new plugs. Old plugs looked in great shape.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: F&J</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some more thinking about the original post: "fuel drips from carb but plugs look dry" and "carb was sent out to a carb guy"/

It almost makes me go back to the first time it broke down.."loosing power". I wonder if this is a compression problem...or something caused the timing of the distributor or cam to go screwy.

I'd still do the comp test first, even though the valves were just done.

I'd also ignore the ignition timing MARK at this point. I'd put a finger in #1 hole and do the test light deal to see if the light comes on right near where the cylinder stops making compression at the top dead center of the comp stroke. ...and then see if the rotor points to #1 wire in the cap.

I still think this is a "back to bacics" hunt.

He did not mention if he tried to start it with filling the primer cups full of gas??? I would try that also. It would at least fire up and then die out if the carb is the real culprit. </div></div>

Tried filling the priming cups, but it would not start which puzzles me. We had the timing cover off and looked at the gears at the front end. They looked in perfect shape, almost brand new. The chrankshaft and camshaft gears are pin or keyed in and don't see how they could had slipped at all. No timing chain. I had consulted with a 12 expert and he swore that it had to be something simple like ignition or fuel. He had advised going back to the basics also.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Friartuck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ken,

F&J's comments are very good, but based on the symptoms described, I think its a carb problem and more specifically, float level. Fuels in the past few years have changed their density a little which would change where the float is bouyant. Another possibility is the float itself. How do you know the float hasn't been filling up with fuel, a common problem with older brass metal that becomes porous over time. Yet another issue is recently formulated fuels have been cleaning the fuel systems where grit has been showing up in filters and fuel bowls. I don't see where you mentioned pulling the carb and thoroughly cleaning it.

Let us know how this turns out. </div></div>

We took aboutthe carb and it was clean as a whistle. Also took the carb to get it rebuilt just in case. The float was in fine shape...it was floating.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: keiser31</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A fuel regulator may help. My 1931 Dodge had the very same problems as tbirdman. Yep...Carter bb-1 carb! We found a vacuum leak on the engine side of the manifold that I could not see without a mirror. Dripped fuel and sputtered like your bb-1. Part of the reason for my problem (I believe) is that the bb-1 port was larger than the manifold port and created turbulance and therefore did not let all of the fuel through to the cylinders. Fixed the vacuum leak and off we went. </div></div>

I changed the gaskets and tried to look for leakks but I could not fine anything. I had tighten up the carb attachment to the intake manifold just before I took it for the last time when it lost power. I suspected I had done something to the gasket, but a new gasket did not fix it.

[tbirdman]

I had not mentioned but the engine had been rebuilt in the past decade and had been running like a champ. One more symptom was earlier in the year, I was having difficulty getting it to restart. When I received the car in May it had no problem with restarting. In August I had trouble restarting but found out by pumpingthe gas pedal while cranking, it would start.

This all points to not enough gas being drawn up into the intake manifold.

[Mark Shaw]

Ken,

I run a BB1 on my 13 model 31 Buick with no issues. I tried to attach a pdf file which shows all the parts & adjustments for a BB1 carb., but the forum site will not accept it. Send a direct email to durcodude@comcast.net and I will forward it to you.

Make sure your carb gasket is slotted in an X pattern as shown on the third gasket in the pdf file. If not, make a slot to expose the hole in the carb flange to the vacuum inside the intake manifold. This slot provides vacuum to an internal spring loaded valve inside the carb.

I am not sure the gasket is your problem, but maybe some of the info on the pdf will help you troubleshoot adjustments etc.

[Friartuck]

Ken,

I have not seen you comment on performing an actual compression test. Did you and what were the results?

This sounds like a gradual degradation problem rather than a sudden "something broke" which points me to head gasket gradually failing. The fact that you used the priming cups with no differance has me thinking compression is leaking into adjacent cylinders, hence lack of compression and lack of vaccuum. Your hard choking it may get some gas/air mix into the cylinder.

[oldiron]

Hey; Tbirdman; I have been reading with interest your dilemma, both on the Early Cadillac site, and now here on the AACA site. When putting it all together, these guys here, as the guys on the Caddy site, are pointing you in the correct direction. That is namely; with proper compression,spark,(ignition at the right time), and fuel in the combustion chamber, you will fire. I have a '13 Cadillac

with a BB1 also. I have run on the original Johnson carbm, as well as the BB1; i.e. in fact I prefer the BB1 with an electric pump.Currently it's down for rewiring, but, it runs very strong and reliably. You need to do just what these guys are telling you. Go back to basics. 1. Check the compression. 2. insure you have ignition, spark, at the right time, and 3. of coarse you need fuel in the cylinder.

F & J, Keiser, Packard 32, and Friartuck are all correct.

regards; Jerry

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Friartuck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ken,

I have not seen you comment on performing an actual compression test. Did you and what were the results?

This sounds like a gradual degradation problem rather than a sudden "something broke" which points me to head gasket gradually failing. The fact that you used the priming cups with no differance has me thinking compression is leaking into adjacent cylinders, hence lack of compression and lack of vaccuum. Your hard choking it may get some gas/air mix into the cylinder. </div></div>

With individual cylinders on the 12 Cadillac don't you think a head gasket failure affecting starting unlikley. Maybe it would effect one cylinder but not the rest of them?

[Guest simplyconnected]

Ok, you may have tried using a propane tank (a simple UNLIT soldering torch will do), you had your carb rebuilt, and it delivers gas (characterized by the dripping and a heavy smell of fumes), your electrical was checked (and ok), and you fingered your cylinders for compression.

I see you examined the cam sprocket, but you never said anything about watching lifters (or rocker arms) going up and down. Are they? All the way???

Another possibility is, your exhaust is blocked. You mentioned a slow decrease, and THAT would do it. Either you have carbon or critters. If so, compression checks, electrical, and fuel delivery would show as very normal. Can you feel exhaust gasses coming out, or did nobody check?

Hope this helps. - Dave Dare

[Owen_Dyneto]

I haven't read every word posted above, but I didn't read that you actually checked for a spark at the plugs. I'll agree it sounds like fuel but if you filled the priming cups and didn't get a cough, I'd begin checking ignition.

Also, you did say coil, but I thought these were magneto ignition.

[Guest 32tinindian]

Is the starter turning the engine fast enough to suck the fuel up into the chamber? I have an updraft on a 32 Pontiac. Had similar problems. Tried similar fixes, then a friend suggested I clean all my grounds (I also rebuilt the starter). She starts beautifully now.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 32tinindian</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is the starter turning the engine fast enough to suck the fuel up into the chamber? I have an updraft on a 32 Pontiac. Had similar problems. Tried similar fixes, then a friend suggested I clean all my grounds (I also rebuilt the starter). She starts beautifully now. </div></div>

12 Cadillac which have the first electric starter, turn slow. Think about how slow they turn when he hand crank them which this car can be.

[oldiron]

Gentlemen; There are no clyinder head gaskets on these engines. The construction is thus; A barrel crankcase to which individual cylinders are bolted. The individual heads are internally threaded and screwed to the cylinders. (The top of each cylinder has a male thread to which a female thread in the head is mated/screwed). So, there would be no leaks through a head gasket. If this engine were running, there would be no leaks in this regard.

My interest is in the valve train. SIMPLY CONNECTED has an interesting thought. Did you watch the valves move up and down ? Well suppose the pin connecting the gear to the cam shaft has sheared. In this case you wouldn't have any valve movement. Check that the valves move completely up and down; you'll eliminate any question then in this area.

Look. Someone also said to check the rotor position for #1 cylinder when at top dead center. Continue to check this geometry for all four cylinders. Finally, if your concerned about the fuel pump, hook up affecting the carb, disconnect the fuel line and use the old standby, (a raised can with fuel feeding card by gravity; but really, you should find that fuel being put into the combustion chamber via the priming cups should be sufficient.

Finally, I'm not sure if you have the same ignition as the '13; i.e. which would be a seperate ignition for starting before you switch over to the primary ignition for running. If you do have this setup, I believe you'll find the starting ignition system the most reliable for starting.

Regards; Jerry Janson

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: oldiron</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Gentlemen; There are no clyinder head gaskets on these engines. The construction is thus; A barrel crankcase to which individual cylinders are bolted. The individual heads are internally threaded and screwed to the cylinders. (The top of each cylinder has a male thread to which a female thread in the head is mated/screwed). So, there would be no leaks through a head gasket. If this engine were running, there would be no leaks in this regard.

My interest is in the valve train. SIMPLY CONNECTED has an interesting thought. Did you watch the valves move up and down ? Well suppose the pin connecting the gear to the cam shaft has sheared. In this case you wouldn't have any valve movement. Check that the valves move completely up and down; you'll eliminate any question then in this area.

Look. Someone also said to check the rotor position for #1 cylinder when at top dead center. Continue to check this geometry for all four cylinders. Finally, if your concerned about the fuel pump, hook up affecting the carb, disconnect the fuel line and use the old standby, (a raised can with fuel feeding card by gravity; but really, you should find that fuel being put into the combustion chamber via the priming cups should be sufficient.

Finally, I'm not sure if you have the same ignition as the '13; i.e. which would be a seperate ignition for starting before you switch over to the primary ignition for running. If you do have this setup, I believe you'll find the starting ignition system the most reliable for starting.

Regards; Jerry Janson </div></div>

The valves definitely move up and down. We have exmaine those quite thoroughly. They do have a strange action of snapping close, but when the car was running fine, they did that also. I had inspected the cam shaft it it appears to be intact. This car has been modified so to start it I'm using the modern chevy II distributor with modern cap and rotor. Tonight I took out number 1 plug and grounded it on the block. I adjusted the shaft that turns the distributor and adjusted the timing so as I slowly turned the engine with a hand crank the engine, I would get a spark at top dead center. I made sure that the exhaust valve closed, then the intake opened and then closed for TDC. We have physically made sure that TDC was at the C mark on the fly wheel. It almost started, but I need to recharge the batteries as I have run them down.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mark Shaw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ken,

I run a BB1 on my 13 model 31 Buick with no issues. I tried to attach a pdf file which shows all the parts & adjustments for a BB1 carb., but the forum site will not accept it. Send a direct email to durcodude@comcast.net and I will forward it to you.

Make sure your carb gasket is slotted in an X pattern as shown on the third gasket in the pdf file. If not, make a slot to expose the hole in the carb flange to the vacuum inside the intake manifold. This slot provides vacuum to an internal spring loaded valve inside the carb.

I am not sure the gasket is your problem, but maybe some of the info on the pdf will help you troubleshoot adjustments etc. </div></div>

Mark,

I went back to the old gasket that had a similiar X pattern. The new gasket that the rebuider did have a slot in it but i figured I try the old one. He had warned me about using the wrong gasket.

[Friartuck]

Now that I'm enlightened on the individual cylinder configuration, I still have not seen where Ken performed a compression test and what were those results. Remember Ken reported a gradual loss of power and then it finally quit. I suppose another thought is did it jump time? Gears too do move and not just timing chains.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Friartuck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now that I'm enlightened on the individual cylinder configuration, I still have not seen where Ken performed a compression test and what were those results. Remember Ken reported a gradual loss of power and then it finally quit. I suppose another thought is did it jump time? Gears too do move and not just timing chains. </div></div>

The loss of power was not gradual. It just happened the day it died.

I did not have a proper adapter to do a compression test.

Seems tough for the gears to move as they are pinned and keyed.

[Stude17]

It appears that you have checked everything possible. I know this could be a long shot but does the engine fire when holding the starter down and stop when the starter is released? If so the battery feed to the ignition switch (ammeter)could be on the wrong side of the starter switch. Perhaps this could have happened when working on the engine.

[Guest simplyconnected]

Good suggestion, Merv. You're right. Get a meter and turn the key to "ON". Check for ignition coil voltage. If you have none, rewire the starter relay.

What about that "snap" action on your valves? They should close with smooth, deliberate, action. A snap indicates a bent valve, or something wrong with the guide. Are these valves hanging open? You may see lifters going up and down, but that doesn't mean your valves are closing. Did YOU do the valve job? Or did someone else do it?

Perform compression checks. That will tell your story real fast. Next, let us know what the spread is (the difference in compression between the highest and lowest compression check).

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: simplyconnected</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Good suggestion, Merv. You're right. Get a meter and turn the key to "ON". Check for ignition coil voltage. If you have none, rewire the starter relay.

What about that "snap" action on your valves? They should close with smooth, deliberate, action. A snap indicates a bent valve, or something wrong with the guide. Are these valves hanging open? You may see lifters going up and down, but that doesn't mean your valves are closing. Did YOU do the valve job? Or did someone else do it?

Perform compression checks. That will tell your story real fast. Next, let us know what the spread is (the difference in compression between the highest and lowest compression check). </div></div>

I did a valve job withthe help of an experience machinest. The valves are closing. The snapping close action was there when the car was running fine. The valves are perfect plus were in good shape when removed. Valves stems are easily seen from the outside plus you can see them by removing the port plugs. It's an L shape engine, but it doesn't have a head per say like a "modern" head.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Merv</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It appears that you have checked everything possible. I know this could be a long shot but does the engine fire when holding the starter down and stop when the starter is released? If so the battery feed to the ignition switch (ammeter)could be on the wrong side of the starter switch. Perhaps this could have happened when working on the engine. </div></div>

12V remains on the coil when key is turned. Plus ran 12V directly to coil to eliomate the ignition system.

[Stude17]

Thanks for the feed back. My other concern would be the modifications done to adapt the modern distributor. I know you have already done it but I would rechecking all the drive connections to make sure nothing has slipped or sheared. I think that in the circumstances I would be dismantling the whole lot of it and rebuilding it. Something might have slipped but is just tight enough to turn slowly. I'm sure that when you do find the problem whatever it is it will be a simple fix.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Merv</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks for the feed back. My other concern would be the modifications done to adapt the modern distributor. I know you have already done it but I would rechecking all the drive connections to make sure nothing has slipped or sheared. I think that in the circumstances I would be dismantling the whole lot of it and rebuilding it. Something might have slipped but is just tight enough to turn slowly. I'm sure that when you do find the problem whatever it is it will be a simple fix. </div></div>

Merv,

It's almost to that point I was heading in that direction but found nothing wrong. The 12 expert who rebuilds these cars, claims he has run into similiar issues and it's been a simple as a coil change even though the existing car was providing a seemingly good spark. I'm considering running new spark plug wires just to eliminate that parameter. I still need to find or make an adapter to do a compression check, but I doubt the way the engine constructed that could cause a starting issue...maybe a loss of power but not starting.

All I can say is I'm learning a lot though I tired of learning on this problem

[carbking]

Ken, look for one of the older compression gauges that has a tapered rubber insert.

You simply remove the spark plug, and hold the tapered end against the spark plug hole.

No adapter necessary.

Jon.

[oldiron]

Hey, Tbirdman; ,before you just change the sparkplug wires, check them with an ohmeter. Check also the coil wire; i.e. in fact check that first, because this would really affect the spark at all plugs. Further, while your at it, check the continuity of the entire ignition system. You did indicate that the original ignition system was replaced with a more modern adaptation. That's fine, but perform a complete diagnostic check of not only the individual components, condensor, coil , distributor internal wires to points..yada,yada,yada... the entire drill, also of the entire circuit while cranking.

Regards; Jerry Janson

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: oldiron</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey, Tbirdman; ,before you just change the sparkplug wires, check them with an ohmeter. Check also the coil wire; i.e. in fact check that first, because this would really affect the spark at all plugs. Further, while your at it, check the continuity of the entire ignition system. You did indicate that the original ignition system was replaced with a more modern adaptation. That's fine, but perform a complete diagnostic check of not only the individual components, condensor, coil , distributor internal wires to points..yada,yada,yada... the entire drill, also of the entire circuit while cranking.

Regards; Jerry Janson </div></div>

We have already checked the spark plug wires with an ohm meter. Also checked the correct firing order. Pretty much did what you suggested.

[Stude17]

Ok one last thought. There should be some sort of grounding wire for the distributor base plate. Is this wire intact with good, clean and tight connections to the distributor body which should also be earthed.

[F&J]

I just found the cure for a strange problem today. The car is an early Mustang that was damp-barn stored for 25 yrs.

The motor only turned 20 degrees by hand, due to rust on the cyl walls. I freed that all up without pulling the head. It took way too long for this one to finally fire, compared tp early cars stored since WW2.

Now the strange part; I ran it a bit each day to gain compression, but not too long due to not having the cooling system hooked up.

Then sometimes when it was somewhat hot, it would stall out and not even sputter while cranking. I re-cleaned the points, checked spark at plugs & main coil tower for spark. The spark was pretty good but once in a while it looked intermittant. I never suspected the coil because with some spark "most of the time", you would think it should try to go.. but not even a sputter.

I finally caught it late today; I had power to the coil a long time and noticed I just lost all spark at the coil lead. I put on a new=old aftermarket coil, andf it's perfect now. Sorry for the long post, but I would have bet the bank that the coil was not the problem.

[1929Chrysler]

Did you find the proper adapter to do a compression test? If so, what were the results?? I think it's an important question to answer.

Dan

[oldiron]

Ken, Dan is right, we never heard about compression. On the other hand, get it checked, then assuming you have compression,with evrything properly hooked up; i.e. you said you tested all electrical components and connections.Well, lets see what kind of spark you get then. With a spark plug about 3/8 of an inch from the block, crank the engine with the hand cranki.e. this will eliminate any undue electrical draw from the starter motor. A good hot spark will jump the gap. If no spark, you'll have to go back and look again for the problem, but this is a sure way of determing enough spark,(current) at the plug.If youmust recheck things look not just for broken or loose wires at the switch and on the battery, and battery ground connections; but again, also on the connections on the coil,the distributor, the timer. Remember also, with a weak spark, look to the battery, test the coil, coil wire, the ignition resister and the condenser.