Antique car, 1927-28 Paige 8-85 Straightaway 5 passenger sedan , not mine.

[Xander Wildeisen]

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/568822375805901/?ref=browse_tab

Edited Monday at 01:49 PM by Xander Wildeisen (see edit history)

[58L-Y8]

Good Heavens, Guys!!!  This is a real rarity!!!  1927-'28 Paige 8-85 Straightaway Eight sedan, 5-passenger, 298.6 ci straight eight, Lycoming 4H, 131.5" wb $2,355.   This series transitioned into the 1928 Graham-Paige 835 after the chassis was lengthened to 137" and a Continental 13K 322 ci straight eight substituted.  Versions of the Lycoming 4H were also used by Auburn 8-88, Elcar 8-91, 8-92, Gardner 90 & 95, Locomobile 8-80, maybe others that don't come to mind just now.

 

Someone, go get this rarity!!!

[Xander Wildeisen]

Always great info 58L-Y8.

[Xander Wildeisen]

Seller states Jewitt, is that a model? Or separate car manufacturer?

[cjmarzoli]

Rare car for sure.  Does not look that large (131.5" wb large)   Wonder where the seller got the idea it was a Jewett?

[cjmarzoli]

Just now, Xander Wildeisen said:

Seller states Jewitt, is that a model? Or separate car manufacturer?

I think Jewett was a lower end companion brand at one point.

[58L-Y8]

Jewetts were the lower-priced, smaller companion car Paige Motor Co. built from 1922-27 sold by Paige dealerships.  Harry Jewett was the president of Paige Motor co.  The data plate may still have Jewett listed so the seller assumed that's what this car is but it's much larger and there were no eight-cylinder Jewetts, only sixes.

[Xander Wildeisen]

So is asking price correct? Rarity does not equal value. Price looks fair to me, when you compare it to other cars on the market.

[cjmarzoli]

18 minutes ago, Xander Wildeisen said:

So is asking price correct? Rarity does not equal value. Price looks fair to me, when you compare it to other cars on the market.

A lot depends on the condition of the things we can't see (aka interior) and how many parts are accounted for or missing.  (headlamps, incorrect hubcaps,etc.)    Price doesn't seem like crazy starting point.

[alsancle]

Steve,  you beat me to it.  Neat car and never ever seen.

[Malo48]

If anyone is seriously interested I am happy to go put eyes on it as I'm close to where this ad claims to be located.

[58L-Y8]

Just now, alsancle said:

Steve,  you beat me to it.  Neat car and never ever seen.

A.J.  

I could hardly believe it when I first saw it, though the hood looked unusually long and the top rather low for a garden-variety two door sedan.  Then I noticed the small 'shoulder' on the hood and radiator shell and the Lycoming straight eight confirmed it.  This Paige is the very definition of a unicorn.  That looks to be a Graham-Paige hubcap on the right front. Hope it finds safe harbor with a new owner who realizes how rare and unique it is.

Steve

[cjmarzoli]

Found this page- some good info:  https://www.wcroberts.org/Paige_History/1927_Paige.html

[Xander Wildeisen]

So that is another good example of how a car is listed for sale can hinder a persons ability to find it on the market. If you were looking for a car like this, don’t think you will start your search by typing in “antique car”.

[classiclines]

Agree it's a rare car - but the auto literature for a 8-85, 5-passenger sedan shows 4 doors.  This car only has 2 doors.  Having trouble finding any literature describing this configuration - thus it must be rare - we need an expert on the marque to weigh in...

 

[Xander Wildeisen]

I only located pictures of a 8-85 sedan. Could not find any pictures of the 5 passenger, two door sedan.

[Xander Wildeisen]

Is this one a 6?

[cjmarzoli]

I could not find a photo or drawing of a 2 door sedan or Coach either.   I found an ad that presumably shows all the body styles and there was no 2 door sedan shown.  The styling of the roofline looks lower and rounder than the 4 doors.    Almost looks chopped.  Could it be a modified or custom job?  Perhaps the vinyl roof is to hide the modifications?

[58L-Y8]

9 minutes ago, cjmarzoli said:

I could not find a photo or drawing of a 2 door sedan or Coach either.   I found an ad that presumably shows all the body styles and there was no 2 door sedan shown.  The styling of the roofline looks lower and rounder than the 4 doors.    Almost looks chopped.  Could it be a modified or custom job?  Perhaps the vinyl roof is to hide the modifications?

I've researched the available body styles today as well, no two-door sedan is listed anywhere except for 5-passenger Brougham in the 6-45 and 6-65 series.  It makes me wonder what the wheelbase is, it doesn't look to be 131.5" which the 8-85's are spec'd.  The next step down the Models was the 6-75 on the 125" wb.   Perhaps this 8-85 is a custom that came together at the transition time of the Graham Brothers takeover.  The mystery thickens...

[cjmarzoli]

32 minutes ago, 58L-Y8 said:

I've researched the available body styles today as well, no two-door sedan is listed anywhere except for 5-passenger Brougham in the 6-45 and 6-65 series.  It makes me wonder what the wheelbase is, it doesn't look to be 131.5" which the 8-85's are spec'd.  The next step down the Models was the 6-75 on the 125" wb.   Perhaps this 8-85 is a custom that came together at the transition time of the Graham Brothers takeover.  The mystery thickens...

I agree that the car for sale does not appear to be a car sized with a 131.5" WB.  Looks more like 118-120" to me.  Could someone have stuffed an 8 cyl in one of the smaller models?  I suppose it's entirely possible.

[Gearheadengineer]

51 minutes ago, cjmarzoli said:

Could someone have stuffed an 8 cyl in one of the smaller models? 

The original muscle car!! 😄

[wayne sheldon]

Those wire wheels are not correct for a 1927/'28 Paige any model. The hood looks like it isn't fitting properly to the radiator. The body belt lines look about right for Paige in 1927. The roof lines and windshield don't look quite right compared with other models I am more familiar with.

I would sure like to know who the body builder was. My 1927 6-45 has a Briggs body.

 

 

12 hours ago, Xander Wildeisen said:

Is this one a 6?

 

The photos aren't very good, that could be either a 1926 Jewett or 1927 Paige 6-40 or 6-45 (they are very similar on the outside). Both are six cylinder cars.

 

The Paige 8-85 was introduced late in the 1927 model year, while the Paige Detroit automobile company was being sold to the Graham Brothers that had just received a big payoff from Dodge Brothers being sold to Chrysler. They had been building trucks to sell through Dodge dealers for several years and wanted to move up to manufacturing quality automobiles. 

The Paige 8-85 was manufactured for less than a year both as one of the last Paige models, and the early 1928 "Paige Graham Built" models.

 

A very good friend has a neighbor that has a Paige 8-85 four door sedan. A solid mostly original car with a bad 1950s paint job (beautiful original interior).

That one, and only maybe two others are the only Paige 8-85s I have ever seen in person, in all the years of my being interested in Paige automobiles.

 

 

This one? There is a lot obviously wrong on it, coupled with doubts about the interior and body origins, but if the body is correct for the car it could maybe be restored into a fine and maybe one of one car.

[29PierceArrow]

Would it be worth buying this car just to get the engine?

[58L-Y8]

15 minutes ago, 29PierceArrow said:

Would it be worth buying this car just to get the engine?

Yes. but it would obliterate one more of the rarest. most obscure cars from automotive history.  Not something to be done thoughtlessly now.

[29PierceArrow]

I agree with you, but, I don't see anyone stepping up to buy this car to restore it. I own a restoration shop here in Madison, WI and restore prewar cars everyday.

We all know that the cost to bring this car back to it's glory would be over $100K; and when you're all done 3 years from now, it would be worth $30K. I went to see this car yesterday. Trust me, the only thing worth saving is the engine and drive train. Interior is a disaster, gauges are missing and the radiator core is completely shot.

I have a speedster I'm building with this same Lycoming 8. True it has different components and distributor and head, etc. but maybe the internal block would be the same?

Edited 19 hours ago by 29PierceArrow
typo (see edit history)

[Xander Wildeisen]

It is a dead old car. I can’t imagine you went there thinking the interior would be in mint condition. It will take a Paige fan to save it. It is always nice to hear original unrestored cars are still viewed as possible donor cars for their parts. Kind of puts to rest the argument about modifying a car. It will live on in some form, time will tell what that is. This would be a good car to place alongside the Packard convertible coupe in a barn find museum display.

[cjmarzoli]

28 minutes ago, 29PierceArrow said:

I agree with you, but, I don't see anyone stepping up to buy this car to restore it. I own a restoration shop here in Madison, WI and restore prewar cars everyday.

We all know that the cost to bring this car back to it's glory would be over $100K; and we you're all done 3 years from now, it would be worth $30K. I went to see this car yesterday. Trust me, the only thing worth saving is the engine and drive train. Interior is a disaster, gauges are missing and the radiator core is completely shot.

I have a speedster I'm building with this same Lycoming 8. True it has different components and distributor and head, etc. but maybe the internal block would be the same?

Since you saw it in the flesh, were you able to positively ID exactly what year/model/ body style it was?  Data plate info?

[29PierceArrow]

The data plate was gone from the firewall. Owner doesn't know the year. He just called me to ask if I had made a decision; I have not. The car is 45 minutes from where I live up near the Wisconsin Dells. I'm thinking about it, hard.                  Tom Griffith  lincoln1955@msn.com   griffithvintagemotorcars.com

 

[rydersclassics]

Take the drive Tom!

 

Take pictures and measure the wheelbase.

This thing has good proportions for a 27-28. Does the roof look lower that the other models or is it the dark fabric giving the look?

 

       

 

[Xander Wildeisen]

It is definitely different from other ones pictured. And does deserve a dive into its history. Could be a real find.

[29PierceArrow]

He told me this morning that the roof has been lowered.

[alsancle]

41 minutes ago, 29PierceArrow said:

He told me this morning that the roof has been lowered.

That explains why it looks so cool.

[58L-Y8]

While this Paige 8-85 may be an 'invention' from a variety of sources, before consigning it to parts donor status, it needs to be investigated in detail.  If it's a Paige 8-85 powertrain in a Paige 6-75 125" wb chassis, its proportions still argue for a speedster project simply because there are plenty of such Auburns already.  Now, let the brick bats fly...I'll just duck when they do!

[Xander Wildeisen]

Might just be a rare parts car.🤔

[Loco 90]

Regarding the engine in the OP, it does not look anything like the Lycoming 4H in my 1927 Locomobile. The valves are on the other side and the cylinders are bolted to the crankcase for openers. Very interesting car indeed.

[29PierceArrow]

Here's some pics I took yesterday. Wierd looking carburetor. Can someone help identify the year of this motor. I'm considering buying it.

 

Tom Griffith    lincoln1955@msn.com

[edinmass]

I bet it sells for the engine to go into another obscure car………

[58L-Y8]

Studying the photos, Paige would not have let this type of hack work out of the factory.  It appears to be the section of the steering mechanism to the pitman arm exposed outside the hood with a notch cut in the hood.

[29PierceArrow]

Yes, I noticed that too. Someone cut out the metal around the steering box to put in a larger one at some point.

[58L-Y8]

@29PierceArrowCan someone help identify the year of this motor.?

 

The book The Graham Legacy: Graham-Paige to 1932 by Michael E. Keller, Serial Numbers and Mechanical Specifications, page 208:

1927-'28 Paige Model 85, Lycoming 4H: 1927 Series Nos. 500001-501400; 1928 Series Nos. 501401-finis.  No location noted.

 

Appendix F list body suppliers for 1927 as Briggs, Murray, Central and Robbins.

 

Subsequent to seeing these telltale modifications and noting a Graham-Paige hubcap on the right front wheel, this might also be a later Graham-Paige chassis if any chassis identification numbers can be found stamped on it.  

Edited 12 hours ago by 58L-Y8
addendum comments (see edit history)