1926 torque tube removal

[westaus29]

What are the steps involved in removing the torque tube from a 1926 Buick Master model 45? From what I can see posted here you have to move the rear axle back? I also dont know how or where best to disconnect the front end from the gearbox where I presume there is a uni joint. My experience is with Chrysler setup which is quite different.

Edited July 9, 2022 by westaus29 (see edit history)

[Oregon Desert model 45]

Do yourself a big favor and order a Shop Manual reprint for 1926 Master before tearing the car apart.  These can be found on e-bay.  All typical mechanical maintenance procedures and settings are listed.   Rear Axle removal is on page 60

The front end of the torque tube has 4 bolts just behind the universal joint. 

[Oldtech]

The torque tube is basically part of the whole rear axel assembly. Is it the complete rear end you wish to remove? the driveshaft removes from the rear after the diff is removed. 

[Morgan Wright]

19 hours ago, Oldtech said:

The torque tube is basically part of the whole rear axel assembly. Is it the complete rear end you wish to remove? the driveshaft removes from the rear after the diff is removed. 

It looks like he just wants to pull it back. Maybe fix the clutch or tranny. If that's true he can leave the rear end attached.

 

The above instructions in that case would not be necessary, removing the axle shafts, remove third member (torque tube) from rear axle. No need to do that.

 

I would say:

 

1. Disconnect brake rods in the back

2. Jack rear of car up and put body of car on solid stands, wheels in the air

3. Remove rear end from springs so axle drops and wheels on ground

4. Remove bolts holding torque ball to torque tube, and bolts holding drive shaft to universal

5. Block or strap front of car so it won't move, strap rear axle and pull it back a foot or two, brace front of torque tube because it will drop.

.

.

 

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Morgan Wright (see edit history)

[Oldtech]

Westaus29, what are you actually repairing ?

[Rod Wise]

Remove the rear tires,  Then you don,t need to lift the back of the car as high  when you are rolling the axle out.

[27donb]

9 hours ago, Rod Wise said:

Remove the rear tires,  Then you don,t need to lift the back of the car as high  when you are rolling the axle out.

 

Exactly!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 10, 2022 by 27donb (see edit history)

[westaus29]

Thanks for the replies, for some reason I am not getting notification. They give me a good idea how to proceed, if that is the preferred route. The 26 Master belongs to an elderly mate who can't find his shop manual. The problem is the ring gear and pinion lost teeth, possibly due to the pinion coming loose, not sure as I was not there when the diff was disassembled. Then the old ring gear and pinion were "lost", together with the half case and bearing attached to the ring gear.

We have picked up what we think is an early 24 Master third member and diff assembly but cannot just swap the diff as the 24 ring gear and its bearings are smaller diameter and do not fit in the 26 third member and adapter bearings do not seem to be available. The 24 third member looks to be same design and length as the 26 so we are thinking about swapping in the 24 third member and diff so we can at least get the car mobile and off the car hoist. So the consensus of your advice is the back axle assembly has to be moved back. Appreciate the various suggestions on best way to do it. Wish it wasn't so heavy as am not getting any younger.

Useful comments welcomed.

[Oregon Desert model 45]

Buick made multiple changes to rear axle between 1924 and 1928 so very few parts remained unchanged in those years. 

If the third member fits into the axle housing then this might work.  Wheel bearings also changed so 1924-1925 wheels will not 1926-1928 axle and vice versa.  Check pinion bearings for wear.  Buick used commonly available bearing sizes and good quality NOS bearings are available.  Adjust the bevel gears for correct contact according to the Shop Manual or somebody will be repeating this exercise again.   If the shop manual can't be found, then order another one.  It will easily pay for itself in grief avoidance and save you some cussing. 

[Oldtech]

I think the unit will interchange ok. Only problem may be getting the 26 wheels on the 24 axle. But I've never done it so just surmising. 

[Oregon Desert model 45]

Double row ball bearing #5310 on left is 1924-25 rear wheel (120" wb),  single row ball bearing #1310 on right is common to 1926 1927 1928 (120" wb).   It may be possible to swap the rear hub, but this won't be necessary if the original rear axle housing is used. 

Edited July 14, 2022 by Oregon Desert model 45
edit (see edit history)

[westaus29]

Thanks guys, the plan is to keep the 26 rear axle assembly and swap out the third member and diff gears. Need to check pinion shaft and rear axles are compatible. Not ideal but could get us mobile.

 

The bearings I had problems finding are the differential ball bearings, part 5.536. The 26 is ND 3720 and the 24 is ND 210 which is smaller od. I could not find modern equivalents.

[Oregon Desert model 45]

I believe that modern equivalent of  210 is 3210, which when searched on bearingfinder results in 6210 with identical size.  

According to the 1916-1932 Master Parts List, the same 55" pinion shaft is common to Model 45 for 1924 1925 1926.   

Main Axle shaft (33") for Model 45 remained unchanged from 1921 through 1928

 

[westaus29]

Thanks for the confirmation on pinion shaft and axle, just have to check actual dimensions before proceeding. I agree the 6210 has correct dimensions of 50mm id and 90mm od and fits the 24 diff which is good news as one bearing is rusty.

 

The 26 diff ball bearings have od 93+mm and funnily enough a search on 3720 comes up with an imperial taper roller bearing of 3.6718 inch od or 93.26mm but can't find similar size ball bearings. Maybe possible to swap from ball to roller? Not an issue as do not have parts for 26 diff anyway.

[Hubert_25-25]

The first photo is of the torque ball and the torque tube on a 1925 Buick Standard.  On the Master, you have a vinyl boot around the torque ball.  Your mission is to separate the torque tube by removing only the 4 bolts.  Do not remove the 6 bolts, as that is the torque ball, and you can leave that alone.  With the 4 bolts removed, it looks like photo 2 (which is a 1926 Buick Master).  The torque tube just slides in.  Mine was stuck, so do not despair.  Just pull harder.  We used a 2 x 4 for leverage.  If the 4 bolts are removed, and you have removed the brake rod clevis pins and the 8 spring shackle bolts, the rear axle just needs to move to the rear.   Good idea to remove the tires.      Hugh

[westaus29]

Thanks Hugh, confirms what we have to do. Have checked 26 axles and they fit the 24 diff centre. The 24 and 26 third member bodies are same length, 53-3/4 inches. The 24 pinion shaft  is 55 inches and 26 should be same but we are struggling to get it out to check as it is stuck at gearbox end. Tomorrow we will make a slide hammer to free it up. The 6210 bearings for the diff are readily available locally and pinion bearings are good. Still cant find the shop manual and have decided to proceed without as shipping to Aus is twice cost of manual and takes about 4 weeks.

[Hubert_25-25]

Some notes from when I had my differential open.   This is a Standard so I do not know how much it differs from the Master.    Hugh

 

 

[Oldtech]

Unfortunately, standard and master rears are totally different. standard is a 3/4 float with a 2 gear spider, roller bearings. The Master has a full floater with ball bearings and a 4 gear spider. Much better!

In true Buick form the look sort-of similar from the outside.

[westaus29]

Thanks everyone for the advice, followed it all except buying the manual and wish I had remembered to do so. We have the old torque tube out and the new one in, but cannot get the pinion shaft splines to slide into the back of the gearbox. Body is up on stands and the rear axle is moving freely on its rims but the @#$%^ shaft won't go into the gearbox uni joint. Suggestions requested. In the meantime I am going to double check that the splines on the new 1924 master shaft are same as the one we took out, which was 26 master. And I am going to order a manual. We are thinking about taking the universal housing off the back of the gearbox to see if that helps us line up the shaft but unsure what that would unleash.

[Rock10]

I had trouble getting ours to line back up.

You have to get the splines in the right place and the right angle.

I finally got the floor jack under the rear end at the right height while I was putting pressure on the come along and slightly rotating the shaft by hand until it popped in.

[EmTee]

Definitely check the splines.  Not sure why, but there could possibly be a 'key' where one spline is wider than the rest.  You may also try modifying a couple of bolts (i.e., cut off the heads) to act as alignment pins.

[Oregon Desert model 45]

Master Parts List book shows the 55" pinion shaft assembly as unchanged for years 1924 through 1926 so it should fit.

If the spline end got banged against something hard, there could be a raised burr on the spline that is preventing it from engaging into the universal.  Check for burrs or dings and file where necessary.   I had a lot of difficulty removing the universal joint and housing.  If I recall correctly, it required a puller and lot of hammering with mallet to get that apart, so would not recommend this.  

[westaus29]

Thanks guys, that is reassuring. I was pretty sure I had done all the checking but I don't recall actually test fitting the spline. We have pulled the axle back a few inches and dropped the end of the torque tube so I can thoroughly check the spline for fit. We will then try a heavier pull.

[Rock10]

Getting the angle right was the big problem.

[westaus29]

Finally had time to tackle this methodically with my son-in-law. Cleaned up the end of the spline, lined everything up then pulled the assembly into place with a comealong. Didn't need force just slid in smoothly and the axle housing also slid into place in the spring trunnions.

Thanks again for the advice. By the way I now have a manual and it explains the strip down process well but does not state diff oil capacity. Plan is to use Penrite Transoil 140 API GL1

[Buick35]

On 11/17/2022 at 7:45 AM, EmTee said:

Definitely check the splines.  Not sure why, but there could possibly be a 'key' where one spline is wider than the rest.  You may also try modifying a couple of bolts (i.e., cut off the heads) to act as alignment pins.

It was long ago but I think I remember my 35s had a keyed spline.

Edited February 23, 2023 by Buick35
Spell (see edit history)

[Oldtech]

Oil capacity is fill to the plug. My memory says no keyed splines on 26.