Alabama 36 dodge sedan rebirth

[Draconarmy]

Picked up a 36 dodge yesterday( was told it was a 38).  Engine seems to be a 51 Plymouth( engine of plate is blank) and the interior is gutted.  Lots of work to do but it was free so no complaints. Serial number appears to be 4266181 (plate on passenger A pillar).  Fuel tank is crushed and exhaust is mostly corrugated pipe. Exterior sheeting is mostly sound with some work needed on floor pan, rocker panels and running boards roof had a tree limb fall on it and the insert seal is growing grass now.  PO has four modern spare tires on it (doughnuts). Engine seems to be seized, can't seem to spin it by hand so full rebuild seems in order

 

Much to most of y'all's dismay I will probably be using mostly reproduction parts to safeguard my bank accounts and marriage.

[JACK M]

Good score !!

Did it come with a title?

Proof of ownership is the first step.

 

I just got to thinking, Alabama does something different than titles. Is it a transferable registration or the likes?

[Draconarmy]

Already taking care of this. Alabama doesn't do titles on cars older than 1974. Registration is relatively easy especially since the last car tag it had was 1969

[JACK M]

I bought a car out of Alabama 20 or so years ago and recall the no title thing.

Here in Oregon one better have a title or all it will be is a parts car.

Fortunately for me the OR DMV has the book and I don't recall any problems getting title.

I did have trouble getting a New York car to go thru. I used the 'go to different office' trick and it went thru.

There are many guys on here with 36 Dodges. You will find answers to any questions you may have.

[jpage]

Congrats on your purchase! Looks like you have a long road to travel! Where are you located? I've been working on my '36 Dodge for about 30 years now! I see that the car looks to have a good grille assy., parts that are really hard to find in good condition! Be careful with it as a good grille center could run upwards of $2000.00! Don't expect to find a large selection of repro parts for these cars like you can for Ford or Chevy. What body panels are available are expensive and from my experience, not accurately made and require a good bit of reworking to fit. Many of the mechanical parts are still available and can still be had locally if you do some digging. If you're serious about restoring this car, I suggest that you purchase a Motor's Manual and a Dodge Master Maintenance manual for reference. Don't be afraid to ask questions on the forum as there are a few guys that really know these cars. I do happen to have a good roof insert and the top sides if you should need them, much of the body trim, and can guide you on parts and services. I can also rebuild the front door window channels and beltstrips and have patterns for many of the interior parts. Steele Rubber has the best quality rubber parts, but at a price and not all fit as well as the might! Restoration Specialties has many of the body side moulding clips but not all, as some are no longer available. If you need help or have questions, please feel free to message me anytime. Have fun!

[Draconarmy]

I'm in central Alabama

 

[Draconarmy]

First solid day wrenching on the dodge. We have affectionately started referring to her as Oscar the grouch due to the coating of lichen.  She will eventually be known as Betsy the beautiful.

 Started out by putting her on stands, moved on to removing spark plugs so I could use some marvel mystery oil in the cylinders. Those plugs took more than a healthy dose of PB blaster and some "gentle" (read 4 foot cheater bar) to break free. Moved under to drain the oil.  No water or sludge ( thank God) but the oil had a noticeable red tint. 

 

Is that normal for older style oils?

 

Due to the engine being much newer I couldn't reach through the crank hole to try to spin it so I began removing bolts holding the radiator to get to the crankshaft pulley.  Several hours half a propane can and two drilled out bolts it's free.  Got dark as I started to pull the water pump to get the clearance to pull the radiator so that's where I left off until tomorrow. 

 

Biggest take away from today is a reminder of how much I hate flat head screws (yes I will put them back)

 

[Ron Lawson]

That's  a good boy The "Screw Detective" will soon let you know if you use the wrong ones 

[jpage]

Good one Ron! Incidentally, there were no Phillips head screws used in '36 Dodge production. How's that for "detective" work!   Happy New Year!

[Draconarmy]

Update: got the radiator out still no luck spinning the engine so removed water pump then head. Lots of scale on piston heads and valves.  Filled cylinders with marvel oil to try and leak down.  In the meantime began removing carb and minifold to get at the valve springs. Carb came off relatively easy and will need to be rebuilt, being seized up at the throttle linkage. Took apart the fuel bowl and cleaned the glass with viniger ( went from red brown to crystal clear).  Removed every bolt I could find holding the manifold but it won't break free.  Any idea what could be holding it other than the studs?  Sorry forgot to take any pictures

[keiser31]

1 hour ago, Draconarmy said:

Update: got the radiator out still no luck spinning the engine so removed water pump then head. Lots of scale on piston heads and valves.  Filled cylinders with marvel oil to try and leak down.  In the meantime began removing carb and minifold to get at the valve springs. Carb came off relatively easy and will need to be rebuilt, being seized up at the throttle linkage. Took apart the fuel bowl and cleaned the glass with viniger ( went from red brown to crystal clear).  Removed every bolt I could find holding the manifold but it won't break free.  Any idea what could be holding it other than the studs?  Sorry forgot to take any pictures

Look for any bolts/nuts on the motor side of the manifold.

[Draconarmy]

2 hours ago, keiser31 said:

Look for any bolts/nuts on the motor side of the manifold.

Looking at pictures online I think I figured it out, got the 4 obvious ones from exhaust, and 4 obvious ones from intake.  There's 2more right between the two right under the carb.  Too dark to fight it tonight but at least I can quit beating my head against the wall

[jpage]

The B and B carb is not the correct carb for that car. it used a Stromberg EXV-2, which will work better than the B&B.

[Draconarmy]

5 minutes ago, jpage said:

The B and B carb is not the correct carb for that car. it used a Stromberg EXV-2, which will work better than the B&B.

That's because that's not the original engine. Engine is a 51 carb seems to be of the same year

[jpage]

Sorry, I think you did mention that! My bad.

[vette-kid]

Nice find!  Not a lot of parts available for these you will find.   But a few members here dabble in making parts.   If you need one I can make a steering column grommet (fairly sure the P2 and D2 are the same there), I still have the mold I used for mine. 

[36 D2 Coupe]

Removing the manifold can be difficult if the two studs that go THROUGH the manifold are swelled with rust. The exhaust manifold on my '36 was broken that way. To get the rust out from around the studs others have suggested finding a piece of tubing that JUST fits over the stud, cut some teeth on it, spin it with a drill and see if it will chew the rust away and release the manifold.  Better than trying to find a new manifold. Incidentally does your intake manifold attach to the exhaust manifold with through bolts or is it  fastened with bolts that pass up through the exhaust manifold and thread into the intake manifold? if it is the latter, be VERY careful trying to take it apart. I broke off 3 of the 4 bolts on mine and it was not fun removing the broken studs. 

Best of luck with your new project. Ask lots of questions and we'll try to help you.

[Draconarmy]

On 1/4/2022 at 6:54 PM, 36 D2 Coupe said:

Removing the manifold can be difficult if the two studs that go THROUGH the manifold are swelled with rust. The exhaust manifold on my '36 was broken that way. To get the rust out from around the studs others have suggested finding a piece of tubing that JUST fits over the stud, cut some teeth on it, spin it with a drill and see if it will chew the rust away and release the manifold.  Better than trying to find a new manifold. Incidentally does your intake manifold attach to the exhaust manifold with through bolts or is it  fastened with bolts that pass up through the exhaust manifold and thread into the intake manifold? if it is the latter, be VERY careful trying to take it apart. I broke off 3 of the 4 bolts on mine and it was not fun removing the broken studs. 

Best of luck with your new project. Ask lots of questions and we'll try to help you.

Looks to me like there are two bolts holding the exhaust manifold to the intake, and two knobs on the back.  Those came off without incident.  But with one bolt each manifold, I'm stuck. One is behind the intake holding exhaust and I seem to have rounded out the front side bolt between them.

[Draconarmy]

In other news after much archeology work I managed to unearth and remove the oilpan bolts.  Pan seems sound( think it was protected by shell of grease and dirt).  Tomorrow I will start removing connecting rod clamps to see if that will help me free the engine. Counting from front of the engine, cylinders 3, 5 and 6 will not leak down so are most likely cause of the stick.

 

Can the pistons be lifted out of the top of the engine without damaging anything?

[JACK M]

1 hour ago, Draconarmy said:

Can the pistons be lifted out of the top of the engine without damaging anything?

You can, check for excessive ring ridge. That would be the ridge right at the top of the bore.

There is a tool to remove that. Dont try to push the piston out if you feel a ridge.

[JACK M]

You might not be able to get them all out if you cant turn the crankshaft.

 

[jpage]

Make sure to mark you caps by cyl. and position. Good luck!

 

[Hudsy Wudsy]

If you force the pistons out before removing that ridge on the top of the cylinder wall, you'll likely crack the ring "lands". Those are the grooves in the pistons where the rings fit. 

[Draconarmy]

Made some progress pulling everything off the engine, with hopes of freeing it up. Removed head starter manifolds( only destroyed one manifold bolt) valve covers and oil pan.  Filled each cylinder with marvel mystery oil, 1,2 and four leaked down successfully other didn't.  Tried to turn engine by both the harmonic balancer and flywheel, even tried taping each piston with hammer and block of wood while wife kept pressure on the harmonic balancer.  I'm resisting the urge to undo the pistons from the crank and try to push them out the top.  Not sure what to do next.

Edited January 25, 2022 by Draconarmy (see edit history)

[JACK M]

From previous discussions, The best penetrant is 50-50 ATF and acetone.

MMO is good, but you have already tried that.

[Draconarmy]

Finally had some good weather, so I got out and tried some more to free the engine with no luck. Did however figure out that the lip at the top of the cylinders was actually a brass shim/gasket.  With that figured out I set about removing cylinders through the top of the engine.  1 and 2 (counting from the front) can't be removed as they sit due to the connecting rods not being able to clear the block with the crankshaft in it's current position. 4 came out with little persuasion. 3,5 and 6 are stuck tight so I poured ATF/acetone solution in the cylinders covers over with aluminum foil and secured with a Bungie cord to prevent the acetone from evaporating.  

 

I then switched gears to cleaning out the cab.  As I suspected the seat springs are roached.  What I thought was the rear seat bucket turned out to be the front( add that to list of parts to procure).  After about an hour of vacuuming ( had to dump the thing twice). I finally got a good look at the floor pan and it's in much better shape than I had hoped.  Will need to fabricate a new battery box is all.

[jpage]

Looks like you have your work cut out for you. My cars looked like yours when I got them. It's gonna be a long road! Looks like the front seat pan is in useable condition and the towboards look fair. You'll know more when you get them cleaned up. Looks like the left rear floor might have issues. New floor pans are available but are pretty pricy and may need some work to get them to fit. Looks like you're missing some of the door check straps. I have patterns for the firewall pad and trunk back board along with the kick pads if you're interested, or I can make those for you. The original fastening hardware for the door panels is available from Restoration Specialties in Pa. Tricky to install but worth the effort. The dash knobs are not available new and are hard to find: I had new ones made by a steering wheel caster, again they were hard to replicate. There is also a box like cover that goes over the battery hole in the floor and fits in that large hole in the seat base. I have parts for the seat adjusters if needed, trim parts and a good many small parts too. Don't forget that I have that whole roof section too. If you have questions or need help finding parts, please let me know. These are great cars but are hard to restore, not impossible, just hard! If you haven't already, try to find a copy of a Motor's manual that covers your year and a copy of the 1936 Dodge Master Maintenance Manual. These books have a lot of important information in them! I also rebuild the window channels, front and rear in the front doors.  If I were you, I'd stay away from ebay for parts as much as I could. Prices are outrageous, many parts are wrong and there are several guys on the forum who can help you out at fairer prices. Good luck on your restoration! 

[R.Dan Herrera]

High Jim how’s your project coming ? I just was reading the posts between yourself and draconarmy who evidently has a D2 project in motion.this is super bowl Sunday and I find myself with time to peruse some more dodge subjects.it interesting that more of these cars are being appreciated and taken to task. I don’t know if you saw the add in Hemings Dec. ‘21 issue for a 36 sedan in New Mexico in original condition.well I drove out to see it and ended up putting a deposit on the 16,000 asking price.so now I am going to have more than one but this car won’t need much work as it has only 11,492 miles . I checked it out thoroughly and drove it to make sure of its integrity .It belongs to a 94 year old guy who only drove it in parades or to local car shows but now wanted to sell.it looks just like the black one I owned in my twenties.well I will have to sell the other car eventually but first things first and that’s to get the car home.i will send some pictures .take care ,Dan

[MarkVA]

Greetings fellow '36 D2 enthusiasts.  I stumbled on your exchanges yesterday in search of something else.  But I've read your entries with great interest. 

A couple of years ago I purchased a "barn find" '36 that had reportedly been in storage on a farm in Nebraska since '74.  Before trailoring the car halfway across the country back to Virginia, I was told the engine was free and would turn (it didn't btw).  Overall I'd say the body is extremely solid, but the interior is shot.  And realistically, it was a worn out car in '74 that's been parked in a barn for nearly 50 years.

Apparently my car must be photogenic as the pictures enhance the condition.  All the same, I've enjoyed puttering and gradually making progress. 

My aim isn't a show car.  I've been focused on getting all the mechanicals in driveable shape and then starting on the cosmetics.  

I have lots of questions/needs, but since I've posted a couple of photos, I have been looking for the grill cross pieces (for lack of a better way to describe them), and the small stainless moulding piece on the passenger side between the front door and the side of the hood.  

All comments... suggestions most welcomed.   --and kudos Draconarmy, great progress, keep at it, very inspiring!

[jpage]

Those short trim pieces can be a real bugger to find. Looks like you're also missing the 8 cross piece trim bars for the grille sides and a door handle. Give Ron Lyons a call at 713-805-3949, he may be of some help.

[36Dodge_redo]

On 4/18/2022 at 2:04 PM, MarkVA said:

Greetings fellow '36 D2 enthusiasts.  I stumbled on your exchanges yesterday in search of something else.  But I've read your entries with great interest. 

A couple of years ago I purchased a "barn find" '36 that had reportedly been in storage on a farm in Nebraska since '74.  Before trailoring the car halfway across the country back to Virginia, I was told the engine was free and would turn (it didn't btw).  Overall I'd say the body is extremely solid, but the interior is shot.  And realistically, it was a worn out car in '74 that's been parked in a barn for nearly 50 years.

Apparently my car must be photogenic as the pictures enhance the condition.  All the same, I've enjoyed puttering and gradually making progress. 

My aim isn't a show car.  I've been focused on getting all the mechanicals in driveable shape and then starting on the cosmetics.  

I have lots of questions/needs, but since I've posted a couple of photos, I have been looking for the grill cross pieces (for lack of a better way to describe them), and the small stainless moulding piece on the passenger side between the front door and the side of the hood.  

All comments... suggestions most welcomed.   --and kudos Draconarmy, great progress, keep at it, very inspiring!

Mark, where in VA are you?  I am just getting started on a D2 as well.  I am in Northern VA.