1964 425 nailhead engine and transmission

[my first riv]

I have searched high and low and can find no comparable info. I recently bought a 64 parts car that has a 114k on engine and trans, the guy I bought it from had a guy that's interested in the engine and trans. He offered $600 for the pair and the seller gave me the guys contact info. The engine was running with a new starter but has sat so will need a little tinkering to get it running again. My question is, is that a good price or does that seem a bit on the low side for a hard to find engine and trans combo? I'm not trying to pay for my kids college with this sale but also want a fair price for what I have.

[gungeey]

sounds fair

[DAVES89]

1 hour ago, my first riv said:

I have searched high and low and can find no comparable info. I recently bought a 64 parts car that has a 114k on engine and trans, the guy I bought it from had a guy that's interested in the engine and trans. He offered $600 for the pair and the seller gave me the guys contact info. The engine was running with a new starter but has sat so will need a little tinkering to get it running again. My question is, is that a good price or does that seem a bit on the low side for a hard to find engine and trans combo? I'm not trying to pay for my kids college with this sale but also want a fair price for what I have.

I just checked www.car-part.com and there is no engine listed however a working transmission there was $250.00

[1965rivgs]

3 hours ago, my first riv said:

I have searched high and low and can find no comparable info. I recently bought a 64 parts car that has a 114k on engine and trans, the guy I bought it from had a guy that's interested in the engine and trans. He offered $600 for the pair and the seller gave me the guys contact info. The engine was running with a new starter but has sat so will need a little tinkering to get it running again. My question is, is that a good price or does that seem a bit on the low side for a hard to find engine and trans combo? I'm not trying to pay for my kids college with this sale but also want a fair price for what I have.

  That price is low for both a transmission and engine core...but from the buyer`s perspective, unless you can demonstrate the running condition of the engine, the situation is somewhat of a crap shoot with the potential of not even providing a useable core. If you can demostrate the running condition of the engine and it doesnt knock, tick or smoke that would easily double the price.

  Just another opinion

Tom Mooney

[my first riv]

1 hour ago, 1965rivgs said:

  That price is low for both a transmission and engine core...but from the buyer`s perspective, unless you can demonstrate the running condition of the engine, the situation is somewhat of a crap shoot with the potential of not even providing a useable core. If you can demostrate the running condition of the engine and it doesnt knock, tick or smoke that would easily double the price.

  Just another opinion

Tom Mooney

That would be easy to do since engine is still in the car. It was a running driving car until previous owner wanted to restore the body and repaint. I personally know the previous owner and know how the car was when he bought it and started the work.

 

Edited October 1, 2021 by my first riv (see edit history)

[my first riv]

I should add that the price he offered was for the engine plus trans as well as the alternator, power steering pump, carb and the original air cleaner housing.

[telriv]

Mark,

 

      Since the engine & trans. are still it the vehicle it would behove you to spend the nec. time & proper procedures to start an engine/trans. that has been dormate for a number of years.  I just recently, in the past couple years, sold a KX running engine in the car for $2500.00.  I did a cold compression test in front of him & started the engine & had it running for more than an hour when he approved the pull.  Gave me 1/2 down, $500.00 refundable if he changed his mind after I pulled it, & balance when he came to pick it up.

    Without it running, as mentioned is a crap shoot & ONLY worth core value of $150.00-$500.00 as sits.

Just my opinion.

 

Tom T.

[lrlforfun]

OK BCA People: AGAIN, Tom T for the win. It ain't worth much if it is not an absolute  given that it runs excellent.  Not like brand new, just excellent!   Mitch

[gungeey]

So, the group think is to spend energy time and money to hopefully the get the thing to kick over and make another 500 bucks?

 

And if I spend a couple days tinkering with no positive result I then sell it for 150? as a non runner? Or do we pass it off to the next guy for 600 knowing its junk?

 

And will the guy even take it now that he sees all the fresh handling marks all over it? If I were him seeing new greasy handprints and fresh toolmarks

 

everywhere I would be pretty sure you were trying to get it running and couldnt ( or else you would of proclaimed it as running). In my mind it would be

 

confirmed toast.

 

Lot of effort and behind the scenes antics for a "maybe" 500

 

especially when I have a project car demanding my attention ?

 

600 as is sounds fair

 

Id rather a fast nickel than a slow dime Steve

 

EDIT: and if the guy has a 600 budget and he's then told 1000/1200 etc what do I do with the thing when he walks away? I don't see a line outside 

 

the door LOL

 

And if its so precious why wouldn't I just keep for, you know,... just in case

Edited October 3, 2021 by gungeey (see edit history)

[60FlatTop]

Many years ago I bought a Ford Model A Smith Motor Compressor with the original '28-29 sheet metal.  I had just bought a Cadillac from the farmer and he took me in the barn to show me the compressor. The price was something like $600. I said sure and took it as well.

 

A few months later my Model A friend stopped by with the early Model A club magazine. The Q&A section had a picture and discussion on my compressor and its value. But my impulse had made all the considerations a mute point. Ah, the things that jog your memory.

 

One can get more money by making a better presentation. Turning the key and staring it is the best and it progresses downward to the point where the engine is worth it's weight in dirty iron.

 

"Fair" is a term for women and children. Real men either absorb their expenses in the total project or get the maximum to cover other costs (or some extra walking around pocket money).

 

For a properly coded engine I would clean it very well externally and fill the cylinders with penetrating oil or ATF. Ask $1200 and do the Schultz routine.

 

Always sell a divorce, never a marriage. Too many people think a guaranty comes with everything. Even if you tell them. If there could be a question later charge more up front for their return and whining. If they don't you done good, but don't expect it.

 

Well, time for church. Let's see if I come home a more generous person.

Bernie

 

 

[my first riv]

   I got the car home yesterday, no small task to get a two ton car off a trailer by yourself without a winch. The good; this was a running and driving car when he bought it and it only became dormant when he decided to do the body work and eventually paint it. It was updated with new plugs, wires, cap and rotor just two years ago. The bad; he removed the starter, bought a new one but never installed it and also removed the gas tank (not a huge deal since I can run the car with a remote tank), my guess without a bench test is the solenoid is the culprit of the bad starter and most commonly the problem. 

 

   I've decided to get it running before I pull it as I'll get the best price for it. Prices for a used and running 425 without a rebuild are all over the place, one guy on ebay has his core for sale for $3450 and yet someone else has his running hot rodded 425 for sale for $2500. The running one comes with the carb, exhaust manifolds and distributer, while the other one has no carb. My money would be on the running one of course as I think the one as a core is very over priced and he may just end up owning it forever. Those are the only 425's I found for sale anywhere on the net!

 

   These do not come up for sale very often and even more rarely do the listings last more then a few days before they are sold. After looking at sold and completed listings on ebay as well as Facebook market place research, his $600 offer is vastly under current market on any given day. With the accessories he wants plus the original air cleaner housing as well as the trans, the market price would be around $2,000 -$2500, without me getting the engine running $1,500 would be close to fair given the mileage on it.

 

  The great thing is he isn't the only person on the internet looking for these motors and if I have to own it for a bit I'm okay with that. I just might give it a shiny new paint job when I get it pulled. 

 

Cheers

Mark

[my first riv]

Here's a pic of the motor compartment. Had a hard time getting a good view of the engine numbers but I believe it's a KW engine.

[protrash63]

600 bucks is a steal....if it runs and the trans works 2000 easily. Try to find one. There is a 425 core on ebay for 3400.

Edited October 3, 2021 by protrash63 (see edit history)

[DrownedRiv]

If the motor spins, $600 is definately more than fair. 5 yrs ago i spent that for a 401 combo. Totally agree that if you get it running, you should easily get $1500

 

One comment on using ebay for comparison pricing, In my opinion, of course...more than likely if it is still on ebay, the price it too high...anything priced right on ebay is usually snatched up in no time!

[my first riv]

3 hours ago, gungeey said:

So, the group think is to spend energy time and money to hopefully the get the thing to kick over and make another 500 bucks?

 

And if I spend a couple days tinkering with no positive result I then sell it for 150? as a non runner? Or do we pass it off to the next guy for 600 knowing its junk?

 

And will the guy even take it now that he sees all the fresh handling marks all over it? If I were him seeing new greasy handprints and fresh toolmarks

 

everywhere I would be pretty sure you were trying to get it running and couldnt ( or else you would of proclaimed it as running). In my mind it would be

 

confirmed toast.

 

Lot of effort and behind the scenes antics for a "maybe" 500

 

especially when I have a project car demanding my attention ?

 

600 as is sounds fair

 

Id rather a fast nickel than a slow dime Steve

 

EDIT: and if the guy has a 600 budget and he's then told 1000/1200 etc what do I do with the thing when he walks away? I don't see a line outside 

 

the door LOL

 

And if its so precious why wouldn't I just keep for, you know,... just in case

I don't think his budget is my problem though to be fair, I have a $2k budget for a Ferrari doesn't mean someone will sell me one for that price. 

[gungeey]

ell, you asked an internet board what's fair, people answered and now you have done your research on ebay and facebook and concluded your price is 1500.

 

No real need to continue the discussion.

 

PS the guy selling the 3400 core on ebay has these ratty seats for 1700

 

63 64 65 Buick Riviera Power Seats 1963 1964 1965 | eBay

 

I guess thats what they go for LOL

 

Good luck in your sale

 

 

[60FlatTop]

I bet there are very few first generation Riviera owners who don't look at their car and see a $50,000 collector item in front of them either as it sits or potentially. And there aren't many out there selling at that price.

 

All the cars out there are within the owner's budget. And they are all trying to maximize the budget in the manner they learned. Most want the $50,000 car for $25,000. A few think sweat equity can get one for $10,000.

 

So we all own $50,000 cars. Price your parts accordingly. And pay most attention to your own future needs. If you don't need the cash immediately and have the space let that needy person buy the other guy's parts.

 

I had a nice pair of exhaust manifolds that hung on my garage wall for more than a decade. A guy advertised in parts wanted and I sold them for a reasonable price. Every time I look at that empty space on the wall I shake my head and think "shouldn't have done it". Money, you can get pretty much anywhere. Riviera parts are finite. And all those ancillary parts the guy wants can be sold to pay for the engine. Really, the time to sell Riviera parts is after you sell your Riviera.

 

I sell a lot of stuff but not things I might need for my own car.

[protrash63]

8 hours ago, protrash63 said:

600 bucks is a steal....if it runs and the trans works 2000 easily. Try to find one. There is a 425 core on ebay for 3400.

Quoting myself to add comments......as others suggested asking and getting are two different things for sure. When I drug my Riv home I saw a 401 for sale near me for 1200. It was painted and clean and said to be running...rattle can rebuild??? who knows. Still 1200 isnt bad IMO. Once I found out my engine was junk I was approached by two parties...one locally and I picked up the 65 401 and st400 for 800. Engine turns, thats all I know. Im happy as I have numerous parts to get one engine going, AND these are not small block Chevys. I understood what I was getting into looking at a Riviera.

 

Good luck with the whole thing, however it goes!

[my first riv]

13 hours ago, 60FlatTop said:

I bet there are very few first generation Riviera owners who don't look at their car and see a $50,000 collector item in front of them either as it sits or potentially. And there aren't many out there selling at that price.

 

All the cars out there are within the owner's budget. And they are all trying to maximize the budget in the manner they learned. Most want the $50,000 car for $25,000. A few think sweat equity can get one for $10,000.

 

So we all own $50,000 cars. Price your parts accordingly. And pay most attention to your own future needs. If you don't need the cash immediately and have the space let that needy person buy the other guy's parts.

 

I had a nice pair of exhaust manifolds that hung on my garage wall for more than a decade. A guy advertised in parts wanted and I sold them for a reasonable price. Every time I look at that empty space on the wall I shake my head and think "shouldn't have done it". Money, you can get pretty much anywhere. Riviera parts are finite. And all those ancillary parts the guy wants can be sold to pay for the engine. Really, the time to sell Riviera parts is after you sell your Riviera.

 

I sell a lot of stuff but not things I might need for my own car.

That's good advice

[Nick57]

Just for a price reference I bought a really rusty running driving 63 riviera with a 66 401 engine and trans in it last year for 2000.   It was for sale for 3 or 4 months before I even went to go look at it and I am glad I put on safety glasses before I drove it.  I ended up buying it to put the engine in my 34 Ford and selling most of the parts off the car.  I chose this option after pricing out rebuilding another 401 I had pulled out of a junkyard 20 years ago (300 for the engine and trans).  As some one who had multiple Nailheads and 390 Cadillac engines in my way holding to them if you don't want them takes up some real estate in the shop.   

[my first riv]

12 hours ago, Nick57 said:

Just for a price reference I bought a really rusty running driving 63 riviera with a 66 401 engine and trans in it last year for 2000.   It was for sale for 3 or 4 months before I even went to go look at it and I am glad I put on safety glasses before I drove it.  I ended up buying it to put the engine in my 34 Ford and selling most of the parts off the car.  I chose this option after pricing out rebuilding another 401 I had pulled out of a junkyard 20 years ago (300 for the engine and trans).  As some one who had multiple Nailheads and 390 Cadillac engines in my way holding to them if you don't want them takes up some real estate in the shop.   

It seems that the 401's are more common to find then the 425's but I see your point. We shall see if I priced it right! lol

[RivNut]

11 hours ago, my first riv said:

It seems that the 401's are more common to find then the 425's but I see your point. We shall see if I priced it right! lol

401s we’re the base motor for full sized Buicks starting in 1959. In 1959, the 325 hp four barrel dual exhaust 401 was the same engine that was in the 63 & 65 Rivieras.  The 401 was the standard engine in the 63 and 65 Riviera. 425s we’re options in 63 and 65. 425s we’re standard on all 64 and 66 Riviera’s.  No 401 option for the Riviera but the 401 was pretty standard on all full sized models in those years.  So you will find a plethora of 401s out there.

[protrash63]

Just to add to the discussion;  I spoke with a local well known Buick engine co and they let me know a ballpark figure for a nailhead rebuild based on the ones done recently. 11k.  Thats why I think its underpriced if running.

[EmTee]

[Nick57]

17 hours ago, protrash63 said:

Just to add to the discussion;  I spoke with a local well known Buick engine co and they let me know a ballpark figure for a nailhead rebuild based on the ones done recently. 11k.  Thats why I think its underpriced if running.

That's why I bought a parts riviera for the motor.  Also it had an Edelbrock dual quad intake on it for that price.

 

 

[RivNut]

4 hours ago, Nick57 said:

That's why I bought a parts riviera for the motor.  Also it had an Edelbrock dual quad intake on it for that price.

 

 

Nick, is that intake a B262? If so, it can make some serious hp with the right carbs.* Read Russ Martin’s comments.  If you want to lose hp, bolt on the, as Russ calls it, an Awful-houser dual four intake. 🙂

 

 

*By chance for sale?

[Nick57]

It is a b262 I actually plan to put it on my 34 Ford.  When I bought the car I thought it was a factory intake since it was painted black but I took it home an looked closer and it was aluminum.  Someone actually ground off the Edelbrock logo. 

 

IMG_1648 by mrmineo1, on Flickr

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by Nick57 (see edit history)