TallJohn Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Hello Folks.I'm looking to replace the rear track bar bushings on my 64'. No luck at Cars Inc. or Clarks. OPGI has them listed for 65-70. Summit Racing is a maybe. Do any of you have a source for the correct bushings? Thanks so much. John # 13594. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 I used Energy Suspension 37111G ($15.27 at RockAuto). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallJohn Posted January 22, 2018 Author Share Posted January 22, 2018 Thank you. Just read the thread on the Monroe shocks from Rock auto. Thanks for the info. Interesting the thread turned into suspension discussion and rear track bushings. Cool. Ordered the 37111's from Summit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanZverina Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Do those bushings fit a '63 as well or is there some subtle difference we need to be aware of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 63- 65 use the same bushing, except for the 65 GS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Here's what the part number shown above cross references. Buyer's Guide : ENERGY SUSPENSION 37111G Track Bar Bushing BUICK ELECTRA 1964-1970 BUICK ESTATE WAGON 1970 BUICK LESABRE 1964-1970 BUICK RIVIERA 1965-1970 BUICK WILDCAT 1965-1970 Please refer to catalog for application details. Why it doesn't include 63 and 64 Rivieras, IDK. Chip, What's different about the '65 Gran Sport? Here are the listings from Classic Buicks Image Unavailable RTBB6370 63 - 64 LeSabre-Wildcat-Electra (except estate wagon) Set of 2 (Improved design!) Rear Track Bar Bushings $45.00 Image Unavailable RTBB6370 63 - 70 Riviera Set of 2 (Improved design!) Rear Track Bar Bushings $45.00 They show the same part number 1963 - 1970 Riviera and the same part number for the 63 - 64 other full sized models. Does anyone know for sure if they're the same or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, RivNut said: What's different about the '65 Gran Sport? No idea, but it's a different part number in the 58-66 parts book. Maybe it's a solid bushing (as befits the stiffer suspension) unlike the "wagon wheel" standard bushing. 2 hours ago, RivNut said: They show the same part number 1963 - 1970 Riviera and the same part number for the 63 - 64 other full sized models. Does anyone know for sure if they're the same or not? The 58-66 book lists one bushing for 63-65 (except the 65 GS), a second bushing for the 65 GS and the 66 (except HD suspension), and a third for a 66 with HD suspension. The 63-65 bushing is common to the Riviera and all full size cars for 63-64, except wagons and convertibles. There is no bushing listed for convertibles, or for any 65 except the Riviera. The 64 wagons use the same bushing as the police car option (which is the same bushing used on many 60-64). Got all that?. Edited January 23, 2018 by KongaMan (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, KongaMan said: Got all that?. Well sure. Now what do do with it? Guess you'd have to compare some originals to figure out the differences. Same bar, just different bushings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanZverina Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Thanks, Konga Man. Just one set for the track bar, right? Can you or someone else also tell me if the other rear suspension bushings are still available or what is getting rare for a '63? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, KongaMan said: No idea, but it's a different part number in the 58-66 parts book. Maybe it's a solid bushing (as befits the stiffer suspension) unlike the "wagon wheel" standard bushing. The 58-66 book lists one bushing for 63-65 (except the 65 GS), a second bushing for the 65 GS and the 66 (except HD suspension), and a third for a 66 with HD suspension. The 63-65 bushing is common to the Riviera and all full size cars for 63-64, except wagons and convertibles. There is no bushing listed for convertibles, or for any 65 except the Riviera. The 64 wagons use the same bushing as the police car option (which is the same bushing used on many 60-64). Got all that?. The `65 GS bushing is also a "wagon wheel" bushing, just less empty space and more spoke. The Police option bushing is a solid bushing. I have both of the above in NOS parts. Tom Mooney 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 56 minutes ago, 1965rivgs said: The `65 GS bushing is also a "wagon wheel" bushing, just less empty space and more spoke. The Police option bushing is a solid bushing. I have both of the above in NOS parts. Tom Mooney There ya go. Interesting that the wagon and the cops use the same bushing, and that the convertible apparently doesn't have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, RivNut said: Well sure. Now what do do with it? Guess you'd have to compare some originals to figure out the differences. Same bar, just different bushings? If the "member" would be the bar itself, the full size cars save the wagons have one bar, while the wagons have a different bar. There is no member listed for the Riviera. For the bar and bushing assembly, the Riviera has a unique number, while the other cars split along the same lines as the bushings. That is, it appears that there is a unique bar for the RIviera, and the others models share the same bar with some variation in bushings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, JanZverina said: Thanks, Konga Man. Just one set for the track bar, right? Can you or someone else also tell me if the other rear suspension bushings are still available or what is getting rare for a '63? Thanks! One set for the track bar (you get the bushings for both ends). The original one-piece bushings press in; the Energy Suspension replacements have three pieces per end: two half bushings and a metal core. You don't need to press them in; they just slide in. Getting the old bushings out might be the hardest part of the job. I used a ball joint press. There are 6 identical control arm bushings in the rear (two on each of the three arms). It seems that they are available only from Rare Parts. They are quite dear; about $80 each. You can make substitutes for a fraction of the cost from commonly available Cadillac bushings and a spacer. Instructions and part numbers have been posted on here before. FWIW, the Rare Parts bushings are also shorter bushings with a spacer, so you're not compromising anything by rolling your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riviera63 Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 13 hours ago, KongaMan said: 63- 65 use the same bushing, except for the 65 GS. For some reason various catalogs do not show the bushings fitting the 63's. When my brother-in-law and I went to buy them from a local parts store when we were in Colorado for the ROA convention we ran into the same thing. Their catalogs showed them listed for other model years but, not the 63. We ordered them anyway and put them in. They fit perfectly and we had a much nicer ride back home. Bill 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodneybeauchamp Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 Hi John, I replaced my track bar bushes two days ago with the PST poly bushes, graphite impregnated. They are a two piece bush with a metal sleeve and fit nicely in place of the old bushes. Listing states for ‘65 but the fit my ‘63 nicely. Come as a set of 4 bushes, two sleeves and sticky grease. Hardest part was to remove the bar by cutting one of the bolts (twice) and then cut out the bush remnants. Replaced with new grade 8 high tensile bolts. And torque them back up to 120 foot pounds. The old ones were a rubber/steel wagon wheel type that had seen better times. If you wanna fly me over there, will replace them for free! ?????? cheers Rodney (down under) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallJohn Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 (edited) OK. So the bushings arrived today ( energy 37111g) and they are too big. Upon further inspection of the track bar it looks like there is a pressed in metal sleeve making the inside diameter just small enough that the bushings don't fit. Inside dia. is about 44.4mm. Bushings are 48.5mm. Is there really a metal sleeve in the track rod or do my eyes deceive me? Track rod out of another year? Any thoughts? Thanks. Edited January 25, 2018 by TallJohn (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallJohn Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 So I just read the string again. Looks like I need to have the sleeves pressed out. Thanks KongaMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodneybeauchamp Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 John, mine had a pressed in bush. When I cut away all of the internal rubber was left with just the outer metal case from the bush. I used a hacksaw by removing the blade and reassembling inside the hole. A couple of light cuts in several places an the bush could be knocked out. On one side is a flange so it comes out that way. No need for a press at all. The bush must be out so the bushes fit the hole. cheers Rodney ???? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 If you have the rubber out, you can (as Rodney says) collapse the outer sleeve and knock it out. You can also go to your local parts store (Autozone, O'Reilly, etc.) and get a free loaner ball joint press. If you opt for the press, get every attachment kit (Honda, etc.) that they have. You never know what configuration you're going to need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallJohn Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 Thanks guys . Just dropped it at the shop that did my motor. No charge Yahoo. Thanks for the tip if there is a " next time" ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 6 hours ago, rodneybeauchamp said: John, mine had a pressed in bush. When I cut away all of the internal rubber was left with just the outer metal case from the bush. I used a hacksaw by removing the blade and reassembling inside the hole. A couple of light cuts in several places an the bush could be knocked out. On one side is a flange so it comes out that way. No need for a press at all. The bush must be out so the bushes fit the hole. cheers Rodney ???? This technique will relieve the tightest !of pressed bushings, even those which are so stubborn a press will struggle. I use a saw zall but a hack saw will work in a pinch. Good post! Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NC1968Riviera Posted January 28, 2018 Share Posted January 28, 2018 I just saw a posting in Instagram for Meyer Chassis in Murrieta, California. They say they manufacture adjustable track bars for Rivieras, though their website (http://meyerchassis.com/) does not list this part. Phone: (951) 776-7377 Email: meyerchassis@gmail.com I sent them an email requesting information about a 1968 Riviera track bar. The picture below is from their Instagram account. It looks like the track bars have the bushings pre-installed and comes with mounting hardware for $199 ea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 28, 2018 Share Posted January 28, 2018 Mike, The ends on that adjustable track bar are heim joints. It is possible they are lined with a plastic sleeve but I would guess they are all metal. There will be no "give" to this type of bushing or vibration/sound absorbtion. Tom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 (edited) 6 hours ago, 1965rivgs said: Mike, The ends on that adjustable track bar are heim joints. It is possible they are lined with a plastic sleeve but I would guess they are all metal. There will be no "give" to this type of bushing or vibration/sound absorbtion. Tom Yeah, a lot of folks seem to gloss right over that aspect of the original suspension design when developing their "improvements". Edited January 29, 2018 by KongaMan (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NC1968Riviera Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 14 hours ago, 1965rivgs said: Mike, The ends on that adjustable track bar are heim joints. It is possible they are lined with a plastic sleeve but I would guess they are all metal. There will be no "give" to this type of bushing or vibration/sound absorbtion. Tom What you said is all Greek to me, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Eaton Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 Unless you are building a race car......use the original bar and end bushings with the rubber mount. The rubber does a couple of things....(1) it allows for some misalignment of the bolt (2) greatly reduces the transmission of road noise from the axel to the body. Urethane in place of rubber is OK but stiffer than the original rubber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 2 hours ago, NC68Riviera said: What you said is all Greek to me, sir. What it means is that the difference between a Heim joint and the original bushing is the difference between sitting on a rock and sitting on a cushion. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 9 hours ago, NC68Riviera said: What you said is all Greek to me, sir. Mike, Do a Google images search for "heim joint" and compare the pic to the original bushings and my post will make sense, Tom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NC1968Riviera Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 hour ago, 1965rivgs said: Mike, Do a Google images search for "heim joint" and compare the pic to the original bushings and my post will make sense, Tom I understand now. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTX-SLPR Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Does anyone have a track bar bushing out measure the length of the inner sleeve and the OD of the housing on the bar? With enough room a Currie Johnny Joint: would be better than a straight hiem, even a PTFE self lubricated one. The bearing surfaces are urethane and would give you pretty good dampening characteristics. Side Note: You can't use one of those in the front lower control position since the smallest diameter a Johnny Joint sleeve comes in is 2.0in and the diameter of the frame hole is only 1.81in and I doubt anyone wants to cut the frame. Another thing to remember is the Rivieras are body on frame so those squishy body mounts add a lot of isolation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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