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#1 pyntre

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 03:44 AM

Old Barrett Jackson can really bring in the money... the original Batman Car , George Barris , just sold for 4.2 Million to a gentlman with the last name of Champagne ....fitting......I live for this week of auction on tv...eating TV dinners.......Ha Ha Ha ... no thats actually what I had !!! :):)Ha Ha Ha

#2 Rob J

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 11:14 PM

Yep, I saw that. That's some crazy money for a car old Barris whipped up in 15 days.

Here's the guy that bought it. Shipping business must be good.

http://www.champagne....com/about.aspx
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#3 kaycee

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:32 AM

Question?
When did our ? hobby turn into a deep pockets hobby instead of a fun way to spend time on a old car in our backyard garage? I liked it better when a guy that knew a little about cars spent his time and a little money and time to work on that old hulk played around on it when he had time. I guess now that my old painting experience and every other thing that I did on a car or truck I got underpaid for. No car is worth a $10000-$20000 paint job, or $8000-$20000 transmission or engine work. In the meantime, I'll keep having fun and the rest can show off not what they're capable of doing on a car but how much money they have!
kaycee
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#4 Ranger

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:08 AM

As read in the AZ Republic, Rick Champagne is going to knock down a wall to expand his living room and park the car in his house. He lives in Paradise Valley, AZ, the same neighborhood as Craig Jackson. If you have it, may as well spend it. At least he saved a buck on shipping.
Jim Wright
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#5 steelman

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:40 PM

At least he saved a buck on shipping.

Not really. Had he had it shipped out of state, he would not have to pay Arizona Sales Tax. If you have it shipped, you don't pay the tax. If he has to pay the published rate of $2.89 for each $100 of value on the entire 4.62 million he paid for the car, his tax bill is another $133, 518.00. Shipping business must be really good.
Steve Owens
Oklahoma City

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#6 Rob J

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:41 PM

Question?
When did our ? hobby turn into a deep pockets hobby instead of a fun way to spend time on a old car in our backyard garage? I liked it better when a guy that knew a little about cars spent his time and a little money and time to work on that old hulk played around on it when he had time. I guess now that my old painting experience and every other thing that I did on a car or truck I got underpaid for. No car is worth a $10000-$20000 paint job, or $8000-$20000 transmission or engine work. In the meantime, I'll keep having fun and the rest can show off not what they're capable of doing on a car but how much money they have!
kaycee



I do understand what your saying, but while I agree with some of what you say, I don't agree with all of it. Certain cars are very worthy of a 20k paint job and better IMO. Do you realize the type of talent and raw man hours necessary for a top notch job?

Like anything rare and desirable, it comes with a price tag. That's just the way it is.
ROA Member #13099

Link to Picture Album of Project Rivy 401 http://photobucket.com/65Rivy

1965 Riviera 401, AC, Deluxe Interior (Currently undergoing a frame off nut and bolt restoration)
1987 Buick Grand National (All original, and only 16k miles)

#7 JZRIV

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:55 PM

Question?
When did our ? hobby turn into a deep pockets hobby instead of a fun way to spend time on a old car in our backyard garage? I liked it better when a guy that knew a little about cars spent his time and a little money and time to work on that old hulk played around on it when he had time. I guess now that my old painting experience and every other thing that I did on a car or truck I got underpaid for. No car is worth a $10000-$20000 paint job, or $8000-$20000 transmission or engine work. In the meantime, I'll keep having fun and the rest can show off not what they're capable of doing on a car but how much money they have!
kaycee


Just some random thoughts here.
Don't let the big publicized auctions indicate thats the direction the hobby has gone. I agree the old car hobby has changed over the years but there are still plenty of reasonably priced projects out there that can and are driven while work is being done on a meager budget which provides satisfaction in owning and working on a classic or unique vehicle. I know Barrett Jackson gets beat up alot on forums for artificially inflating prices but I am of the opinion everything has its place in the old car hobby. Its these people with deep pockets that often times are indirectly responsible for getting unobtainable parts reproduced which helps the guy trying to make a 100 point car to sell at BJ as well as the poor sap keeping a $2000 driver on the road. As much as I complain about TV shows of today, I think the recent surge of reality TV shows (despite their faults) depicting taking a junk car and rebuilding it for sale might start to spawn some interest by young kids to get into the hobby.

In my mid teens in the late 70s average vehicle cost for me was around $300. I'd buy them as a my sole transportation while fixing up, painting, etc all on a limited budget with limited tools and a crude drafty old garage/shed and dirt driveway. I learned early on if I bought the right car or dirt bike and did all the work myself I could actually make a profit when selling it. If I couldn't do the work myself, it wasn't done so I learned by trial and error in many aspects as that was long before the internet and youtube. I didn't know factory shop manauls existed until I was in my 20s. Now that I'm older and have some extra income, my car projects have become more expensive because I continue to push myself to reach higher levels of quality in a finished project which in turn continues the exact same learning process started when I was a youngster out of necessity.

There are few kids today in the younger generation that grow up having interest in wrenching or (sheening) as we called it in the 70s. Society pushes them to think everything can be done sitting in front of an Xbox, computer or iphone screen and parents focus on preparing them for college and heaven forbid they get their hands dirty learning some bluecollar skills. I only know maybe 2 teenage kids today who are into cars at the level in which was so common 35 years ago. Another contributing factor could be that cars today require a fraction of repairs and maintenance compared to the cars of the 60s and 70s so learning to repair cars through necessity has diminished.

So yes anyone doing most of their own wrenching on hobby cars today are in a minority now as the generations of the 60s and 70s which created so many hands-on skilled people are becoming outnumbered. On the flip side some of those materialistic kids who went to college a couple generations later, started a business, have a successful career, etc, are grown and now have enough income to buy the car they always dreamed of but don't have the time or skills to build themselves so its all good for the hobby in my opinion.
Jason Zerbini
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#8 Ranger

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:14 PM

Actually Steelman, I was just making a point that the owner of Barrett Jackson is a neighbor of the buyer, both live near the auction. The sales tax in Scottsdale on a car from a dealer is 8.95% (Barrett-Jackson) PLUS the B-J buyers fee of 10%. If the car is bought from a private party, there is no sales tax, I'd guess Jackson might give Champagne a break on the buyers fee. I suppose if he had it shipped to another state where he is also a resident (?), he may or may not have to pay the sales tax to register it in that state. At any rate I wonder where you got the 2.89%?

Jim

#9 pyntre

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:24 PM

Actually Steelman, I was just making a point that the owner of Barrett Jackson is a neighbor of the buyer, both live near the auction. The sales tax in Scottsdale on a car from a dealer is 8.95% (Barrett-Jackson) PLUS the B-J buyers fee of 10%. If the car is bought from a private party, there is no sales tax, I'd guess Jackson might give Champagne a break on the buyers fee. I suppose if he had it shipped to another state where he is also a resident (?), he may or may not have to pay the sales tax to register it in that state. At any rate I wonder where you got the 2.89%?

Jim


So how much did the car ACTUALLY cost him with tax and fees....I think that would really blow my mind...

#10 steelman

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 07:34 PM

Actually Steelman, I was just making a point that the owner of Barrett Jackson is a neighbor of the buyer, both live near the auction. The sales tax in Scottsdale on a car from a dealer is 8.95% (Barrett-Jackson) PLUS the B-J buyers fee of 10%. If the car is bought from a private party, there is no sales tax, I'd guess Jackson might give Champagne a break on the buyers fee. I suppose if he had it shipped to another state where he is also a resident (?), he may or may not have to pay the sales tax to register it in that state. At any rate I wonder where you got the 2.89%?

Jim


Like all things internet, sometimes you get things you don't need or want. Tried the DMV and it was a run around. Picked this up off an E-How site, but I don't think it was right. I agree with your 8.95%. So assuming Craig Jackson didn't give him a break on the fees, and you know the state of Arizona didn't, he paid BJA $4.62 million. At the 8.95% tax rate on top of that, we get $413,490.00 for a whopping total of $5,033,490.00 to get it out the door.
Steve Owens
Oklahoma City

1963 Riviera
ROA #11614

#11 60FlatTop

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 07:42 PM

Jee, I missed the TV versions of the auctions. Seems like I get tied up in the reality of professional wrestling and miss it.
Bernie

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#12 Rob J

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 05:38 AM

a whopping total of $5,033,490.00 to get it out the door.


Bend over and grab your ankles. All for a car that the finish quality looks like crap in person. As a matter of fact, it looked like crap the day George Barris finished it in his 15 day build of the car many years ago. I think 86' Yugo's had better paint jobs.

Yep, I know folks whom have seen this car in person. And you can even see the crappy build quality on TV.


BTW, I agree with what Jason said.
ROA Member #13099

Link to Picture Album of Project Rivy 401 http://photobucket.com/65Rivy

1965 Riviera 401, AC, Deluxe Interior (Currently undergoing a frame off nut and bolt restoration)
1987 Buick Grand National (All original, and only 16k miles)

#13 petelempert

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 02:49 PM

It's easy to trash Barrett Jackson, but I find myself watching like a zombie as car after car rolls by. My wife is baffled. "How many 69 Camaros do you have to see before you get bored of this?" she says. "Don't know yet" is my reply. The entire BJ concept is a TV circus...literally. Speedchannel chops and dices things to make a good TV show. Applying the common man car guy ethic to BJ is pointless. If the show was about the common guy, nobody would watch it. It is all about hyperbole. We don't see the things that have been edited out. The real things. We don't see the achingly boring parade of "normal" cars the also cross the block but sell for less that $15K because it doesn't make good TV. We don't get an explanation of why a hand built, impeccably restored Pierce Arrow sells for a tiny fraction of what a cheaply retrofitted concept car that became Batman's car sells for $4MM plus. Remember, the Batmobile is all about good TV, the Pierce Arrow is not. What you do see if you pay attention is the role of ego. Ego is what makes somebody pay crazy money for a crazy car. Look at the guys spending gobs of money on a car, typically the first thing they do is look up to see if they are being captured on TV. Next, they look to see if their trophy wife is impressed. Many times, they seem to place more value in the "complimentary" pen they get to keep when they sign for the car than the car itself. It's just a TV show. It's unreal...but it's fun. PRL

#14 pyntre

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 06:42 PM

It's easy to trash Barrett Jackson, but I find myself watching like a zombie as car after car rolls by. My wife is baffled. "How many 69 Camaros do you have to see before you get bored of this?" she says. "Don't know yet" is my reply. The entire BJ concept is a TV circus...literally. Speedchannel chops and dices things to make a good TV show. Applying the common man car guy ethic to BJ is pointless. If the show was about the common guy, nobody would watch it. It is all about hyperbole. We don't see the things that have been edited out. The real things. We don't see the achingly boring parade of "normal" cars the also cross the block but sell for less that $15K because it doesn't make good TV. We don't get an explanation of why a hand built, impeccably restored Pierce Arrow sells for a tiny fraction of what a cheaply retrofitted concept car that became Batman's car sells for $4MM plus. Remember, the Batmobile is all about good TV, the Pierce Arrow is not. What you do see if you pay attention is the role of ego. Ego is what makes somebody pay crazy money for a crazy car. Look at the guys spending gobs of money on a car, typically the first thing they do is look up to see if they are being captured on TV. Next, they look to see if their trophy wife is impressed. Many times, they seem to place more value in the "complimentary" pen they get to keep when they sign for the car than the car itself. It's just a TV show. It's unreal...but it's fun. PRL


Its on my "Bucket List " of things to do in my lifetime , attend the Scottsdale auction ....not to buy anything, but just to watch and be a part of the CIRCUS and see how the other half live...would also like to attend SEMA but I think you have to be a vendor or something like that to get in there...

#15 60FlatTop

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 07:18 PM

A neat alternative in coming up on the east coast (really the coast, too). Its the Atlantic City auction in February. I went the first time in 1974 and a few times in between. The circus is there and I think there are some pretty good deals due to the time of year.
I can't verify it but I think some of the museums move overstock through this auction to maintain some off season cash flow. There is a good swap meet held along with the auction. And I have always seen one really good deal that I shudda brought home.
Just a nice winter diversion.
Bernie

BCA# 10556
1948 Packard Deluxe Eight

1948 Lincoln Continental Coupe
1960 Buick Electra
1964 Buick Riviera
1986 Buick Electra Park Ave convertible
1994 Chevy Impala SS
55 Years of having an awful lot of fun with cars.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]


#16 RivNut

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:28 PM

I've been volunteering to be a car pusher at the Mecum auction when it has come to Kansas City the past few years. You get in free, get on the floor, and can look at all of the cars, and, as Pyrtne says, "see how the other half lives." Kansas City doesn't get a lot of the really high dollar stuff, but there are a lot of cars that are fun to look at because lots of times you can say "I used to have one like this." (Then cry because at that time it was just another used car - like my '57 Austin Healey 100-6, my '68 Dodge Charger, a '70 Chevelle, and a couple of '55 Chevies.) Lots of muscle cars, some older stuff, and some late model stuff that perhaps someone is trying to flip.

Ed

Edited by RivNut, 23 January 2013 - 08:30 PM.

Ed Raner
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#17 60FlatTop

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 12:27 AM

I've known about the high end cars in KC for a long time. Why they got rhinestones on the spokes! Here's where I heard:
Bernie

BCA# 10556
1948 Packard Deluxe Eight

1948 Lincoln Continental Coupe
1960 Buick Electra
1964 Buick Riviera
1986 Buick Electra Park Ave convertible
1994 Chevy Impala SS
55 Years of having an awful lot of fun with cars.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]


#18 The Continental

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 08:07 PM

A Batmobile replica or even a tribute is big on my want list.

The bad things about BJ is the stigma it puts on rusted out clunkers people think are worth as much as cars on TV and non-car guys getting in on it for investments. Luckily all those million dollar Bel Airs, Hemis, etc aren't going to bring anywhere near what they did in 2006 which will scare off a lot from investing.

I'd like to hear more though about the history of investing in automobiles. I guess really though like anything else it goes second hand to collecting. I'm sure even in the 50s people started seeing the value in ACD, Packard, Pierce Arrow, V12/V16 Cadillacs.

#19 petelempert

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 10:17 PM

Some cars are obvious investment grade regardless of what era they date to. Thats' typically a narrow band of cars that were expensive to begin with and historically retain and command top dollar from a limited number of wealthy collectors. The BJ phenomenon is built on a different dynamic: Scores of successful, recently retired baby boomers have driven up the prices of more common vehicles that invoke the cars of their youth. Importantly, these cars are very drivable and relatively easy to fix compared to the elite cars of the past like Dusenberg, Packard etc. I think there will be a gradual cooling of the whole BJ thing. It's already happening. The baby boomers will die off, younger buyers lack the connection with these cars and the collector market will see beyond the speculators and recognize cars for their true value. That said, it's good for Riv prices. The baby boomer who gets tied of the hard ride, noise and heat of his 69 COPO Camaro replica is looking for something else. The undervalued, underexposed, luxuriously appointed, 60's swank of the Riv is the perfect next car. Anyone else agree? PRL

#20 1965rivgs

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 10:58 PM

Buick buyers are always looking for value whether the car is brand spanking new or an antique
Tom Mooney




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