Towing Vehicle

[EmTee]

Steve, that's a shame and there should be a special place in hell for cowards like the one who vandalized your Impala.  That said, I agree that I think you'll be happier with an enclosed trailer.  I went back-and-forth in my head before coming to the same conclusion.  I was trading open aluminum vs. enclosed steel trailers.  If money was no object, I'd go for an enclosed aluminum trailer, however, the price is nearly 2x steel for a good one.  In the end, I bought an 8.5' x 24', 10K Lb, enclosed Pace American.  I was leery of buying a used trailer from a stranger, so I focused my shopping on a new one.  I did see two used 20' enclosed ones advertised locally that were only a couple years old, but asking price was high and my brother (who had a 40' race car hauler) as well as others on this forum, suggested that strapping my cars down in a 20' trailer (esp. the front) would be a PITA.  So, after looking around and narrowing the search to two trailers, I talked to the dealers and got quotes.  In the end, I bought the Pace and am quite happy with the decision.  The one I bought has a finished interior that is very nice and really brightens up the inside.  The other one I looked at had an unfinished interior.  I figured the difference in price was close enough that I wasn't saving much if I had to finish the interior myself.  The deal included two mounted spare tires, a weight distribution hitch and fitting it to my Suburban.  Dealer support was also important to me, though I expect to perform most of my own maintenance and the dealer I bought from is a family business that has been around for decades.  Take your time and you'll make the right choice.

 

 

[STEVE POLLARD]

Very nice set up! I like the look of the finish interior of the trailer.

[EmTee]

So far I've accumulated ~3,500 miles towing with the setup shown above and am very happy with the performance.  The 8.1 Suburban is a beast and if I'm cruising the interstate at 65 mph it doesn't even drop out of OD on moderate grades.  The ride is smooth and I've had no issues with sway.  I do, however, feel like I'm being sucked to the left once in a while when being passed.  Tall box trucks and big commercial busses seem to be the worst in that regard.  Most tractor trailers passing by don't have any noticeable effect.  The ride inside the Suburban is like flying in a 747.  I think part of the smoothness is the torsion axle suspension on the trailer.  I looked at one with conventional leaf springs and researched both types.  I was finally 'sold' after talking to the dealer's son, who told me that he basically ordered the trailer I bought as if he was buying one for himself.  The other thing mine has is an extended tongue which really does help maneuverability.

[STEVE POLLARD]

That set up I had with the rented U-Haul trailer and my 1500 1/2ton van, scared the life out of me....it was my first time towing, had my wife and four kids with us traveling north on the  NYS Thruway, when a tractor trailer passed me, I held on for dear life...lol

[Larry Schramm]

On 1/17/2024 at 9:25 AM, STEVE POLLARD said:

That set up I had with the rented U-Haul trailer and my 1500 1/2ton van, scared the life out of me....it was my first time towing, had my wife and four kids with us traveling north on the  NYS Thruway, when a tractor trailer passed me, I held on for dear life...lol

 

Could be considered a notification that you need more truck that you currently have to tow the vehicle you have.

[STEVE POLLARD]

4 hours ago, Larry Schramm said:

Could be considered a notification that you need more truck that you currently have to tow the vehicle you have.

Definitely !  That van has been "retired", it was the first and last time I towed with it.

[Avanti Bill]

You can pull a great deal of weight with a 1/2 ton truck but the tongue weight has to be right or it won't handle well.  Longer wheelbase and heavier the truck the more forgiving it is but the balance is critical so get a tongue scale or a weigh-safe hitch so you know how much weight you have every time. 

[hursst]

Steve, did you ever purchase a towing vehicle?  I'm very interested to see what you get.

 

I'm thinking of getting a towing set up myself.  To the group- it looks like 3/4 ton is best.  Is there any preference for a van, pickup, or SUV, or does it matter much?  

 

What about enclosed trailers?  Do AACA folks advertise them on this forum anywhere?  Where is the best place to shop for a (used) enclosed trailer?

[CarNucopia]

1 hour ago, hursst said:

Steve, did you ever purchase a towing vehicle?  I'm very interested to see what you get.

 

I'm thinking of getting a towing set up myself.  To the group- it looks like 3/4 ton is best.  Is there any preference for a van, pickup, or SUV, or does it matter much?  

 

What about enclosed trailers?  Do AACA folks advertise them on this forum anywhere?  Where is the best place to shop for a (used) enclosed trailer?

A lot depends on what you plan to tow. Looking at you club affiliations, it appears you have some American cars and smaller Euro cars. I'm in a similar situation with regards to size/weight range of vehicles. If you're only towing an MG or SAAB, a 3/4-ton is more then you need. Tell us a little more about how you plan to use the setup.

[hursst]

Thanks for the reply.  I would be towing a 1974 Camaro as the biggest vehicle, probably around 3,800 lbs or so.  The other vehicles would be a 1930 Plymouth roadster and a 1960 MGA.  It would be for towing to car shows, tours, and local garages/events if they are more than about 20 miles.

Edited February 24 by hursst (see edit history)

[CarNucopia]

36 minutes ago, hursst said:

Thanks for the reply.  I would be towing a 1974 Camaro as the biggest vehicle, probably around 3,800 lbs or so.  The other vehicles would be a 1930 Plymouth roadster and a 1960 MGA.  It would be for towing to car shows, tours, and local garages/events if they are more than about 20 miles.

When I was trailer shopping, the biggest/heaviest car was my Buick (4,600#). I ended up buying an ATC trailer because of the light weight. Since I ordered it new, I did everything I could to keep the heft down. The result is a 1,500# enclosed trailer. With the Buick onboard, I'm just over 6,000#. This gave me more flexibility in choosing a tow vehicle. So as you shop, consider the budget for the entire package, not just the trailer. I preferred to put money in a lighter trailer instead of a heavier tow vehicle. When any other vehicle is in the trailer, it is way below my maximum capacity. After a few years with this setup, I bought a used Triton TC167 snowmobile trailer for my smaller cars. The ATC is like pulling a parachute which bothered me when I didn't need the capacity. The fit in the small trailer is snug, but it's really easy to tow and saves me a ton of time and money in fuel stops.

 

Edit: One point I should make is my pickup is a 3/4 ton. I bought is because it was a great low-mileage vehicle, not for the extra capacity.

Edited February 24 by CarNucopia (see edit history)

[EmTee]

Having just bought my 8.1 Suburban (2001) and 24' Pace American enclosed trailer (new) last fall, I will say that you can't go wrong with a 3/4 ton truck.  Even if it's technically "more than you need" having the extra margin for payload - and especially brakes - is comforting.  I also looked at used trailers, however, 24' enclosed ones were scarce, and the one or two I saw advertised by private owners (e.g., Facebook) were asking virtually new money for 2 or 3 year-old trailers.  I decided that I didn't want to buy anyone else's problems since the typical user doesn't pay close attention to maintenance.  I wound up buying my trailer from a dealer in my area after narrowing the search to two trailers at two different dealers.  I talked at length with both and chose the one who came off as most knowledgeable and family-owned for 40 years.  I'm confident they will be there if I need service during or after the warranty period.  I've towed this setup for ~3500 miles so far and have no complaints.

 

As far as type of vehicle is concerned, it depends upon what else you'll be carrying.  If it's people, I will tell you that the Suburban is hard to beat.  Mine has the 3rd row seat and I just spent the last week driving six of us over roughly 500 miles comfortably.  (FYI, we did the same last year in my wife's Equinox and were jammed-in like sardines...)  If you only carry a couple of passengers occasionally, then a 4DR pickup will work fine.  If you're contemplating a 5th wheel or gooseneck, then you'll have to have a pickup.

[Larry Schramm]

I now tow with at 3/4 ton Silverado with the 6.6L Diesel.  It has an 18,500 pound towing capacity. 

The biggest issue is that you need to keep reminding yourself that there is a trailer behind you.  The truck does not even know you have a car & trailer that you are towing.

[Marty Roth]

@EmTee

 

Just a suggestion for your trailer-

You may recall from looking at mine last July in Waterloo, I have my trailer's two spare tires mounted upright on the angled front side walls. It saves floor space, and removing a single lug nut makes it simple and safe to roll a spare out without heavy lifting, and without having a spare shift within the trailer.

[EmTee]

1 hour ago, Marty Roth said:

I have my trailer's two spare tires mounted upright on the angled front side walls.

I heeded your advice and did likewise!  I have them attached to the L & R "Vee" walls at the front of the trailer.  I have a 12V battery in a marine battery case mounted to the floor between them.  Just aft of the battery, centered on the floor, I mounted a 2500 lb. electric winch - just in case... 

[EmTee]

1 hour ago, Larry Schramm said:

The truck does not even know you have a car & trailer that you are towing.

That was my wife's comment the first time she rode with me.  She asked if the trailer was still attached! 

[Marty Roth]

48 minutes ago, EmTee said:

I heeded your advice and did likewise!  I have them attached to the L & R "Vee" walls at the front of the trailer.  I have a 12V battery in a marine battery case mounted to the floor between them.  Just aft of the battery, centered on the floor, I mounted a 2500 lb. electric winch - just in case... 

 

44 minutes ago, EmTee said:

That was my wife's comment the first time she rode with me.  She asked if the trailer was still attached! 

So, like minds ...

Identical to my set-up - battery box in the "V", and winch directly behind it and between the pair of spares-

And yours is a great truck with a solid history.

[EmTee]

3 minutes ago, Marty Roth said:

And yours is a great truck with a solid history.

After riding in the Suburban, my sister-in-law and her husband as well as friends of ours have commented that they can't believe how nice it is inside and out.  I let my son-in-law borrow it yesterday and he said he liked how smoothly it rode - and he's a Ford guy! 

[Century Eight]

Whatever truck you buy, check and/or replace the brake lines.  I infrequently tow big Buicks, 4400 lbs, with an open trailer, behind an ‘04 3/4 ton Sierra that I bought new.  At about year ten or 100k miles, I was loading up to go to a show and the brakes went  to the floor, fortunately in my back yard.   I found out that in the early 2000’s ALL the mfrs.  had crappy brake lines.  Didn’t matter if it was Ford, GM, Toyota or whatever.  The steel at the time, wasn’t holding up to the salt and brine they put on the roads these days, and they rust and rot and you are in for a surprise when you least expect it.  And I live in a relatively mild area with very little snow.

 

So we got a brake kit to replace all the lines.  (Now why would you think they make kits? Must be pretty bad) There were even class action suits , but do you think the little guy won?  

 

As someone said previously in this forum, “Its not how much you can pull, but how much you can stop.”  Be safe.

 

Whoops, I guess I am repeating myself.  I just ran across this thread again and didn’t realize I harped on the brake lines but that was a year ago.  But anyway, I am leaving  my comments in, because I think it’s really important that we all have good brakes.

Edited February 25 by Century Eight (see edit history)

[EmTee]

10 hours ago, Century Eight said:

Whatever truck you buy, check and/or replace the brake lines.

I replaced the failed steel lines on my '04 Silverado with CuNiFe  lines a few years ago and I recommend it.  I bought a 50-foot spool from NAPA and bent my own replacements.  It's easy to work with and will last much longer than plain steel.

[Turbinator]

On 7/29/2023 at 5:13 PM, STEVE POLLARD said:

Hi Marty.....I just went onto the local Chevrolet Dealership website to get an ideal on the full size - STICKER SHOCK !!  LOL, unbelievable,  low range going around $50K to a $84K loaded truck.... I didn't realized how much that they have gone up. 2004 I purchased a new 1500 GMC which I paid $27K.

 

By the way, my daughter is still stationed in New Orleans.

 

 

 

It never ceases to amaze me how much cars and pick up trucks cost. I prefer gently used vehicles with low mileage when I buy. My drivers are true utility vehicles. Still used car prices are through the roof.

I tend to buy heavier duty used puck up trucks. Some outfitted for a snow plow. I go with Chevy 2500 series because it is habit. 
If I was not pulling or hauling heavy loads id be inclined to buy closer to my needs. 
For my personal property  y pro-grad!e small engine equipment. The heavier duty lasts longer and parts are available.

[michaelmackay]

On 7/30/2023 at 10:34 AM, ex98thdrill said:

I've towed with a 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton and a one ton and at this point I will never buy another truck that is less than a 3/4 ton.  For two reasons:

 

1.  They hold the road a lot better than a 1/2 ton.

2.  Currently with the messed up state of New York, if you have a heavy duty 3/4 ton you don't have to plug it into emissions when the truck gets inspected where if you have a 1/2 ton and you have any check engine lights, they can be a pain in the butt come inspection time.

 

If you don't want to buy a brand new truck, my personal recommendations (which many people will differ with me):

 

1.  Buy a used truck from the south where rust isn't an issue.  Even if it's a high mileage vehicle, an engine swap in a rust free body will cost you a whole lot less.

2.  If you don't haul your car to that many meets, consider hiring someone to haul your car to the meet and back.  When a new pickup is going to run you in excess of $70,000, you can hire someone to haul your car to a lot of meets before you'll ever spend $70,000.

3.  Don't cut corners on your tow vehicle.  If you can't safely tow your vehicle to and from a meet or tour, you stand a chance to lose a whole lot more if you end up wrecking the truck, trailer and your show car going to and/or from a meet.  

 

When my dad was alive we used to push the envelope hauling our old fire trucks to a show and pulling it with our 3/4 ton pickup.  The GVW was within the limits, but we were within 500 pounds of being over the max GVW.  Because of the costs of what new trucks cost, we bought an old ladder truck and converted it into a fire truck hauler.  That truck weighs a whole lot less than what it did when it was a ladder truck, it stops better, and when we put the old truck on the back of it, you don't even know it's on there.  We built that hauler ourselves for less than $10,000 and couldn't begin to buy a truck and trailer to do the same job for less than $70,000.

 

Am I telling you to buy a ladder truck and do what we did??  NO!!  But I will remind you that most Fire Departments have brush trucks and mini pumpers that are on a one ton chassis.  You very well might be able to buy one of those for a whole lot less too.  Even if you bought a mini pumper, it most likely would be on a 4500 chassis, and you could probably get it cheap enough to where you could take the back end off of the truck, scrap it out, and have enough money to buy a used box to put on the chassis.  If you're using a van now, you can easily pick up a used ambulance that will have the suspension and power to tow what you need.  There are a lot of van ambulances out there too.

 

Prior to COVID, I know a lot of people who leased trucks and now that their leases are about to expire, the buyout agreement that was on the lease is way less than the truck is worth now.  If you know someone who is leasing a pickup that is towards the end of their lease, it might pay you to have them buy out the truck and sell it to you.

 

Again I feel your pain.  My 3/4 ton has seen better days so now if I'm taking one of our old cars to a meet, I'm towing with the 1/2 ton.  I don't like it, but it isn't enough to make me want to make payments on a new truck.  Meantime I'm saving the money to where I hope to buy a new 3/4 ton within the next five years.  My 1/2 ton has 28,000 miles on it and has never seen snow, so it should get me by in the meantime.

 

I guess at this point, if I were in your shoes I'd ask yourself, what is the price difference between what you can get the job done versus what will do a better job and not compromise safety??  If the value of losing the car and the trailer is greater than the price difference between trucks I'd go with the heavier truck.

 

In terms of buying an old brush truck or mini pumper from a fire department, consider this.  In many cases when a fire department is done with something, the farmers will buy them.  It gives them something with a lot of life left in the vehicle with plenty of suspension and power to put them to work for a whole lot less than buying a new truck.  If the fire departments weren't selling off their old stuff cheap, the farmers wouldn't be buying them.

 

I am known for showing fire trucks in AACA.  Yes I'm in the fire service, but bear in mind that I got into the fire trucks because they were cheap towing brownsville service.  There isn't a single fire truck in my collection that I ever paid more than $5,000 for.  I might've put more money into them once I got them, but there are a lot of people out there who have paid a whole lot more for a vehicle and then restored it.

 

 

Hi - I'm getting more into HPDE with my 991.2 GT3 and am planning on taking it on tracks that are halfway around the country. It's also my only car, and far from ideal for the city streets. I'd like to get something I can drive around and tow the GT3 on. I don't need to daily it since I'm in NYC, but would like it to be comfy for nontowing trips. I like the idea of the new RAM 1500 because of ride comfort, but I'm not sure that will be enough for towing, especially if I get/rent a 20' enclosed trailer for the longer trips.

[CarNucopia]

3 hours ago, michaelmackay said:

Hi - I'm getting more into HPDE with my 991.2 GT3 and am planning on taking it on tracks that are halfway around the country. It's also my only car, and far from ideal for the city streets. I'd like to get something I can drive around and tow the GT3 on. I don't need to daily it since I'm in NYC, but would like it to be comfy for nontowing trips. I like the idea of the new RAM 1500 because of ride comfort, but I'm not sure that will be enough for towing, especially if I get/rent a 20' enclosed trailer for the longer trips.

It really comes down to budget. If you buy the lightest enclosed trailer you can find, you'll be under 5,000lbs which a properly equipped, newer 1/2-ton should handle with ease. You could also get a Cayenne. I towed with a TDI Touareg (same platform) that was rated to pull 7,700lbs. It was easily as good (maybe better) as my '06 Silverado 2500HD. 

 

Something else to consider is the trailer "escape" door. Since your GT3 has sizable rear weight bias, you will probably need to back it in to a 20' trailer to get the tongue weight right. This puts the escape door on the wrong side.