BrianM Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 (edited) I have been posting new threads each time I had a question or comment about my Riviera. I figured I would just make this new thread and each time something comes up I will just bump this thread. My name is Brian and I am located in Arkansas and I bought my first Riviera in 2021. I had only seen a few grainy pics of it before I drove over 500mi up to Illinois and purchased it on the spot from a very nice 82 year young gentleman who was cutting back on his classic car collection. I think I got a great deal paying less than his asking price of $18k. I loaded up my 13 yo son and we drove several hours down Route 66 and cruised the Buick home. It had 89k original miles on the car, had a repaint in the original Stratomist Blue and the vinyl top pulled off in 2012 and he refreshed the motor with new bearings and rings around the same time. Since then I have put 9k miles on her and visited 6 states. I have been slowly working through all the issues with the car with a goal of taking the car to do Power Tour, drag and drive, rolling car show type events all over the country, and drive and enjoy the car as much as possible. Edited August 12, 2022 by BrianM grammar (see edit history) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 12, 2022 Author Share Posted August 12, 2022 Today's question is can anyone tell me if I need sealant added to any of the bolts (and if so which ones) for the timing cover on the 455? Are they all blind holes or do some go into water jacket and need sealant? I have a bad front main leak and have purchased a TA timing cover with the new style seal and am looking to tear into this job as soon as my new water pump arrives. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 12, 2022 Author Share Posted August 12, 2022 Pics 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 12, 2022 Author Share Posted August 12, 2022 Additional question today: Do you guys run a thermo fan clutch or standard fan clutch? Preferred brand of fan clutch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 13, 2022 Author Share Posted August 13, 2022 Wifey and her 93 Vette and my Riv at local cars and coffee 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZRIV Posted August 13, 2022 Share Posted August 13, 2022 14 hours ago, BrianM said: Today's question is can anyone tell me if I need sealant added to any of the bolts (and if so which ones) for the timing cover on the 455? Are they all blind holes or do some go into water jacket and need sealant? I have a bad front main leak and have purchased a TA timing cover with the new style seal and am looking to tear into this job as soon as my new water pump arrives. I believe the long bolts on the driver side go into water jacket. You'll be able to tell for sure once the timing cover is off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telriv Posted August 13, 2022 Share Posted August 13, 2022 Stick a small screwdriver in the holes to see which ones go through. Tom T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZRIV Posted August 13, 2022 Share Posted August 13, 2022 14 hours ago, BrianM said: Additional question today: Do you guys run a thermo fan clutch or standard fan clutch? Preferred brand of fan clutch? I'd probably get an A/C Delco OE thermal clutch. Rock Auto has them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted August 13, 2022 Share Posted August 13, 2022 Many people have placed their car blogs in the "Me and My Buick" forum. https://forums.aaca.org/forum/58-me-and-my-buick/ It's not Riviera-specific, however... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telriv Posted August 13, 2022 Share Posted August 13, 2022 Go to NAPA & get the H/D clutch for a 1 ton truck. Number ends in "301". Tom T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 14, 2022 Author Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) Thanks for the info as always. TA has shipped my water pump. So it should be here next week. I already have the timing cover, gaskets, and radiator hoses. I have a shop lined up to recondition the radiator. New belts and fan clutch are the last items I have on my parts list. Plan to change the passenger valve cover when I have all of the accessories off and can easily loosen the brackets for additional wiggle room. Anything else that I might need to do while it is apart? Edited August 14, 2022 by BrianM (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 On 8/13/2022 at 10:45 PM, BrianM said: I already have the timing cover... Check your cam gear and replace it with an all steel one if the one currently on it has nylon teeth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 15, 2022 Author Share Posted August 15, 2022 Thanks EmTee, will add that to my list. What tire pressure are you running with radial tires? My manual calls for like 24psi in the bias ply tires. I had been running 30psi front and 32psi rear on 35psi max pressure tires and I am wearing the outside edges more than the centers so I bumped up the pressure to 34 all the way around and am going to see how I like that and how they wear. Just curious what others are running. Current Tires are Multi-Mile Matrix P235/75R15 M+S load rating 105 (2039lbs) S speed rating UTQG: 400 A B (not a tire brand I have any experience with) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telriv Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 Alignment problems. Tom T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 15, 2022 Author Share Posted August 15, 2022 I do need and alignment, but have not found a shop locally that can/will do an alignment. Car tracks straight down the road but when I lost all of my belts and had to drive home with only water pump and AC belt on I could feel how much the power steering was masking. However I still had more wear on the outside edges of the rear tires than the center so I bumped up the pressure a few pounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jframe Posted August 15, 2022 Share Posted August 15, 2022 On 8/13/2022 at 12:04 AM, BrianM said: Wifey and her 93 Vette and my Riv at local cars and coffee Good to see another C4 Corvette fan. Got an 89 six speed that I really enjoy. Those cars have been at the bottom of the market far too long, and they are finally getting some of the respect they deserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 16, 2022 Author Share Posted August 16, 2022 The C4 was a 1 owner with 50k miles on it. We have had it a couple months now. It has a bunch of 90's gm quirks but she really likes it so far. I was worried that it would be too quirky for her. We paid extra to get the color she wanted and for it being 1 owner but hope it will hold value or even increase a bit during our ownership. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 18, 2022 Author Share Posted August 18, 2022 Today I have a brake question: I have drum brakes all the way around. When I pull to a complete stop at a stop light and am waiting and holding the pedal steady the car will start to creep and the pedal will sink an additional 1/2" or so before the brakes hold again. I am thinking it is a master cylinder/booster/vacuum issue. I would like to trouble shoot this and not just throw parts at it. I have a vacuum pump and gauges but not sure on procedure to diagnose if the issue is check valve, booster, or master cylinder. Can someone point me to a good trouble shooting guide or provide some experience? Thanks, Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jframe Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 3 hours ago, BrianM said: Today I have a brake question: I have drum brakes all the way around. When I pull to a complete stop at a stop light and am waiting and holding the pedal steady the car will start to creep and the pedal will sink an additional 1/2" or so before the brakes hold again. I am thinking it is a master cylinder/booster/vacuum issue. I would like to trouble shoot this and not just throw parts at it. I have a vacuum pump and gauges but not sure on procedure to diagnose if the issue is check valve, booster, or master cylinder. Can someone point me to a good trouble shooting guide or provide some experience? Thanks, Brian Just an opinion; I would replace the master cylinder AND booster if it was me. When I got my '65, I got new shoes all around, hardware kits all around, wheel cylinders, and all new brake hoses and master cylinder. Guess what, the booster went out not long after that. Dealing with 50+ year old cars with prolly equally as old parts; it pays to just do it all and be done with it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZRIV Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 (edited) If you brake to stop with a firm pedal, and then the pedal continues to sink, the master cylinder is bad, or you have a fluid leak. If the pedal is moving, fluid has to be moving. If the fluid isn't moving, then the MC piston seals are allowing fluid to pass by internally. Assuming the brake shoes are correctly adjusted and already against the drums at 4 corners after braking, there is no more travel in the wheel cylinders so fluid won't move unless its leaking externally or past the MC piston seals. Drum brake systems on these cars are superior but time takes its toll on efficiency from mismatched or cheap parts installed over the years, to incorrect installations, to drum condition, to worn parts, wheel cylinders, etc. Certainly they can and do still work with various condition deficiency, but not like they should. As jframe said its usually money well spent to do a total brake overhaul when you plan to drive and enjoy the car unless you know it has already been done correctly. Always buy and pay up for best quality parts you can find. If available, I'd buy a set of 40 year old NORS brake shoes before anything new today. Don't replace drums unless absolutely necessary. Have ID checked on originals and have them cut and cleaned up. I prefer to send out a MC and have it sleeved with brass or stainless vs buying a chinese over the counter reman or new. Edited August 19, 2022 by JZRIV (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 I agree with Jason, it sounds like the master cylinder is failing. Check the fluid level. If it's low, look at the backside of the backing plates at each wheel. A leaking wheel cylinder will usually show a wet trail and if bad enough fluid will travel down the inner sidewall of the tire. If the wheels look dry, use a mirror and look up under the master cylinder at the face of the booster. A master cylinder leak can leave a fluid trail there. If that's dry, look up under the dash at the brake rod where it enters the master cylinder. A leak there will dribble down the toe board and be hidden under the carpet. Note that someone had installed the wrong master cylinder on my '67 before I bought it. It had a disc brake master on it with the large forward fluid reservoir. The drum brake master has equal size (small) front/rear reservoirs. When you have the hydraulic system open replace ALL of the hydraulic hoses, unless you're sure they are newer. Bad hoses can cause dragging brakes and a host of other issues; possibly even the one you describe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 19, 2022 Author Share Posted August 19, 2022 Thanks. Will inspect further for leaks. Recommendations on brand or source for master cylinder/ booster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NC1968Riviera Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 I like the idea of having your own message thread for your Riv. I wish I had thought of that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted August 20, 2022 Share Posted August 20, 2022 I bought mine from RockAuto. NAPA should also have them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 20, 2022 Author Share Posted August 20, 2022 Buick is currently under the knife. I have the radiator at the shop and I am currently working to remove the timing cover. I have the gaskets and my new TA cover, oil pump, and water pump. However my rockauto shipment that was supposed to be here yesterday now shows delayed with fedex. Also found rust under battery tray I have to deal with. So my Sunday test drive is definitely not going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 20, 2022 Author Share Posted August 20, 2022 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 20, 2022 Author Share Posted August 20, 2022 All of this for oil leak.... But I found it! 1/8 inch gap between the ends of rope seal with a half a tube of rtv gooped on it and around crank bolt to try to slow it down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted August 21, 2022 Share Posted August 21, 2022 Did you put the roller timing set on, or was that there when you opened it up? If the latter, then whoever was in there last apparently destroyed the front seal when they installed it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 21, 2022 Author Share Posted August 21, 2022 Receipts show the roller timing set was purchased in 2012 with the cam. Was told motor was freshened up at that time with new bearings and rings but no receipts for those. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 22, 2022 Author Share Posted August 22, 2022 Waiting for fan clutch, belts, and some odds and ends from rockauto. It was raining all day here so I couldn't treat my rust. The product I am using needs lower humidity. Anyway this is where I stopped today. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telriv Posted August 22, 2022 Share Posted August 22, 2022 Get rid of the crap/cheap rotor, cap, points & condenser. Go to NAPA & get some quality parts. OR upgrade to electronic conversion kits I can provide. Many pluses with no minus. Just my thoughts & observations. Tom T. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 22, 2022 Author Share Posted August 22, 2022 Those are blue streak made by standard motor (I think). It was a budget buy to get me by. The distributor needs a full refresh and is number matching and I haven't wanted it down for weeks to send it out. Thinking I might get an HEI or a TA ready to run small cap electronic and put that on when I send the original out for refurb. Don't have anyone local with a Sun machine. The old hot rod shop here that used to do it closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
telriv Posted August 22, 2022 Share Posted August 22, 2022 I, as well as others, can probably knock it out within a week. Tom T. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 22, 2022 Author Share Posted August 22, 2022 Everyday Performance and Advanced distributors both said 2-6 weeks. I think there is quite a bit of wear in the bushings and this distributor had way too much mechanical advance when I got it. (30*) I made some bushings to limit the mechanical advance to 22* and swapped springs to bring it in at about 2800 and set the dwell and called it good for the time being. But getting it rebuilt is at the top of my list after I get this timing cover replaced and I can finally drive over 70mph without puking out a quart of oil every 60 miles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 23, 2022 Author Share Posted August 23, 2022 Found a leak in my brake lines that most likely is causing the pedal fade at stop lights I am getting occasionally. It is leaking at the feed line to the metering/proportioning block for the front wheels. The line is extremely tight and I can't get it to snug up or break loose. Got it soaking in liquid wrench but there is a pretty good chance I am going to ruin a line trying address the leak. Front reservoir was half empty from about 3k miles ago when my notes say I topped it off. Got my fan clutch and other parts from RockAuto yesterday but the radiator shop called and said they found multiple pin holes after cleaning and pressure testing and instead of $100 for a clean and test it is going to be closer to $400 for the repair. No ETA when that will be complete. They told me that they could do the work the same day if I had it to them by 9am... 3 Days ago... So Yeah... Still too humid here to treat my rust and I can't get my old fan clutch studs out of the old water pump to save my life. So things seem to be going as usual for me.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted August 23, 2022 Share Posted August 23, 2022 As we used to say in the Army " It's either FUBAR or SNAFU." Ahh! The joys of working on old cars. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianM Posted August 23, 2022 Author Share Posted August 23, 2022 yeah I tried the double nut trick to get the studs out of the old water pump and ripped the threads out of the nuts I was using... I think they might have been in there a while. On a separate note I have the flare nut on one of the transmission lines is seized to the line. Any good tricks for breaking that loose without twisting the line into a pretzel? I have it soaking in liquid wrench currently and have already tried enough heat to make the trans fluid catch on fire. At this point I am looking at cutting the end off and putting a new nut and flaring the end again and trying to stretch the line out enough to reach the radiator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted August 23, 2022 Share Posted August 23, 2022 I bought my 63 with an auxiliary transmission cooler inserted into one of the lines. It was installed by cutting a section out of the line and attaching using flexible hoses. No problems or leaks. Leave section of what’s attached to your radiator and attach it to the rest of the line using some hose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BulldogDriver Posted August 23, 2022 Share Posted August 23, 2022 If you have access to a double flare tool just flare the end out to a bulge and not all the way to a double flare. Will hold a worm clamp just fine. Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZRIV Posted August 24, 2022 Share Posted August 24, 2022 I hope the shop is doing a recore on the radiator. And they use a MADE in USA copper core not a chinese core. Cost is typically in the $500 range. You don't want to go cheap on the rad. Ask them exactly how they are repairing and assuming a recore what type of core. Nut frozen to tranny line. I am wondering how you got the line removed from rad. Anyway be patient, try a different penetrating oil. I am hearing great things about Free All from pros. Some penetrating oils work better than others depending on the specific application so always good to try different ones. Keep heating, soak, let cool, heating, soak, let cool many times. It will break loose. The expansion and contraction from the heat-cool process will help it loosen up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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