prewarnut Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 Limousine with coachwork by Binder, Paris, courtesy of BHC. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted June 29 Author Share Posted June 29 Two comments. Dan, thanks for posting. First, the interior shot of Brewster Town Car shows a door panel with the window winder in the upper middle of the door. That is the same type and position for the window winder as is found on my later Limousine. Does anyone have experience with these cable lifted window winders? I am not to that point yet but would like to understand the workings before I do doors and window winders. The second car depicted has one unique jump seat. I have never seen anything like that. It appears to be adjustable per a person's desire. Great pictures! I hope you were able to get many more custom body pictures. Wait..... This is Locomobile........they are all custom. 🙂 Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 This limousine was purchased for $10,000. and shipped to Havana, Cuba. I do not know the carrossier. The first owner was a Señior Pelayos. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted June 29 Share Posted June 29 That reminds me of the King of Iran's Pierce Arrow. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted June 30 Author Share Posted June 30 The interior trim on the Havana Locomobile looks to be diamond tufted polished leather and the interior roof looks to be done in open finished wood, like a boat. Most unusual, but these are custom, high end automobiles. Al 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Dan, are you back at the Library in Bridgeport? I assume that is where these fantastic photos are coming from? Thank you for posting them. Great stuff! A.J. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 A.J., yes, I'm trying to get a handle on the collection. While the former archivist did a great job of cataloguing a few years back she didn't have technical knowledge and some details of the collection are not noted. I am both attempting to understand the scope of its contents, photo-document what I can and also create a slightly more detailed list of objects and quantity in each box. While some inter-office memos surface and some blueprints exist I think the vast drawers of prints were discarded. I do want to look at the model 90 stuff under Durant as the index suggests this may be more complete. Overall I at least have a better appreciation of Locomobile. In just looking at the number of times they tore down engines in the Experimental Department, swapped parts, ran things hard, re-balanced cranks, changed out the electric clock for the hand-wound Waltham, ordered 3 different brands of magnetos I can say that no detail was too small to be overlooked. Their reputation was earned. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 12 hours ago, prewarnut said: This limousine was purchased for $10,000. and shipped to Havana, Cuba. I do not know the carrossier. The first owner was a Señior Pelayos. It’s a Springfield Custom Body job………built in Springfield and installed in Bridgeport. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 11 hours ago, alsancle said: That reminds me of the King of Iran's Pierce Arrow. Like FDR’s lap robe from his Pierce Arrow, I own the lap robe from this car also. Bought it from Marge Brunn in the 80’s. The family likes it so much they kept it. It has the Sha’s family crest on it. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted June 30 Author Share Posted June 30 Dan are you noting much information on the Locomobile technical aspects just prior to the advent of the Models 38 and 48? Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 (edited) Al, I have perhaps looked at 1/5 of the collection. What strikes me is that actually technical details for steam, early electrics and early gas are non-existent so far. A number of photos and general profile blueprints (only to denote style - no measurements) exist. Most of the technical details, correspondence and testing are from the mid-teens. I'll keep at it. I may need to break for a little and as I mentioned to Frank I have a favor to return to the archivist and the library. Here's a 48 chassis "in the white" as they would say. Year unknown, but I believe mid-teens. This is specifically noted as a "48" but I wonder if the engine is a "38" from the close spacing of the plugs and head casting. Comments? BTW most of the Locomobile photos from the mid-teens have only one taillight on the left. I believe this photo also supports that if you trace the single line on the spare tire carrier. Edited June 30 by prewarnut (see edit history) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted June 30 Author Share Posted June 30 Dan, I suspect that the chassis shown above could be a 38 per the shape of the upper radiator tank, (discussed elsewhere about radiators). Maybe others much more familiar with the Model 38's will share thoughts. Your efforts are greatly appreciated. On another note, are you seeing very much information that directly relates to marine and industrial conversions of any engines, four cylinder, six cylinder as well as eight cylinder? WW1 must have drawn a significant amount of Locomobile resources towards, Locomobile and Riker trucks. That area of our interest is rather quiet, but significant none the less Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted June 30 Author Share Posted June 30 More. After studying the above picture, I see that this engine is also single ignition. I have the idea that all 48's were double ignition but am not sure on the Model 38's. I suppose this could be some type of test chassis and not built for resale? Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 Al, This chassis photo was from the same photography/print company Arpeda out of NY and I suspect not a test chassis but more for promotional or archival records as with the other coach photos I showed. There are a few more but no apparent experimental or test cars were in this album. I do then think this could be a model 38. It seems a lot of things were labelled 48 but perhaps in later years second-hand. I do wonder if anyone has percentage breakdowns of 38 versus 48 production. No, I have not seen marine conversions but some records regarding the engine and design of Riker's yachts exist. I have avoided those boxes, etc as not specifically germane to my interest. Also there are boxes on war contracts but I have not yet investigated those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ittenbacher Frank Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 5 hours ago, prewarnut said: Al, I have perhaps looked at 1/5 of the collection. What strikes me is that actually technical details for steam, early electrics and early gas are non-existent so far. A number of photos and general profile blueprints (only to denote style - no measurements) exist. Most of the technical details, correspondence and testing are from the mid-teens. I'll keep at it. I may need to break for a little and as I mentioned to Frank I have a favor to return to the archivist and the library. Here's a 48 chassis "in the white" as they would say. Year unknown, but I believe mid-teens. This is specifically noted as a "48" but I wonder if the engine is a "38" from the close spacing of the plugs and head casting. Comments? BTW most of the Locomobile photos from the mid-teens have only one taillight on the left. I believe this photo also supports that if you trace the single line on the spare tire carrier. I love this photo! So many interesting details! I am sure this is a 1915 model chassis as shown in the 1915 parts book No. 54. From top down jumps into my eyes: single wire to just one rear left light. The way the upper quarter leaves are attached to the frame, such a big offset. The two large U-channels between the frame longitudinal beams and the cross member just before the fuel tank are used on the 1915 model, but not any more on the 1917 model. Smooth, light-coloured tires. Running boards seem smooth, probably linoleum. The wooden latches for the spare parts in the underfloor compartments, great. Brake adjusting handles clearly visible, also the rear axles truss rod. Unfortunately the leather band around the read block-type universal joint is not clearly visible. Finally I see the original battery cover. The position of the instruments and switches in the dashboard indicates the year very clearly: Compare the chassis with the 1915 parts book and later cars: everything is in a different position! Single ignition, ok, but also the single exhaust ports on each cylinder block, unlike the next year with dual (totally six) exhaust ports. The carburetor is not visible, but the hot air pipe from the exhaust heater to the carb ist very distinctive. The radiator cap without hole, painted radiator, no script. Little paper labels on the handle for the air compressor and on the light switches. A strange way of routing the speedometer cable. Two narrow, cylindrical crankcase breathers, the next year had one of these and the other one with a funnel on top. Front axle has different grease caps than later cars. You can even see the leather straps on the protection cover for the steering ball joint, amazing. Best regards Frank 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ak Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 On 6/30/2024 at 7:38 AM, edinmass said: It’s a Springfield Custom Body job………built in Springfield and installed in Bridgeport. wooden slat ceiling as in a yacht of the day 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted July 11 Author Share Posted July 11 My thoughts also. I just saw a very authentic Yacht in the San Diego harbor. The roof was elegant. Al 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everitt Posted July 12 Share Posted July 12 Hi, here are some pictures that are 8.5"x5.75" each and are what Locomobile called "Some Recent Examples of Locomobile Coach Work" that came out of their Custom Department. The pictures here is about one half of the pictures that came in the display pack. I did not post the actual packet they came in running out of digital space. It looks like this array may have come out in the early 1920's as some of the cars shown have drum headlights but the earlier stacked electric light is on most of the cars. Greg 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everitt Posted July 12 Share Posted July 12 Hi again, Locomobile Coach Work part 2. Greg 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted July 12 Share Posted July 12 I believe these were compiled in the "teens" and not the '20s despite a number with drum headlights. Akin to Pierce Arrow with a few sporting "New York" headlights, there probably was a preference for different lights and additionally NYC and Philadelphia were significant markets for Locomobile; I'm not sure if the taste for headlights were different there. The recently restored Farnum and Nelson Sportif (on offer for $750K) is a 1917 with drum headlights; supposedly an accurate restoration. At the BHC I can see there that there are original proofs of these plates and a few original photographs which were used to form the final proofs. I can't find a specific date but based on style I'd guess 1918. I don't believe when Hare's took over around 1920 they would publish like this. Generally Hare's made sure to have the name Hare's at the bottom and most advertising that I've seen by them are larger format and with a lot more decorative flourishes in the margins. Lastly, these plates again seem to attest that only a single tail light was the norm despite so many cars sporting a pair, which I find interesting. I wonder if people with extant examples find the wiring loom looks different on the right rear side which would substantiate a later addition. Anyhow, I mention all this to clarify the historical record not to be argumentative. Nice find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everitt Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 Thanks for the clarification, all good here. I agree we need to keep things right historically. I found these at Hershey last year along with a number of other later model Locomobile stuff covering the Junior Eight, 8-80, and Ninety. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted July 13 Author Share Posted July 13 Greg, can you post the 8 cylinder pictures you mentioned, over in the 8 cylinder chat area? Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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