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1957 Pontiac


deac

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I replaced the plugs yesterday.  The old plugs were sooty but dry, no wet oil build up.  If you get beyond the soot the plugs were pretty good.  Sooty plugs are often caused by a rich condition. I guess is the former owner did not know how to get a balanced air/fuel mix on of a Rochester 2bbl car and drove it in that condition. Better he drove in the too rich condition rather in the too lean condition!

 

I wasn't able to complete the swap as I ran out of time. But I did manage pull the right & left valve covers and the cylinder heads looked good so were the inside of the valve covers didn't have any greasy build up on them.

Edited by deac (see edit history)
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Thanks for your input. I was aware of that deep green being the factory color in'57. two thing factored into my decision; first, I don't have any intention of pulling the complete engine for repaint of the block. Second the block is painted a lighter shade of paint then what I applied.  So I was thinking the color difference wouldn't be too stark between the block/heads and the manifold/valve covers.

 

I pulled the radiator and sent it out to a shop because when I pulled the upper radiator hose off a bunch of rubber chunks were present in the radiator neck.  When picked it up the radiator shop told me that a good part of my radiator was plugged up. So it looks like I will have rebuilt the cooling system when I'm done.

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  • 1 month later...

My 57 is coming along. I have accumulated all the hard to find parts. The chrome bumper end caps, front seat end trims, throttle linkage, the Carter AFB carburetor and the corresponding manifold.  I have completed the cooling system rebuild.  I sent out the clicking and inaccurate speedometer for repairs and when it comes back I will replace all the instrument lights and under the dash including the speedometer.  A lot time and money spent on this car. Looking forward to driving a bitchin 57!

 

I want to comment that refers to a post made much earlier in this thread about the manifold purchase.  As I may have mentioned earlier I bought the manifold and the valve covers from a wrecking yard in Arizona called Desert Valley Auto Parts. These guys know you need parts for your car and charge ridiculous prices for them. Needless I don't recommend these thieves. But I do give them credit for having these older cars.  If you do business with them know what you want and have an idea what the average price is on ebay and other sites otherwise they'll cause you pain in your wallet.

Edited by deac (see edit history)
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  • 2 weeks later...

I found the the arm of the neutral safety switch had broke off from the switch itself. So to fix that issue, the former owner decided it was good idea to bypass the switch and twist the wires together and not use solder, shrink wrap or electrical tape. I replaced that switch and properly connected the arm. I will wait until after the engine is running to make the electrical connection and adjustment until after the engine is running  Old cars.... expect the unexpected!!!  I got the speedometer back from Gail's Speedometer and it looks great. They said the it was a mess inside. They rebuilt the odometer and the speed cylinder as well as repaired the magnet shaft and hairspring.  I will reinstall it this weekend. Anyone who needs speedometer and gauge repair I would recommend Gail's @ (949) 646-9120. 

 

I found that the manifold mounted throttle linkage and bracket were missing.  Desert Valley in Arizona said they had what I needed and the total was $300 for those parts. It was then that I realized DVAP is a ripoff. It took a bit of patience but I finally found those parts for a total of $75.00. I installed them and everything fit like a glove. I am going to know a whole lot about the 57 Pontiacs when I get done with this car. 

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On 5/15/2022 at 12:05 AM, deac said:

My 57 is coming along. I have accumulated all the hard to find parts. The chrome bumper end caps, front seat end trims, throttle linkage, the Carter AFB carburetor and the associates manifold.  I have completed the cooling system rebuild.  I sent out the clicking and inaccurate speedometer for repairs and when it comes back I will replace all the instrument lights and under the dash including the speedometer.  A lot time and money spent on this car. Looking forward to driving a bitchin 57!

 

I want to comment that refers to a post made much earlier in this thread about the manifold purchase.  As I may have mentioned earlier I bought the manifold and the valve covers from a wrecking yard in Arizona called Desert Valley Auto Parts. These know you need parts for your car and charge ridiculous prices for them. Needless I don't recommend these thieves. But I do give them credit for having these older cars.  If you do business with them know what you want and have an idea what the average price is Freebay and other sites otherwise they'll cause you pain in your wallet.

Just curious, you said you rebuilt the cooling system. My question is; where did you get the water distribution tubes? and were they copper or stainless?

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17 hours ago, Pfeil said:

Just curious, you said you rebuilt the cooling system. My question is; where did you get the water distribution tubes? and were they copper or stainless?

I believe you are referring to the pipes that go down the frame from the firewall to the under seat heater.  Those tubes are almost impossible to find because they rotted out over the years. I guess if I was a real purest I could have gone to a plumbing supply store and bought metal pipes and put them in.  But instead I used 'green stripe' heater hose by Gates and secured to to the inner side of the frame just like the pipes were.  These pipes are not seen so I elected not to go through the trouble a fabricating them. Now there are 2 metal pipes on the left side of the engine compartment.  I had the pipe coming off the defroster core and used it. There is one more that goes below the battery tray which I have about half the length of that pipe. I'm sure I won't find that one either so I will slightly modify the one I have and use it too.  So it will look good but it won't be a direct factory match. When the car is drivable I will buy a run of pipe and have a shop bend it so it conforms to the original factory look. But for now I'm okay with the setup the way it is.  Besides the car is apart right now and I want to get it back together and get it running to confirm to intake manifold/carburetor swap and the cooling system repairs.

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2 hours ago, deac said:

I believe you are referring to the pipes that go down the frame from the firewall to the under seat heater.  Those tubes are almost impossible to find because they rotted out over the years. I guess if I was a real purest I could have gone to a plumbing supply store and bought metal pipes and put them in.  But instead I used 'green stripe' heater hose by Gates and secured to to the inner side of the frame just like the pipes were.  These pipes are not seen so I elected not to go through the trouble a fabricating them. Now there are 2 metal pipes on the left side of the engine compartment.  I had the pipe coming off the defroster core and used it. There is one more that goes below the battery tray which I have about half the length of that pipe. I'm sure I won't find that one either so I will slightly modify the one I have and use it too.  So it will look good but it won't be a direct factory match. When the car is drivable I will buy a run of pipe and have a shop bend it so it conforms to the original factory look. But for now I'm okay with the setup the way it is.  Besides the car is apart right now and I want to get it back together and get it running to confirm to intake manifold/carburetor swap and the cooling system repairs.

No, the water distribution pipes are in the cylinder head. Pontiac engines from 1933-1954 (Flathead six and eight) and V-8 from 1955-1959 have water distribution tubes. The flathead engines have the tube in the block and the OHV V-8's have one in each cylinder head.

The one below I have shown is for the V-8;

 image.jpeg.5b91e93d142940c009db484fc6ee2db6.jpeg

Those tubes direct the coolant right to the place in the head where on the opposite side of the water jacket is the exhaust valves are. This ensures the exhaust valve seats are cooled. The system is called reverse flow cooling. Cooled water from the water pump is first pumped to these tubes first before being recirculated to the block. They don't last forever and must be checked. In the time we had our 59 Pontiac (1959-1969) we replaced the tubes twice.

 reverseCoolingDiagram.jpg56EngineFront.jpg

Looking at this cutaway below, look at the water-jacket and how it's shape is pointed to the exhaust valve. The tube can also be seen in the water jacket and the holes in it are pointed towards the exhaust seat.

 image.jpeg.908aabb26782fe7e7a511e27ea2642ea.jpeg

Edited by Pfeil (see edit history)
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Oh those! No I did not replace them. I had inspected that tube in my 40 straight 8 but it didn't need replacing. This engine looks pretty clean and it runs strong so I left them alone. I did replace those 2 short hoses going from the water pump to the heads. I am pretty sure CPR will have new ones if I find that need them. This weekend I may just pull them out and double check them... Thanks for the heads up!

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7 hours ago, deac said:

Oh those! No I did not replace them. I had inspected that tube in my 40 straight 8 but it didn't need replacing. This engine looks pretty clean and it runs strong so I left them alone. I did replace those 2 short hoses going from the water pump to the heads. I am pretty sure CPR will have new ones if I find that need them. This weekend I may just pull them out and double check them... Thanks for the heads up!

The only way to inspect them is to pull them out-or if you have a bore scope you can look through the length of the tubes. 

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This past memorial day weekend I was able to install instrument cluster, mount the circular gauges and re-connect everything. The fittings for old copper oil line feeding the oil pressure gauge had seen better days so I replaced the line and fittings. It's kind of a mess of wiring underneath the dash but to Pontiacs credit the wire looms in these cars used a lot of plugs so it's not too bad.  I was able to replace the incorrect fuel pump with the proper pump for this car. The other little project was replacing the neutral safety switch. The switch is in and the arm is connected but I'll wait to make the electrical connects and adjust it until after the engine running.

 

To think that this whole started needing a fuel pump and the tri-power to a 4bbl carb conversion was going straight forward and a few days has actually taken over a month and more; but that's old cars!  Good news is that I think I finally got a pretty good grip my '57 Pontiac. This thing should drive much better after I'm done!

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A new project was uncovered on my '57. I believe the reverse lights on  the Chieftains were an option. I have in the recent past replaced the reverse light lenses and noticed that the light bulbs were there. So with that finding and I thought that the car did indeed have reverse lights.  However when I replaced the neutral safety switch noticed the wiring for the reverse lights were missing! So I removed the right rear reverse lens and found the bulb would push into the socket but wouldn't turn nor pop back to normal operating position. Then I tried the parking/brake light bulb found and that to be completely frozen. So I buttoned it back up and it goes on the list of "to-do's".  So just when I thought I had uncovered 99 percent of the issues that 1 percent got me!

 

I have come realize that on this car take nothing at face value. If something this looks in good order I must dig further inspect it. Instead of the phase the Reagan said "trust but verify" on this car it's "don't trust but verify".

 

Old cars, expect the unexpected!!

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  • 2 weeks later...

A friend was able to help bending the fuel tube. He had done the tube in my 40 Pontiac and once again he proved he's a master at it. It may not be factory correct but I know it is done right! At the same time we noticed the part of the fuel line going from the left fender well  leading into the engine compartment was routed through the suspension and the last 6 inches going to the fuel pump was done in rubber hose which was dried and brittle. He re-routed the line so it will not interfere with the suspension and replaced the hose. All the inverted flare fittings associated with the fuel were replaced (no pipe tape)!

 

Then I was able to get the radiator and fan assembled.

 

 

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Edited by deac (see edit history)
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I was also able to pull off the left & right side body colored painted headlight pieces to see if the proper gaskets are in the headlight assembly which the are none! But I was able to install the rubber gasket between the body pieces. I looked at pictures online and there's a lot of 57's that don't have these gaskets and few do. Then I went to my parts and found there is a part number for that gasket. I think 2 painted body parts bolted together will chip eventually. 

 

 

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Edited by deac (see edit history)
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  • 2 weeks later...
On 6/7/2022 at 12:35 AM, deac said:

 

I have come realize that on this car take nothing at face value. If something this looks in good order I must dig further inspect it. Instead of the phase the Reagan said "trust but verify" on this car it's "don't trust but verify".

 

Old cars, expect the unexpected!!

Funny about that. Unless a car is an unmolested survivor, then the POs have got a lot to answer for.  Don’t expect anything to be correct, then you are never disappointed. You are right, just keep digging and correct it as you go. At least you know it will be right. Great posts and excellent pictures on a very pretty car. I started my car hobby with a ‘35 Silver Streak then a ‘40 Silver Arrow, so have an affinity with the Big Chief.

Rodney 😀😀😀😀😀😀

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Well I pressure tested the coolant system for leaks and found and fixed two. Then I replaced the battery cables and connected those cables to the battery and cranked the old girl; blamo, it started! I found the headlights, taillights and 3 of the 4 gauges work. The most common gauge to fail is the fuel gauge and that's the one the doesn't work.  On my 40 Torpedo I had the same problem and I sent out the sending unit to John Wolfe and it came back perfectly restored so I think will use those guys again. The timing notches on the crank pulley are not marked so timing the engine is not exact so I am going to have to re-establish TDC on order to time it correctly.  After that I have to do a transmission service and replace an O-ring on the dipstick tube and then I think I will be able to road test it. Still more projects to do on this car.

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6 hours ago, deac said:

Well I pressure tested the coolant system for leaks and found and fixed two. Then I replaced the battery cables and connected those cables to the battery and cranked the old girl; blamo, it started! I found the headlights, taillights and 3 of the 4 gauges work. The most common gauge to fail is the fuel gauge and that's the one the doesn't work.  On my 40 Torpedo I had the same problem and I sent out the sending unit to John Wolfe and it came back perfectly restored so I think will use those guys again. The timing notches on the crank pulley are not marked so timing the engine is not exact so I am going to have to re-establish TDC on order to time it correctly.  After that I have to do a transmission service and replace an O-ring on the dipstick tube and the I think then I will be able to road test test it. Still more projects to do on this car.

 

On 5/18/2022 at 5:57 AM, Gary W said:

Here's my step-by-step from my '37 Buick.  maybe it'll help you with the steps involved:

 

 

Deac

There are some simple tests you can make while still in the car about checking if the sender unit or dash gauge is faulty. They are documented extremely well on the above Buick Prewar site for a ‘37 Buick (Gary and his Restoration has begun). There are other posts on the same subject on that site that are worth looking at as how to calibrate the gauge to be accurate.

 

Simply removing the wire on the tank sender should see the gauge read and grounding it will see it move either to FULL or EMPTY, proving that the dash gauge is good. Other tests can be made once the sender is removed.

 

Often faulty sender units can be cured by simply adding an extra ground wire to the unit.

 

Well worth having a look before you spend the money

Just my two bobs worth

Rodney 😀😀😀😀😀😀😀

Edited by rodneybeauchamp
Spellcheck 🤔🤔🤔🤔 (see edit history)
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I have to re-wire the car and have already ordered a wire loom/kit from Rhode Island Wiring.  At that point I will troubleshoot the fuel gauge but I am appreciative of your troubleshooting method. I hope it's just a ground but this car has been a challenge but I will ultimately persevere!!!

 

 

Edited by deac (see edit history)
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  • 3 weeks later...
On 7/4/2022 at 11:28 AM, deac said:

The most common gauge to fail is the fuel gauge and that's the one the doesn't work. 

When I first got my car the gas gauge read full. OP said I'm getting a full tank. The fuel tank needed repairs so I pulled the sending unit.....couldn't move the darn thing! Picked up a new one from CPR complete with the sock on the end. 

 

IMG_6625.JPG

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On 3/28/2022 at 8:56 AM, deac said:

Here's are the manifold and valve cover

PXL_20220326_145319302.jpg

I'm using the same intake manifold with a rebuilt rochester 4gc carburetor to upgrade my 59 389 two barrel high compression engine, going into my 1953 Pontiac Chieftain Custom Catalina

 

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I was pretty sure my brakes were okay and I wouldn't have mess with them. Well I would say I didn't look at one thing and that thing leaped out and grabbed me. I was under the car and noticed that the master cylinder looked like it was eight days older than dirt. That made me look harder so I pulled the boot back and sure enough there was brake fluid in there. I found a master cylinder at a decent price at Ames Performance. They don't have a lot of stuff for 57's as they're more into the 60's and 70's Pontiacs but I did order the brake master. I also replaced the old vacuum wiper motor with an electric unit. I routed the wire through the firewall and neatly under the dash. I won't connect the power wire until I rewire the car. The taillight bulbs were hard to remove from their sockets in the right and left taillight assemblies so out the assemblies came. I was able dislodge the light bulb, clean out the sockets, replace the bulbs and mount the assemblies back to the car and now the lights do work including the license plate lights!

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On 7/4/2022 at 3:26 PM, rodneybeauchamp said:

Deac

There are some simple tests you can make while still in the car about checking if the sender unit or dash gauge is faulty. They are documented extremely well on the above Buick Prewar site for a ‘37 Buick (Gary and his Restoration has begun). There are other posts on the same subject on that site that are worth looking at as how to calibrate the gauge to be accurate.

 

Simply removing the wire on the tank sender should see the gauge read and grounding it will see it move either to FULL or EMPTY, proving that the dash gauge is good. Other tests can be made once the sender is removed.

 

Often faulty sender units can be cured by simply adding an extra ground wire to the unit.

 

Well worth having a look before you spend the money

Just my two bobs worth

Thanks to you guys for the help. I only get a day or maybe 2 on the weekend to work on the car. Moreover I drive 45 miles one way to work on it. Yes, its a long day but I love old cars; it's my passion! My priority is the the trans reseal and the brake master cylinder right now. If I get a chance to troubleshoot the gauge before the priorities I will definitely spend time on the fuel gauge.

Edited by deac (see edit history)
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  • 2 weeks later...

I did drain the transmission and drop the pan. There was no metal contamination and the screen looked good. I also replaced the O ring on the dipstick tube. Haven't refilled the transmission yet. According to the manual the other seals should not replaced unless you are rebuilding the trans. I do believe the leak was from the dipstick O ring. The output shaft seal was dry and so was the rear shaft housing seal. Fingers crossed!!

 

I changed the master cylinder an proceeded to bleed the brake lines. The first line I went bleed (right rear) wouldn't spit out a drop of fluid. Tried the left rear line and that one bled as did the front 2 lines. I am going to replace the rubber lines in the front and the one near the differential. Also going to replace the steel line that runs alongside the differential connects to the rear cylinders. Then I will pull the front and rear drums off for a complete brake inspection. More work to be done....

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  • 1 month later...

I the was able pull all of the wheels and brake drums off the car and to my surprise it all looked relatively good. The front shoes still had plenty of life left in them. The rear brake shoes need to be replaced. I am replacing all of the brake hardware; springs, nails etc. The drums are all mismatched and most likely came from a wrecking yard. Definitely better that some other old cars I have owned. 

master cylder.jpg

rear hard brake line 2.jpg

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Edited by deac (see edit history)
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  • 1 month later...

it's been a while since I posted on this thread but life got in the way! 

 

After replacing the master cylinder and going through the brakes. The drums seem to have come from a wrecking yard and 3 of them were okay. But I had to replace the 4th one that was on the left rear of the car along with the rear shoes. All 4 wheel cylinders had pits in the bores so I replace those as well. The brakes are together, bled and adjusted! So  today I will fill the trans with fresh fluid and fire the old girl up and road test it. Once I know the girl is roadworthy then I will do other smaller projects as time permits. However there are 2 big projects that need attention in the near future and they are wiring and a front suspension rebuild. I already received the new wire kit from Rhode Island Wiring and I will wait to buy the rebuild kit for the time being.

 

 

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Edited by deac (see edit history)
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Today I put the front seat back in the car and fired the bitch. Added trans fluid until full and put the trans in drive and bingo it engaged drive and reverse without issue.  I the topped off the coolant, put it in drive and drove out of the shop and around the block. It had good oil pressure, didn't overheat and the amps gauge showed normal operation. The drive went well but the brakes are close but a bit out of adjustment. There is a dead spot in the carburetor at about 2000 RPM's. The she needs to be dialed in. But heck great progress this weekend!

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You mentioned this car over on the Buick forum so I decided to drop over and take a look.  What a great job you have done with this car!  Your work with both the car and this thread are most appreciated.

 

Neil

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10 minutes ago, neil morse said:

You mentioned this car over on the Buick forum so I decided to drop over and take a look.  What a great job you have done with this car!  Your work with both the car and this thread are most appreciated.

 

Neil

I make an effort to read and contribute to these threads just from what I see in the hobby. You comments are much appreciated.

Edited by deac (see edit history)
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I have to add to my comment above. The speedometer made a repetitive click noise let alone the unit was inaccurate before I had it fixed. On my inaugural drive around the block it was quite refreshing to hear the motor and not the clicking from the speedometer and it displayed accurately without bouncing around!

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  • 2 weeks later...

I monitored a leak from the the pinion seal over the past few months and damn it it didn't get better; it got worse! So I stopped in at CPR and Rich got a pinion seal for and I was able to get it installed yesterday. At the same time the copper clips were missing from the universal joint. Those clips keep the driveshaft centered so I had to replace the joint. Although I hadn't heard any abnormal noise from the differential I removed the fill plug and nothing came out. I added almost a quart of axle oil to the differential!!!

 

 

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I have to add an update: This morning I found the kick down rod that goes between the carburetor linkage and the transmission was too short. So I have to locate the correct one. But that didn't hold me back from getting to my goal for the day; the road test! I attempted to install the factory air cleaner/silencer. So I bought some 1/4-20 threaded rod, cut it to size and installed it. Well that was easy so I installed the air cleaner, only to find out the rod that supports the silencer was the wrong one. So I left the top off the air cleaner off. Not going let that stop me from my goal! I then jumped in the driver's seat and found the steering wheel was loose, ugh! Got got the tools and tightened up the steering! Started the engine, backed out of the shop and finally off I went on  the road test.  The engine ran smooth throughout the drive  Once I figured out the dual range transmission the fun factor increase 10 fold.  There were occasions where it bogged  because there was no kick down rod.  But if I shifted into low range drive the Chieftain showed me what it's made of; the thing hauled ass! The engine never ran hot or overheated and the there was good oil pressure. Earlier in the thread I said I practically replaced or rebuilt the whole cooling system and today my efforts paid off as the heater pushed out some hot air There are still projects left to be done on the 57 but I will be taking a break from this project because my newly purchased 40 Buick coupe is calling out for my attention....

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  • 3 months later...

I finally was able to swap cars and now my Pontiac is back in the shop. I started with the loose accelerator pedal. I found the rubber on the back of the pedal had deteriorated and 1 of the 2 mounting bolts were missing and the 2nd one very loose. On top of that the hinge bracket that secures the pedal to the floor was some poorly made home job. I found a used original pedal and bracket and mounted it on the floor and fit like a glove. But that brought on a related issue. The correctly mounted pedal doesn't line up with the accelerator rod ball stud leading to the engine compartment. I thought I had the original linkage assembly all figured out. So I think it's just the rods in the linkage assembly that are not connected correctly. If anyone has a 57, with the original Pontiac linkage setup that is working correctly can snap and post a few photos of it that would help.... a lot! 

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  • 4 weeks later...

I found out the reason why the accelerator pedal doesn't line up with the ball stud on the linkage is because the previous owner did another home fabricated slotted plate and attached it to the floor board to be sure the pedal remained in one place. Needless to say it was a mess. I have corrected it now and the pedal works like it did in 1957! Now I am on to the front bumper which I found was loose. The bumper is made up of 5 pieces and the height adjustment is done with eccentric bolts on the right and left sides.  But before I can do anything regarding the height I need to figure out why the right half of the bumper is further out than the left half. So this weekend will be filled with bumper work. Yes, these projects just keep coming....

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  • 2 weeks later...

Last weekend I got that front bumper dealt with looking good. I had to remove 3 of the 5 pieces of the bumper and straighten a slightly tweeked bracket. At that point it was a matter of mounting back on the car, adjusting it and then tightening it. Oh and I used a bunch of chrome polish while it was disassembled. 

 

The previous owner put a carpet kit in but it trimmed too aggressively leaving some areas around the door sills too short and exposing the metal floor. I found kick down rod so that install and adjustment will follow the carpet. At that point my Pontiac will be a solid driver. There are other projects to be done on the car but they don't infringe on the drivability.

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5 minutes ago, deac said:

But why didn't they finish process by cutting out the Hi Beam switch and the brake pedal?

Because no matter whether they cut the high beam hole or you do, it's still going to be wrong. It's also going to move after the carpet gets used a bit, so if it is right today, it will be wrong after a couple months of use. They have offloaded the responsibility for getting it wrong onto the person installing. You can try to estimate the distance and direction it is going to move and cut the hole where you think it needs to wind up. I do that. I sometimes miss, but it's better than doing nothing. It can help to look at the original carpet and see what direction the original carpet pulled away from the hole. Yes, the factory gets it wrong too. No one is immune. I don't know about the brake pedal.

 

Source: I worked in an upholstery and auto trim shop when I was a teenager. I have laid a lot of carpet in cars.

 

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I do appreciate your comments I learn a lot from you guys, thanks!

 

Well this weekend I was able to install the the ACC brand carpet kit. After removing the old kit I vacuumed the floor and laid down the front carpet. I located and cut the holes for the brake pedal, dimmer switch, further aligned the accelerator pedal for aa smoother operation.  Then I put the rear carpet piece in. There was a bit more trimming to do than I originally thought. The carpet with its jute backing obstructed the under seater heater vents so those areas I trimmed.  Finished up with the left and right door areas.  All in all it came out pretty good. Now I have to get the front kick panels.

 

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Edited by deac (see edit history)
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  • 2 weeks later...

Well I was able to get the passenger side kick panel and vent grille installed which was a rear pain  Unfortunately I painted the grilles in a blue/green color and I am pretty sure I will end up sand blasting them and paint them black. Similarly there is that strip between the door and the kick panel which I painted black and I wonder if there's a strip of win-lace that covers that strip; any advice would be appreciated.  I also installed the front seat and cleaned it but in the picture you some wet patches on the seat bottom. Set the timing, adjusted the idle speed and tomorrow I'm going to install and adjust the kick down rod.  As for the radio, the original unit doesn't work and weighs a ton so I think I will buy and install a Retro-Sounds AM/FM stereo; I have the front speaker box that goes below the dash.

PXL_20230415_234922430.jpg

Edited by deac (see edit history)
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