wayne sheldon

1972. I was going to college part time, and working almost full time. I had my 1929 Reo coupe, and a model T speedster, both of which ran well. The family's business was struggling a bit, and my mother's old car had blown the engine about a year earlier, and been junked. She had to either drive my dad's work station wagon, which was always crammed full of work stuff, or his 1951 Chevrolet 3/4 ton pickup, whichever one he was not driving that day. Sometimes I didn't want to drive my antiques, or leave them parked in some less than safe area. So I suggested I buy and repair a cheap car, and if they would cover the license and insurance, we could share the car. So I paid thirty dollars for a 1952 Chevrolet two door fastback. The fellow that had it, had bought it from where it had sat for about a decade, but supposedly "ran when parked". The fool put in a battery, and some fresh gasoline, then went straight out to see how fast it would go! Turned out I don't think the oil had been changed in about ten thousand miles, and he got only about three miles before throwing out a rod bearing! the crankshaft was basically destroyed. My dad had a bunch of extra 216 Chevy engine parts, so he donated those, and I pulled the engine and the two of us did a quicky refresh on it. Now, that engine was not all that good. The cylinders were four thousandths out of round, and believe it or not!? NINETEEN thousandths larger at the top than the bottom of the cylinders! YIKES! But a careful (???) valve and rings/gaskets turned it into the sweetest running 216 you ever heard! We put thirty thousand miles on that car before the speedometer cable broke, and probably another forty thousand after that. With fresh rings, as bad as those cylinders were, you could drive it all day long at 60 mph and it wouldn't burn a drop of oil! Push it to 65 mph and it would guzzle a quart in less than fifty miles. One day, dad decided to drive it from San Jose to Modesto California, a distance of about a hundred miles. Knowing his tendency to push cars faster than he should, I did the quick math and realized he would be crossing the couple/three mile long two lane bridge through the delta area just short of Modesto, right about the time the engine would run out of oil! I told him to stop before there was no place to stop and add some oil. He was a wonderful person in many ways? But taking advice from anyone else? He was always too smart to do that. So, naturally, he was about a hundred yards onto the no place to pull over bridge when the oil pressure dropped to zero. He eased it across and off the bridge area. Added a couple quarts and hoped. By the time he got home with the car, it had four knocking rods. Fortunately, the crankshaft this time was not hurt. And I spent a couple days doing an in-the-car rod bearing replacement project. We got a couple more good years out of that car until the transmission began to wear out (three speed jumping out of high gear, a common Chevrolet failing) . About then. my parents bought a mid 1960s Pontiac for my mom. About a month later my sister got her driver's license and went right out and wrecked it! The '52 Chevy had become practically not drivable. I had too many projects, had just gotten married, and some guy driving by wanted the desirable body style car more than anyone in my family did. So it went away for about three hundred dollars.

I do not know the car, or the seller myself, so have no advice to give. However, the seller has it listed for sale on the model T forum, and is a semi-regular poster over there. https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=40490 The price seems very reasonable. However? I am not sure Overland had a removeable head in 1915? I think maybe some models did? But the couple of them I knew owners of did not.

As one of the few people around that has actually had a Fuller, I can tell you that the few Jackson Michigan Fuller owners do keep somewhat in contact with each other. I had to sell mine some years ago for family reasons, and have not kept track of the Fuller owners since. Twenty year ago, there were seventeen Jackson Fullers believed/known to exist. Most of those were the two cylinder models. About a third of them were in running condition. And yes, one of the few errors in the Kimes and Clark book is the photos of the Nebraska and Jackson Michigan Fullers are slightly mixed up. The Jackson and Nebraska Fuller automobiles were manufactured at about the same time and there were some similarities, however they were not related to each other. With connections to the Cartercar and Jackson (No hill too steep, no sand too deep), the Jackson Michigan Fuller has a very interesting history!

Other areas of automobiles for sale are specifically for members of the AACA or the forum to list their own cars for sale, under their own names if they want, or avatars if they prefer. Easily half of the cars for sale shared in the "not mine" section are for sale by people that are not very familiar with antique automobiles, and often do not really understand what they have. Often, they are clueless to their own ignorance. Many of the listings are by flippers hoping to score a big profit, usually on a car that was barely worth what they paid for it in the first place. A lot of others are family members expecting a big windfall from a family member's treasured old car. These cases are often very sad. I have seen it hundreds of times. Dad or grandpa or uncle so-n-so loved his old car. But nobody else really cared about it when they were alive. They didn't ask questions, didn't help clean it up for a local showing. The car was said to "be valuable", but actual dollars were seldom discussed. And even if they were, we have all seen it many times. "My car is the finest one there is!" Most of us have a special set of "rose colored glasses" for our favorite cars. But when the older member of the family dies, the younger generation sees only dollar signs. I think most of the regulars on here try to be fair with most of their comments. Usually negative comments are intended to point out failings in the vehicle or its listing. Most of what I read I see as not so much being harsh, as it is trying to help people that may be somewhat interested to make a more informed decision. Comparing current listings with similar past listings are usually very helpful. Most discussions of value I read seem to be geared toward educating both the sellers (if they are willing to learn?), and potential buyers.

My great uncle Ernest (helped raise my dad during the depression) and his wife my great aunt Hally (named for her birthdate, Halloween), were real life desert rats. They lived for a couple decades on a small cattle ranch in Nevada's high desert. Lifelong rock-hounds, and bottle collectors, they wandered all over that Nevada desert. They even discovered an unknown natural fossil depository filled with many thousands of fifty million year old fish entombed in the sediment. They reported their finding to the University of Nevada, who then made quite a study of their find. After the University reopened the site to the public, aunt Hally and uncle Ernest took us all out there to hunt for fossil fish. I was probably about ten at the time. I still have a few fifty million year old goldfish. For most of my growing up years, we would go and stay with them for a couple days, almost every year. His pickup? A Powell, all red. I really liked that pickup. A cute little bugger, with a look all its own. In the mid 1960s, it still looked really nice. I wanted to have it when I was old enough. Then one day, they sold the ranch and almost everything on it, including the Powell.

b-c-g, I know someone that has a Hudson motorcycle, about that vintage. They have had it for about twenty-five years. It is in very nice mostly very original unrestored condition. Not one that a person is likely to see many of. I wonder if it might be the same one? A major private collection, I won't mention the name.

My opinion. And I am certainly not a model A expert, although I have been around them for a long time and have many friends that love them and drive theirs a lot! The color on both cars in not correct. To a lot of the model A crowd, that really matters. To a lot of the drive and enjoy owners? Not a big deal. The yellow one annoys me, for one silly reason. Back in the 1970s, the model A crowd prevailing wisdom was that any factory color used on any year or body style could be used on any other year or body style car. Frankly, I have read some conflicting information about the factory yellow. A few things I have read indicated that yellow might have been available on some sport roadsters or touring cars. But I have never been convinced of that, and even if it was, it was not common. The one and only body style in the model A lineup that was in fact usually yellow was the cabriolet, from 1929 through 1931 (if I recall correctly?). However, back in the 1970s/'80s, literally hundreds of coupes were painted yellow when they were restored! It just looks wrong to me, and back then it was "yellow coupe" overload. The brown coupe makes a comment about the seats being "decent", while the yellow coupe has pictures of a pretty nice looking interior. Both cars have rumble seats (which I really like!). Both cars need a fair amount of detailing that I noticed. The yellow one looks a bit nicer/ But the yellow one also has a sealed beam headlamp conversion (personally, I don't like those). Personally, from ten feet away? I like the brown one better. However, I suspect the interior in the yellow one might be worth the additional $2000. One in New Hampshire? One in California. I would say the shipping costs dictate the better buy. As always, a personal inspection is always advisable! Over the years, I have seen a lot of cars that looked nice in photos, but upon closer inspection were found to have significant amounts of damage and really bad repairs. You asked.

trim, I would have loved to have met Lillian Gish!

Oh, THAT disappeared a long time ago!

I agree with nearly all said above. Model A Fords are great prewar cars, antique by almost everybody's standards, with fantastic club support almost every civilized corner of the country. I did have one I was restoring bout fifty years ago, then decided I just really wanted cars just a bit earlier and sold it. Several times over the years, I have reconsidered that, and thought about getting one again. If my circumstances improve enough that I can buy something in decent condition? I may yet end up with a model A. As long as I have at least one good earlier car. I have had many friends that loved their model A Fords. Even a few of my best friends have had model As they used a lot. One of my closest friends had a 1929 Town Sedan, well accessorized, and nicely restored. He and I went to many meets together in his car, including one MAFCA national meet in Southern California. I often drove his car when heading home. Seriously, unless one is too large to fit behind the steering wheel? What is there about them to not like? I have always recommended model As as great cars for club and parts availability reasons, as one of the best antique automobiles for beginners to real antiques. One observation about this car. I followed the link to the fb advertisement. That engine doesn't look very nice. It looks like it night be the worst blown head gasket I have ever seen? Or maybe it was very seriously overheated? Stuck might be one thing. Engines sit for awhile, valves or pistons can get stuck on minor rust. Even if some relatively minor damage was somehow done? The model A engine can "often" be repaired by a competent mechanic. Then again, either a badly blown head gasket or a badly overheated engine can leave cylinders filled with coolant which may cause severe rust or other major issues. A severely overheated engine might not be repairable, short of an expenditure well beyond the value of the car. However, fear not. In spite of over a half century as the most driven of all antique automobiles, there are still engines out there waiting to be brought back and put into a nice car again. So even if the engine is basically destroyed? The car can be repaired for a fair price.

There are cars that I have seen and like them on. However, generally speaking, I never really cared about them. But, that is just me. (They do look great on a Kissel Gold Bug!)

Quite a fleet of unusual (for us Southern 'Mericans?) trucks! Neat to see them.

Thank you again Varun C! The American Underslung is well known in the brass era parts of our hobby. The Regal Underslung somewhat less known. The Colby is one that few have ever seen, and most have not even heard of. Nice looking automobile!

I grew up in the South San Francisco Bay Area. Not often it ever snows there except on mountain tops where few people ever go to (except for our Model T Ford Club's endurance runs?). However, my dad had grown up on a cattle ranch in Northeastern Nevada. Extreme cold, and moderate levels of snow every year! He made sure I learned how to drive in snow and on ice (which I was eager to learn anyhow). Through my adult years, I managed to drive in snow several times, but not a lot. Then, nearing my mid 50s, my wife has had it with Bay Area congestion! We end up moving to Grass Valley up in the Sierra foothills (about 2000 feet elevation). Here, we get some snow every year, and some years quite a bit! I have an older Ford Expedition, tow vehicle with four wheel drive, and I have never even put my chains on it (I carry them every winter just in case). No trouble at all getting around up to a foot of snow on the ground! What amazes me, is that half the people in town, were born here, families dating back almost a century or more. Two stinking inches of snow shuts the whole town down! Most people here, born and raised where it snows every year, and most of them cannot handle driving in any amount of snow. Full disclosure, one time, we ended up with about two feet of snow on our private road neighborhood that doesn't get plowed. I was basically stuck at home for two days. If I had put the chains on, I am sure I could have gotten out. But I really didn't need to go anywhere.

That makes a BIG difference in value. Although the lesser value Plymouth is probably easier to get needed parts for it, and cheaper to restore. So it is a double edged sword.

It has a great European flair to it! Certainly not everyone's cup o' tea. But I like it! In spite of the fact it is about ten years too new for my main interests.

Danke schön, Hans. Ich spreche ein bisschen Deutsch. It has been a long time since high school, and my German isn't as good as it used to be. But I always enjoy meeting German tourists here, and having a few minutes speaking with them. On a few occasions, I have even been able to help with directions for tourists that did not speak English. We ARE one world! I get so angry when politicians and news or social media tries to divide us. (My apologies for touching onto politics?)

So many fascinating histories in the long Automobile story! A long time ago (I was still in high school), I did join the national CCCA, before I decided to concentrate on earlier cars. During the few years I got their national magazine, they had a great article about the Horch. The cars have grabbed my attention ever since. I have never had any personal contact with one, only seen a couple in museums. So I only admire them from afar! By the way, I took a year of German language in high school. Part of the class was learning Christmas Carols. I recall "horch" in one of the carols. Think of "hark" in English. Everything in history, language, and culture, intersect in a million ways! Again by the way, the "ch" in Horch is not enunciated like the "ch" in the name "Charles". Nor is it quite a solid "k" sound. It is a back of the throat scratchy "k-ch-k-ch-k" sound about halfway between the "English "ch" and "k". Very few of the kids in my class got it right.

Stuck in high gear is a common problem with model Ts that have sat for a few years. Usually, it is the oil soaked multiple disc clutch that has twenty-five discs stuck together and the oil dried out a bit. If the engine was in decent running condition before it was parked? Usually, blocking the rear wheels safely off the ground, and going ahead to get the engine running again (with the rear wheels in the air!) will circulate fresh oil, warm whatever was left in the clutch, and then the clutch discs will release as they are supposed to with very little trouble. Most model T history and mechanics applies to both the T cars and the TT trucks. Rear end in the TT is of course much bigger and heavier. Still similar in design. The big difference is that Ford supplied bodies for the cars from the very beginning. However, TT trucks were chassis only beginning with the 1918 models (very late 1917 calendar year, still 1918 models!). Other than some special stuff, mostly for the military, the first bodies supplied by the Ford factory for the TT trucks were the fixed roof C-cabs for 1924. The enclosed cab TTs began in 1925. Both C-cab and enclosed cab TT trucks were available with or without either the flat bed or the express (pickup) bed. Everything before 1924 was body supplied by either the purchaser, the dealer, or some after-market supplier. Pre-1924 TT bodies varied a lot!

And yet, back in their day, those silly outdated single cylinder automobiles made several impressive long distance runs in several places around the world. A single cylinder Brush with wooden frame and wooden axles made one of the first automobile trips around the Outback in Australia! Truly amazing little cars and part of an incredible history of a too little known automotive pioneer, fortunes made, and fortunes lost, and forerunners to the Chrysler marque. Read up on Alanson P Brush.

I saw that gameshow! Wasn't surprised they missed it. I hate to admit it, but I saw every episode of GI when I was still in high school. If I sit for a minute and think about it, I can still recite (sing?) the theme song, both opening and closing verses, both versions. But then again, I can still recite the Mr. Ed song also. And probably a few others. Mind you, I haven't really watched any of those shows in about fifty years now.

Isn't that what most uninformed sellers do? People that know prewar era cars know that a lot of other people know them also. Therefore they will tell what it is. Uninformed sellers don't know what the car really is, and therefore refer to their fantasies of what they wish it was.

Dodge Brothers is famous for their "all steel" bodies fairly early. I don't know what year that actually began, but even then it was only on the larger production touring car and roadsters. Sedans and coupes were wood framed for several years yet after the touring cars were "all steel". Even after the standard sedans went mostly "all steel", Dodge had a few low production body styles that were still wood framed. A long time ago, a good friend was quite the Dodge expert, and had several 1925 Dodge Brothers automobiles (his favorite year for them). One he was especially proud of was a 1925 Dodge Brothers rare Victoria/Opera Coupe! It had a typical for the era wooden framed body. I often wonder what ever became of that car. It needed extensive restoration, and he messed up his life and I lost track of him years ago. During the 1920s, a few major automakers began switching to less wood and more steel structure in bodies. It was a long and slow transition. My 1927 Paige 6-45 sedan (Briggs body) has a typical wood framed sedan body, however the four doors are "all steel"! Not even tack strips of wood in them. There isn't enough wood anywhere in those doors to assemble a single toothpick! They sure open and close nice. For 1926/'27, Ford moved toward mostly steel bodies in USA production, except for the four-door sedans which remained steel covering over wooden structure. Two-door sedans, coupes, roadsters, and touring cars all used some amount of wood for tack strips, folding tops, and roofs on the enclosed cars. Model A Fords continued in a similar manner. Model A Ford sedans, some were mostly steel structure (especially the later ones), while some continued as major wooden structure. Early Ford V8s followed suit, and then continued progression to all steel bodies by the end of the 1930s. Chrysler was using a few mostly steel bodies in the mid 1920s, an early proponent for them then furthered by their acquisition of Dodge Brothers in the latter half of that decade. After their acquisition of Dodge, other Chrysler marques went towards more steel and less wood structure. General Motors was the slowest of the biggest automakers in the USA on that trail. Practically all their cars had wooden framework bodies until at least 1935, with many lower production models still using wooden structure even as late as 1940. The dozens of other significant USA automakers (Studebaker, Hudson, Nash, Willys, and many more) with a few model exceptions mostly continued with wooden structures until their end or the very late 1930s whichever came first.

I have driven in several parades, been a long time though. And never one as well known as the Rose Parade! (Although my picture, riding in a friend's car, is in a Life Magazine Winter 1977!) Welcome to the forum! I hope you have and enjoy that Packard for many years to come!

I sometimes think everybody in the 1950s/'60s painted their Maxwell runabouts red! Years ago I knew of several of them, One of William Harrah's first real antiques was a painted red Maxwell runabout. Jack Passey had one early on (one of his first pre1916s), and a couple other collectors I knew years ago had ones like that. The odds are, the cars were more likely either green or blue originally. One of the collectors I know, had a model AB with a 1950's red paint job on it. They eventually restored it properly (after the engine "failed to proceed" on an HCCA national tour). During the teardown, they confirmed the car was originally a dark blue, and that was how it was then restored! Continuing drift (my apologies). I suspect one would have trouble getting a near pristine two cylinder Maxwell still today at around 25K. The last couple really nice ones I saw sell were over 30K (one I heard went for 35K). Although, the last few older restorations two cylinder Maxwells I saw sell needing some TLC went for a bit under 20K (one I heard went for 17K).