Average miles collector cars driven by decade

[Dr B]

I just saw this interesting article from Hagerty (https://www.hagerty.com/media/market-trends/hagerty-insider/how-much-are-we-driving/?hashed_email=c108c538d366b089a9c4f43f54274686f39e2fc74f021f76f066bb45bf7fdd61&dtm_em=c108c538d366b089a9c4f43f54274686f39e2fc74f021f76f066bb45bf7fdd61) that uses resale auction data to calculate how many miles various decade cars are driven, 1920s to 2020s. As someone who drives their collector cars a lot, I found it interesting how few miles most people drive their cars, not surprising, but depressing. I especially can't believe that cars from the 20s, 30s, and 40s are only driven on average 60-80 miles per year! (I know several people on this sight, myself included, that drive that many miles every time we take our cars out). The fact that the median is half the mean tells you that some drive a lot and some drive very little.  Also, this only uses resold cars. Long term ownerships without a sale are not included in the calculations.  Take this with a grain of salt, but at least they used data to produce their results.

 

Your mileage may vary.

 

Robert

[Mark Shaw]

16 minutes ago, Dr B said:

cars from the 20s, 30s, and 40s are only driven on average 60-80 miles per year!

     This is no surprise to me.  Unlike the HCCA, the majority of car clubs do not promote touring in old cars.  I used to drive my 1913 Buick about a thousand miles on several organized National & regional HCCA tours each year.  But, like many collectors with multiple cars, each car gets driven less as their collection gets larger.  

     However, I believe most other car clubs tend to do car shows rather than touring.  I have been asked many times to bring my authentically restored prewar cars to judged car shows.  But I am not interested in trophies, and I think sitting all day at a car show is one of the most boring things to do with collector cars.  

Edited Sunday at 06:05 PM by Mark Shaw (see edit history)

[Larry Schramm]

Just now, Mark Shaw said:

I think sitting all day at a car show is one of the most boring things to do with collector cars.  

 

Except the Old Car Festival at Greenfield Village in Dearborn, MI.

 

https://www.thehenryford.org/current-events/calendar/old-car-festival/

 

[Mark Shaw]

2 minutes ago, Larry Schramm said:

Except the Old Car Festival at Greenfield Village in Dearborn, MI.

I agree Larry, not all car shows are boring, just the ones where the music is too loud, the asphalt is too hot, and almost everyone suffers all day just to collect trophies.

[zepher]

2 hours ago, Mark Shaw said:

But I am not interested in trophies, and I think sitting all day at a car show is one of the most boring things to do with collector cars.  

While sitting with your car all day can be tedious at times, shows where the cars are there for quite a few hours, allow me to educate people about my car(s).

Most people have never heard of a Rickenbacker or a Pierce Arrow and have no idea where they were made or what historical significance these cars hold.

I find that most people think my Rickenbacker is a foreign car, given the name.

And my Pierce Arrow is such a large and impressive car that is always draws plenty of attention and questions.

 

Yes, it can be hot sitting or standing on pavement but the smiles I see and the 'thank you' comments I get after explaining things about the cars make it worth it.

Those of us that own these cars aren't getting any younger, and if I can light a spark in someone that will lead them to be a caretaker for a few of these pre-war cars, those hours on the hot pavement are worth it.

[joe_padavano]

I'm one of those people who couldn't care less about static shows. I drive the wheels off of my cars (well, when they're running...). I really don't want to spend a weekend or longer cleaning my car, just to push it on and off the trailer. And god forbid it might rain...

 

The last thing I need are more award trinkets to dust. No, the few shows I do attend I do not have my car judged. I go to see old friends and meet new ones, though that also happens when the car breaks down on the side of the road during a tour. 😁

[Erska]

7 hours ago, Mark Shaw said:

I think sitting all day at a car show is one of the most boring things to do with collector cars.  

Sometimes, but not always.  It can be a great way to meet people, tell them about your car, hear their stories -- and if you walk around, see some other interesting cars and learn about them.  Here in Northern California, some of the best shows for this are the low-cost events during Monterey Car Week (like the Classic Motorsports Cruise-In, or the Rotary Show and Rally), or the Ironstone Concours (next weekend in Murphys).  And part of the fun is driving my car (a preservation Volvo 1800E) to Monterey (about 200 miles) and Ironstone (about 100 miles).  While there are awards at these shows, most people seem to be there for the fun of it, not to bring home a trophy.   

[Mark Shaw]

12 hours ago, Erska said:

 And part of the fun is driving my car (a preservation Volvo 1800E)

I had an 1800ES Wagon years ago.  Great cars!

Edited yesterday at 02:45 PM by Mark Shaw (see edit history)

[Marty Roth]

The major fallacy of the article, at least in my opinion, is that their data is from auction cars, the same cars which were auctioned at least twice.

Most of us either hold onto our cars (and hopefully drive them), or sell to other collector/hobbyists via FORUM, club ads, word of mouth, etc.

My guess is that most non-billion-dollar pieces of non-driven-art are NOT sold through Multiple Layered Auction for them to track.

 

My response to the article is buried somewhere on the second page of the responses.

[Dr B]

4 hours ago, Marty Roth said:

The major fallacy of the article, at least in my opinion, is that their data is from auction cars, the same cars which were auctioned at least twice.

That is not a fallacy of the analysis, it is a limitation. Yes, this is a limited data set. Nevertheless, it still confirms that people who bought those cars didn't drive them much.

 

4 hours ago, Marty Roth said:

My guess is that most non-billion-dollar pieces of non-driven-art are NOT sold through Multiple Layered Auction for them to track.

 

My understanding is that you are correct. Most collector cars (of all price ranges) trade hands privately. Car auctions are only a small portion of collector car sales. If my memory is correct, I think it is in the 15-20% range.

 

So, I still think most people in the collector car hobby don't drive their cars much, and these data support that belief. The people on this forum are the outliers and we're damn proud of it!

 

Robert

[oldcarfudd]

If I told Hagerty how much I drive my brass cars, they'd drop me or raise my premium.  I don't polish cars to go to shows, and I don't hang around for trophies.  But I've started going to Garden State Cars and Coffee events when they're far enough away to let me plot out a fun route on back roads.  I live in Morristown, and a couple of weeks ago they had a big gathering in Princeton Junction, 42 miles by back roads.  There were lots of Vettes and Beemers, and plenty of toys that screeched to 8000+ revs pulling out of the parking lot.  I showed up in a 1904 Curved Dash Olds.  They loved hearing it idle at 200 revs, and couldn't believe I'd driven it all that way.

[TTR]

 

7 hours ago, Marty Roth said:

The major fallacy of the article, at least in my opinion, is that their data is from auction cars, the same cars which were auctioned at least twice.

I also find it odd Hagerty would use auction listings to compile mileage data, especially when they have access to audited/reported mileages of their own entire customer base, which I would think to provide far more accurate and comprehensive data points.

 

3 hours ago, Dr B said:

Yes, this is a limited data set. Nevertheless, it still confirms that people who bought those cars didn't drive them much.

I admittedly didn't or won't click on the article, but did it specify reasons for lack of driving ? Cars not meeting (driving) expectations ? Purchased for bragging/showing off reasons or financial speculation ? Etc...

 

In 45 years of owning 100+ vintage cars, I've only "shown" mine less than dozen times and really have no interest in doing it.

I've always bought/owned vintage cars for myself to enjoy, mainly by driving them (on average a few thousand miles annually). 

I don't want to be on any organized "tours" or even do day-drives with more than 2-3 other cars.

I prefer doing drives by myself, so I can enjoy freedom of choices.

[Dr B]

1 hour ago, TTR said:

also find it odd Hagerty would use auction listings to compile mileage data, especially when they have access to audited/reported mileages of their own entire customer base, which I would think to provide far more accurate and comprehensive data points.

I do not believe they have mileage data on the cars they insure. I use Hagerty and I have never been asked and I have never told them how much I drive my cars. At the time of signing up with them, I did make sure there was not any annual mileage limit on my policy. Some other companies have limits on annual mileage and usage (for car shows only, etc.).  Also, they at least "talk the talk" that they say they support owners driving their cars. So I give them credit for that. 

 

Robert

[Dr B]

On 9/22/2024 at 2:04 PM, Mark Shaw said:

Unlike the HCCA, the majority of car clubs do not promote touring in old cars.

This is my biggest disappointment and why I don't/won't belong to most car clubs.

 

Robert

[Dr B]

1 hour ago, TTR said:

did it specify reasons for lack of driving ? Cars not meeting (driving) expectations ? Purchased for bragging/showing off reasons or financial speculation ? Etc...

They did not. So clearly another weakness of the study. However, while I maintain the belief that "all cars at auction are not bad, but all bad cars go to auction", they examined the mileage driven/year on 9,000 cars. Could they all have been crappy and bought while intoxicated trying to impress your buddies, sure, but unlikely. Again, not perfect data (by a long short), but interesting and I give partial credit for trying!

 

Robert

[Marty Roth]

6 hours ago, Dr B said:

That is not a fallacy of the analysis, it is a limitation. Yes, this is a limited data set. Nevertheless, it still confirms that people who bought those cars didn't drive them much.

 

My understanding is that you are correct. Most collector cars (of all price ranges) trade hands privately. Car auctions are only a small portion of collector car sales. If my memory is correct, I think it is in the 15-20% range.

 

So, I still think most people in the collector car hobby don't drive their cars much, and these data support that belief. The people on this forum are the outliers and we're damn proud of it!

 

Robert

Robert,

 

I cannot say what "most" people in the hobby do,

However a great many of those with whom I associate ABSOLUTELY DO DRIVE SIGNIFICANT MILES.

VMCCA is The Touring Club. Our only activity is TOURS, most of which are week-long events, typically for varied eras of vehicles. Many are progressive tours, meaning that we may stay at a different location each evening - some returning to the start point a week later, and some simply continuing a journey. Circling the five Great Lakes, one week each for five sequential years, or driving segments annually to cover the Great River Road between Lake Itasca and Venice, Louisiana -fifty miles or so below New Orleans, or the Lewis and Clark Trail, or a progressive drive between Bar Harbor and Portland, Maine. We also tour with Horseless Carriage Club in a Brass-Era car, and participate in Classic Car Club of America CARavan driving events where many participants, and on and on and on ...

 

Sure, there are lots of folks who rarely drive farther than the local Cruise Night, Cars and Coffee, or Show and Shine,

BUT I believe you would be shocked at how many of us -

serious old car folks -

who get out and get on the road,

and serve as an example to the next generations,

encouraging them to actually drive our cars and ride along!

[1935Packard]

Not sure how much I credit the data: note that the entry for cars from the 1920s is based on a single car. That’s right, just one data point.

[69merc]

They had me pegged!  I don't drive my car that much, I have to admit.  It's not a dd.  I think touring sounds like fun though, I've never done it.  At least not since back in the 70s when we used to caravan to national shows.  But I'm ok with local shows and cruise ins, and there are so many of them, that I can keep going to different ones for quite some time.  A lot of times I'll get "thanks for bringing your car out"  People are appreciative.

[Dr B]

12 hours ago, Marty Roth said:

Robert,

 

I cannot say what "most" people in the hobby do,

However a great many of those with whom I associate ABSOLUTELY DO DRIVE SIGNIFICANT MILES.

VMCCA is The Touring Club. Our only activity is TOURS, most of which are week-long events, typically for varied eras of vehicles. Many are progressive tours, meaning that we may stay at a different location each evening - some returning to the start point a week later, and some simply continuing a journey. Circling the five Great Lakes, one week each for five sequential years, or driving segments annually to cover the Great River Road between Lake Itasca and Venice, Louisiana -fifty miles or so below New Orleans, or the Lewis and Clark Trail, or a progressive drive between Bar Harbor and Portland, Maine. We also tour with Horseless Carriage Club in a Brass-Era car, and participate in Classic Car Club of America CARavan driving events where many participants, and on and on and on ...

 

Sure, there are lots of folks who rarely drive farther than the local Cruise Night, Cars and Coffee, or Show and Shine,

BUT I believe you would be shocked at how many of us -

serious old car folks -

who get out and get on the road,

and serve as an example to the next generations,

encouraging them to actually drive our cars and ride along!

Marty,

 

I completely agree with you that there are a lot of folks that drive their collector cars.  I just don't believe that the majority of car collectors drive their cars frequently or for any appreciable distances.  Among the clubs I belong to and the people in the business that I know that restore and service collector cars, the answer seems to be the same.  Most collector cars are not driven much.  That was my impression observing and talking to others.  I just think it was interesting that someone finally put some numbers behind that impression.  Again, not perfect, but at least a reasonable try.

 

I am a strong advocate to get our cars out and drive them.  I am usually driving a collector car every weekend and even some weekdays weather permitting.  It is not only fun and good for the cars, it is a great way to promote our hobby by being seen. Cars and coffee are also a good way to promote the hobby, but that is not what this thread is about.

 

Robert