Watch Fobs

[Thebuicknut]

I found the same one in Hershey in Oct I paid next to nothing for it...but its still a cool piece ... yours is a little nicer than mine...

[Mark Wetherbee]

Saw this on eBay, I wonder if the delco piece above was from a similar item?? Delco made a great number of home generating units as well as the numerous automotive items.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115667384552?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=5l1CdXx7TBC&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=pnvMnNjyRmG&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[Terry Bond]

Time for another lesson in watch fobbery -

Here is a commonly found fob advertising the Excelsior Auto-Cycle.  Any day of the week there will be several listed for sale on evil-bay.  They range in price from a few dollars to over $100 and many are identified as "original" or "antique."  Some use the description "vintage" which of course doesn't mean anything!  I'm showing a photo of an example both front and back, compared to the original from my own collection.  The reproductions are shown on the blue background, my original is photographed on a maroon background. 

Here are a few items to note - the reproduction fob seems to have a "heavier" image of the motorcycle.  Some of the definition in the image and scallops around the edge are also heaver and not as well defined.  The reproductions come in both an aged brass and a plated version. I've not yet seen an original that has been plated.

 

The back side is clearly different on the reproduction fob.  The wording is completely different.  The reproduction fob is marked "GEO" which is a known maker of novelty tokens, coins and many reproduction watch fobs for farm machinery and automobiles.  Note also the more delicate scroll-work on the back of the original fob.

 

The original fobs were manufactured by S.D. Childs, Chicago and are clearly marked, in small lettering at the bottom on the back side.  S.D. Childs was founded in 1837. During their life-time the company produced coins, tokens, medals, and fobs.  Their production included political campaign items as well as bicycle and automobile emblems, nameplates and advertising watch fobs.  The company eventually went bankrupt and everything was sold at auctions in 1937. 

 

Originals will be marked with the S.D. Childs name on them.  The GEO (or other) Excelsior fobs are reproductions done in the 60s and later. 

 

Sometimes it can be difficult to tell a reproduction or fake unless you can compare it with a known original. Hopefully this will help you avoid getting burned by an internet bandit or flea market vendor who is unaware of how to determine whether a fob is a reproduction.

 

Yes the first one I ever purchased turned out to be a reproduction.  Thanks goodness it only took a couple of dollars to learn the lesson.  But, that's how we learn.

 

Terry

Edited January 18, 2023 by Terry Bond (see edit history)

[FarSquash]

Hi! I found this metal detecting in the yard of my 100 year old house. Does anyone know how old it might be?

 

Thanks for any help you can provide!

[Terry Bond]

Can you supply a photo of the back side?  I have a photo of one from an auction several years ago but unfortunately not a pic of the reverse, and no other info on it  I do suspect it's advertising for Studebaker wagons.  Photos of any info on the back can help confirm that.  If there is any other tiny marking to indicate the name of the company that made the fob, it might also help to date it.

Terry

[FarSquash]

2 hours ago, Terry Bond said:

Can you supply a photo of the back side?  I have a photo of one from an auction several years ago but unfortunately not a pic of the reverse, and no other info on it  I do suspect it's advertising for Studebaker wagons.  Photos of any info on the back can help confirm that.  If there is any other tiny marking to indicate the name of the company that made the fob, it might also help to date it.

Terry

 

That just has to be it, it looks just like it. Did the auctioned one have an age estimate? I'll get more photos when I get home today!

[FarSquash]

5 hours ago, FarSquash said:

That just has to be it, it looks just like it. Did the auctioned one have an age estimate? I'll get more photos when I get home today!

Here's a pic of the back. Really hard to tell if anything specific is on it, unfortunately.

[Terry Bond]

Thanks for the photo but as you guessed, not much we can determine from looking at the back-side. Some things for discussion - I'm convinced it is an advertising fob for the Studebaker wagons.  Studebaker ceased production of horse-drawn vehicles in about 1920. In terms of age, difficult to determine.  What I think of as the prime era of the advertising fob is from about 1910-1930. 

 

Watch fobs went out of fashion when gentlemen began wearing wrist-watches.  What we know of as "watch fobs" became "Key fobs" with different ways of attaching to key-rings.  Souvenir watch fobs have been long available to collectors though with many original designs produced using original dies  There are also recreated fobs, some still being made today overseas. Reproduction and recreated fobs are usually blank on the reverse sides.  I want it to be as old as it looks but am not sure.

 

Nice find.  Keep it as an example of your success in treasure hunting and the fun you had digging it up.   Maybe you can connect it to someone who bought a new Studebaker wagon and received the fob as a gift form the dealer.  When there is family history connected, it's even better.

 

I'm also adding a couple of photos of another Studebaker automobile fob from my collection so you can see the makers markings on the backside.. 

 

Terry

[FarSquash]

7 minutes ago, Terry Bond said:

Thanks for the photo but as you guessed, not much we can determine from looking at the back-side. Some things for discussion - I'm convinced it is an advertising fob for the Studebaker wagons.  Studebaker ceased production of horse-drawn vehicles in about 1920. In terms of age, difficult to determine.  What I think of as the prime era of the advertising fob is from about 1910-1930. 

 

Watch fobs went out of fashion when gentlemen began wearing wrist-watches.  What we know of as "watch fobs" became "Key fobs" with different ways of attaching to key-rings.  Souvenir watch fobs have been long available to collectors though with many original designs produced using original dies  There are also recreated fobs, some still being made today overseas. Reproduction and recreated fobs are usually blank on the reverse sides.  I want it to be as old as it looks but am not sure.

 

Nice find.  Keep it as an example of your success in treasure hunting and the fun you had digging it up.   Maybe you can connect it to someone who bought a new Studebaker wagon and received the fob as a gift form the dealer.  When there is family history connected, it's even better.

 

I'm also adding a couple of photos of another Studebaker automobile fob from my collection so you can see the makers markings on the backside.. 

 

Terry

Thanks so much! This is incredibly helpful. I have found some items back there that are quite old (metal toothpaste tube, gold plated chain that I think was attached to a pocket watch at some point, a scythe). I just think this particular thing is so neat I want to learn as much as I can about it. I will ask a couple of detector groups if anyone has any suggestions for safely cleaning the back. I appreciate your picture so I know where to look!

[Jim Skelly]

soak it overnight in Evapo Rust; I'm doing it right now with a Fordson wrench; it is a gold liquid that has turned somewhat brown as the rust comes off of it:

 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Jim Skelly
added pic (see edit history)

[FarSquash]

All of the detector nerds are saying reverse electrolysis is the way to go for finer detailed things but I'm going to try that stuff for the scythe I found. I'll report back if I manage to get an electrolysis tank set up without electrocuting myself!

[FarSquash]

I THINK it says the whitehead HOA CO curved over the top center and Newark NJ below that in a straight line... Still cleaning though! The words are tiny tiny.

[FarSquash]

WHITEHEAD & HOA CO

NEWARK NJ

 

My final answer! I don't dare clean it more than that I don't want to start losing letters.

[TheMoneyPit]

2 hours ago, FarSquash said:

WHITEHEAD & HOA CO

NEWARK NJ

 

My final answer! I don't dare clean it more than that I don't want to start losing letters.

Whitehead and Hoag was one of the prolific emblem and advertising novelty companies in the early years. 

[Terry Bond]

I've been alerted to another fake/fantasy fob out there on evi-bay. Item #285208155254. This Graham fob is not only poorly done, the back has no makers mark on it, a likely sign of a non-authentic piece. Unfortunately it looks like a couple of bidder are having a back-and-forth bidding war.  One of them continues to bid multiple times just to stay ahead of the other one.  It's now over $200.  Somebody is gonna get burned!  Please folks - take the time to learn not only how to tell the difference, but maybe even also how to work the auctions. 

Terry

[Todd Carlson]

On 12/27/2022 at 10:21 PM, Terry Bond said:

Here are a couple of fairly recent acquisitions and a few favorites not pictured before - Inter-State automobiles, made between 1909-1919.  L.J. Witrh was an auto supply company in Newark NJ in the teens.  Colorful fob advertising the Cole 30 Flyer. Last one is a rare fob advertising the Flechter Carburetur.   Still finding them.  Terry

 

Terry,  Can you please tell me who the maker is on the Interstate fob?

[Todd Carlson]

Hello all,

 

Here are pictures of my small collection.

 

[Terry Bond]

1 hour ago, Todd Carlson said:

Terry,  Can you please tell me who the maker is on the Interstate fob?

Whitehead and Hoag is the mark on the back side. See photo.

You've got a great collection Todd!   I see  couple that I haven't been able to find yet.   The last photo with the round Olds fob is great, never seen that one.  What's on the back of that? I'm still hunting for a nice Maxwell fob also.

Thanks for sharing.

Terry

 

[Walt G]

This is a great commentary on some really wonderful and beautifully designed and made automobilia. Automotive history takes all sizes from full size cars to watch fobs - just love it.

[TexRiv_63]

I have a small Dodge Brothers emblem on Ebay sale now which I assume to be a watch fob. It matches the one shown above but does not have the bracket for the strap. I assume they ground it off but they did a really good job, hard to tell. It has a Grammes & Sons makers mark and a nut soldered on the back, what do you think the age may be?

[Todd Carlson]

3 hours ago, Terry Bond said:

Whitehead and Hoag is the mark on the back side. See photo.

You've got a great collection Todd!   I see  couple that I haven't been able to find yet.   The last photo with the round Olds fob is great, never seen that one.  What's on the back of that? I'm still hunting for a nice Maxwell fob also.

Thanks for sharing.

Terry

 

Terry,

 

Thank you for the information on the Inter-State!

 

Thank you for the comment on my small collection.  Here is a closer pic of the front and back of the Oldsmobile. 

 

My favorites in my collection are the two Thomas Flyers.

 

 

 

 

[Terry Bond]

Thanks for the photo Todd.  I replied to your other post on FB as well. 

Terry

[Walt G]

This well worn Locomobile fob is 1 3/8 inches across the flats. On the back I can make out the word Hammer so am assuming Powell & Hammer? that area is well worn also.

[Terry Bond]

4 hours ago, Walt G said:

This well worn Locomobile fob is 1 3/8 inches across the flats. On the back I can make out the word Hammer so am assuming Powell & Hammer? that area is well worn also.

Walt, if you can get a photo of the back I might be able to figure it out.  Powell and Hammer was a British manufacturer of lamps, unless there is an American company with a similar name that produced watch fobs.  If so it wold be a company I'm not familiar with and not on any lists I've seen.

Thanks,

Terry

[Terry Bond]

Thanks Walt, got your photos separately, easy to figure it out - it's marked "L.F. Grammes & Sons, Allentown PA."  They were one of the most well-known producers of fobs, medals, tokens, etc.  They also made those wonderful min-radiator script lapel pins.   Your fob is a great one for a great car. 

Thanks for posting.

Terry

Edited April 19, 2023 by Terry Bond (see edit history)

[Walt G]

Terry

thanks for the proper ID of the Locomobile fob. It is well worn and I am glad you were able to decipher what the name was on the back!

My mistake of Powell & Hammer - was cleaning a self generating  brass lamp I have from that company for hours before posting and had the name branded into my head/memory  - duh! A geezer moment.🙃

Walt

Edited April 19, 2023 by Walt G (see edit history)

[Terry Bond]

Here is a rare one - recent acquisition.  The center piece is actually a celluloid pinback button. I've seen one other example of this pin.  Also shown is the backside with Moyer advertising and in fine lettering at the bottom is the maker's name - Bastian Bros, Rochester, NY.  A rare fob I'm sure.

Terry

[FarSquash]

Back with another Studebaker metal detector find! I haven't been able to find a makers mark on this one. Does anyone have any info on this one or know where I might focus my effort looking for a makers mark? The back says "look for the name Studebaker on the traces" Thanks!! 

Edited July 9, 2023 by FarSquash (see edit history)

[Terry Bond]

Looks like the fob makers name is the small print near the bottom on the back. I can't make it out from the photo but will try to enlarge it later.

Terry

[TheMoneyPit]

Terry’s found it, and that looks like it might be “The Greenduck Company Chicago U S A” but that’s only speculation without using a jeweler’s loupe. I’m going on the placement and style of text.

[FarSquash]

I think I see where you mean in the photo, it's just so tiny I didn't notice it in person. I'll clean that area up more and take another look. Thanks, guys!

[Brass-Is-Class]

On 4/21/2023 at 8:02 AM, Terry Bond said:

Here is a rare one - recent acquisition.  The center piece is actually a celluloid pinback button. I've seen one other example of this pin.  Also shown is the backside with Moyer advertising and in fine lettering at the bottom is the maker's name - Bastian Bros, Rochester, NY.  A rare fob I'm sure.

Terry

Terry Bond, here's a Moyer Car Fob, 1912, in excellent original condition. Yes, some one apparently glued a pinback to yours. 

Also here's a Moyer Radiator Emblem, Pinbacks, Buttonback Moyer Car # Tag and Carriage Body Tag.

Also here's the story about the "Moyer Car First Prize Herald Contest" pinback.

Edited August 23, 2023 by Brass-Is-Class
Added info. (see edit history)

[Terry Bond]

Great stuff! Thanks for sharing. I'm wondering about mine and the attached button.  Since it's not the only one ive seen, and considering the button is not common, I'm wondering if perhaps they were created like that as a special promotional item? Is your center car pic covered with celluloid? I'm reluctant to try and pop off the button to see what's under it.  I'd think any Moyer items would be difficult to find.

Terry

[Terry Bond]

Dominion Motors Limited was founded in 1908 in Walkerville, Canada.  It grew from a bicycle manufacturing company like a lot of other early automobile makers.   By 1910 they introduced their new car.  It was originally planned to name the car the Royal Windsor, but when the first car was shown that year it was called Dominion, and carried the distinctive emblem shown in the advertisement.  They were unsuccessful in taking advance orders and the 1911 model never appeared. 

Early in 1911 the company was acquired by Enoch Smith of Detroit after it went into voluntary liquidation when a petition for receivership was filed by a Detroit supplier.

The new company, named the New Dominion Motor Co., didn't fare much better. In 1915 they were the first Canadian company to demonstrate a truck at the Detroit Auto Show-- a 'revolutionary' vehicle featuring a four-wheel trailer and a separated two-wheel cab and engine component. It obviously did not catch on as the company went out of business the same year.

this fob dates from before the name change in 1911, and for a car made only one year, it must be pretty rare. 

Terry

[TheMoneyPit]

Great stuff Terry, you found a great collection with some amazing pieces!

 

I have been up to my butt in alligators lately and haven’t had any time to reply to your emails but I will try to soon…

[Jim Skelly]

Walkerville was founded by Hiram Walker, who started Canadian Club Whiskey.  It was absorbed into Windsor, Ontario in 1935.

[Terry Bond]

I noticed that when I was digging for info on the fob.  Canadian Club is good stuff, but I prefer a good single malt Scotch.

Terry

[Terry Bond]

Another interesting fob is this one.  One end of the leather strap has a tab with a small emblem - "League of American Chaufeurs."  The other end of the strap has a brass fob with an eagle on top of an early wheel.  I've found out this is the official emblem of the organization.  The fob has nothing on the back except a nicely engraved number - 4465.  I assume that would be a membership number?   A little digging reveals the organization was founded sometime around 1914 in  Cincinnati, Ohio.  Their publication was monthly and called "The American Chauffeur."  The magazine carries a similar eagle on the cover.  I have managed to find a few copies of the magazine on-line but the latest seems to be around 1919.  Does anyone have any information on this organization? Apparently they were at one time very successful and had "official garages: located in the Chicago area.

[Brass-Is-Class]

On 8/23/2023 at 8:39 AM, Terry Bond said:

Great stuff! Thanks for sharing. I'm wondering about mine and the attached button.  Since it's not the only one ive seen, and considering the button is not common, I'm wondering if perhaps they were created like that as a special promotional item? Is your center car pic covered with celluloid? I'm reluctant to try and pop off the button to see what's under it.  I'd think any Moyer items would be difficult to find.

Terry

Sorry so late in responding Terry. I'm rarely on the forum.

My fob does have a celluloid cover over the car image. Note that the car on your fob/pinback is identical. Maybe the pinback is not glued, but the pin was poked thru the underlying celluloid. Wonder if you could try to slide it off? The fobs are indeed rare. I've seen other pinbacks before, but your fob is the only other one I've seen besides mine. 

- Gary

[Terry Bond]

Just added this one to my collection. Hartford Rubber Company started in 1881 and originally produced bicycle tires along with other rubber goods-boots, etc.  They produced automobile tires as early as 1903.  In 1929 the company was purchased by the U.S. Rubber Co. The Gartford plant was closed and the Hartford brand seems to have disappeared at that time. 

 

The fob was made by Whitehead & Hoag. Not sure what the date on it is but certainly 1929 or earlier.

Terry