New 6 volt TWO SPEED heater motors?

[JamesR]

Rewiring my '54 Ranch Wagon. I could use the existing heater motor, I guess, but I'd rather find one that isn't 64 years old. Only new 6 volt heater motors I find are single speed. I want a two speed (three wire.)Thanks for any help.

 

Jim

[MCHinson]

I have no experience with a 54 Ranch Wagon and I may be wrong but every heater motor that I have seen is a two wire motor and the variable voltage is supplied by the control circuit to give multiple speeds.  

[JamesR]

Thanks for the input, Matthew. No, the original application is a three wire motor and two speed switch from the factory, as the shop manual wiring diagrams, pictures and text indicate. "Two speed ranges are are provided for the blower by means of a switch and a two speed, three wire motor," the manual says. And that's what my setup is. In '53 the switch apparently controlled the speeds by pull/push, and in my '54 by rotation. One of the three wires is a ground.

 

I suppose that I could reuse the original motor, but as I recall, I was getting a little electric motor bearing noise (I don't run the heater often, as this is a "nice weather" car.) The real problem is that  some of the old cloth insulation has fallen off all the way up to the grommet that enters the motor housing, so I can't be confident of proper insulation at point of entry or inside the motor. The manual has no info whatsoever on the disassembly of the heater motor, and while there appears to be screws holding the motor together, I'm not sure it was made to be disassembled and refurbished. Very difficult to get apart.

 

New old stock will be very hard to come by, but might be the only way to retain the two speed function in six volt. Please folks, no lectures about rewiring in 12 volt - the overdrive relay and solenoid are incredibly expensive in 12 volt. I expect that converting to 12 volt would cost me close to an extra $1000 when all is said and done. I've read that voltage reducers won't work for this relay and solenoid, so I'm not going there. 

[MCHinson]

I would suggest you find a local electric motor shop. They should be able to disassemble and repair the existing motor, clean, lubricate, and replace bearings if needed and rewire it with new insulation. I don't think you will find too many people on this forum who would suggest changing the voltage. We like them like they came from the factory. 

[skyler]

be wary of local shops who say they can fix it. you may get the motor back in a box or working worse than it did. i went through this with a convertible top motor. three shops that claimed they could fix it,over $200 later and still not working. i told each shop i only wanted new brushes. the last shop left the old ones in with no spring behind one brush. i finally bought a new one from hydro-e-lectric in florida and have no regrets. original was my goal, but now the top goes up and down.     dennis

[JamesR]

4 hours ago, MCHinson said:

I would suggest you find a local electric motor shop. They should be able to disassemble and repair the existing motor, clean, lubricate, and replace bearings if needed and rewire it with new insulation. I don't think you will find too many people on this forum who would suggest changing the voltage. We like them like they came from the factory. 

Thanks Matthew. I'll try an electric motor repair place...I hadn't thought of that. Great idea. It it doesn't work, it won't bother me to use one of the new single speed units that are available. Like I say, this is a fair weather car that doesn't get the heater used much, but the original switch (which I will keep in the car) indicates two speeds, so I thought I might try to maintain that feature if I could. Since I had everything apart, I decided to to change out the heater core, too.

 

I'm glad people here aren't judgemental on keeping 6 volt. That's why I like it here I guess. I forget that that this isn't the Ford Barn (though that place is great, too.)

 

 

[Spinneyhill]

You could always take it to pieces yourself...... Bearings are sourced as bearings. Wire is easy to replace... Electric shop can test the armature.

[Rusty_OToole]

If it was mine I would take it apart, clean it, and oil the bearings with synthetic oil. If the brushes were shot try to get new ones. Replace the frayed wire with a new one. I have done this before. It is a fiddly job but not very hard.

 

I would also take off the blower fan and soak it overnight in soapy water then clean it carefully and give it a thin coat of black spray paint. The fins get full of dirt which cuts the efficiency to an astonishing degree. When clean it will blow more than twice as much air. You must be careful to get every bit of dirt off and not to put too much paint on because you don't want it out of balance. I found it best to soak the dirt, scrape it out with a wooden scraper (popsicle stick) or screwdriver then wash with a brush.

 

There should be an NOS unit available from a Ford parts specialist or Ebay if all else fails. I should think they used the same heater blower on many different models and for several years so there should be a few around.

[Rusty_OToole]

Newer cars get a multi speed blower by using a series of resistors. You could do the same if all else fails and you can only get a single speed motor.

[JamesR]

1 hour ago, Rusty_OToole said:

Newer cars get a multi speed blower by using a series of resistors. You could do the same if all else fails and you can only get a single speed motor.

Thanks Rusty. I may talk to you about that strategy and get more specifics, if you don't mind. As it stands right I'm thinking I may go with a new singe speed replacement. I really don't want to be second guessing my motor rebuilding skills. I'll already be second guessing my car rewiring skills.

[jan arnett (2)]

nothing ventured nothing gained.  If you are not going to use it then you have nothing to lose by trying to rebuild yourself.

 

 

[54vicky]

I think it may have bushings rather than bearings most I have had apart did.check around as I feel they will be sold by old ford parts dealers also check with T-bird parts dealers as 55 would have been 6 volt

[Rusty_OToole]

They had bronze bearings if they had any oil it dried out long ago. Soak them good with synthetic motor oil and they will be good for another 50 years. Brushes are usually OK too. Even taxicabs with a million miles didn't wear out the heater motor. Heat and age dries out the oil and they can get full of dust and the brushes get stuck, that is usually all that is wrong.

[chistech]

I’ve rebuilt a few heater motors and like was said, they’re not hard to do but there is a process of disassembly and reassembly. Oftentimes, the brushes must be pushed back against their springs and held in this position with thin wire or paper clips when the motor is reassembled so the armature clears the brushes and the shaft enters the bearing. Then just before the motor is closed shut, the two wires are pulled to release the brushes so they can contact the armature. It’s not hard, just fiddily as described in a previous post.

I disassemble the motor, polish or turn the armature if needed, clean or recut the mica slots, de-solder the old feed wires off the field wires, then solder new cloth wire to the field wires. I’ve found many times the brush springs to be weak and replace them. ACE hardware has a good assortment of springs and I can usually find replacements easy enough. As also said earlier, most of the bearings are bronze and will just need a good oiling. Often these bearings are round on the outside and sit in a tensioned keeper in the ends of the motor housing. Soak the keeper with a good cleaner and using either the armature or a round rod of proper diameter, break this bearing free in its keeper as it should be able to move, though tight. Try to get the bearing bore back in line with body so the bearings line up with the armature but they don’t have to be perfect yet. Both ends of the armature will have thin washers on them. Don’t mix them up or loose them. Don’t switch up their order on the ends either. A very light oil on them won’t hurt. With the new wire installed on the field coils and the brushes held in their keepers put the armature back in the housing and pull the brush keeper wires just as it closes up tight. Tighten the housing screws but not real tight, just snug. Most times, the armature won’t turn freely and it is because the bearings are just slightly out of alignment. I take a small nylon hammer and rap the motor shaft both sideways and down on the ends. This has always aligned the bearings back in alignment for me. Retighten the housing screws. The motor should run like brand new.