oldcar Posted March 7, 2011 Author Share Posted March 7, 2011 Hi BillThanks for that info will follow it up. Vendor Is a book dealer who seems to have several available @$49.00 + p&pBernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Friartuck Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 There is a parts manual that has been scanned and can be down loaded on one of the Packard websites. That one is a PDF of 81 pages. The e-bay one is cited at 374 pages, so it would seem theres more to that one. The e-bay one says it covers 1922-1928 (1st through 5th series whereas the downloaded one is 1st-3rd series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cben09 Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 For whats invested I would suggest "" Shoot the bear"" while bear is around,Get shop,and parts for 8 and 6,Good reading if nothing else and a sound investment,,My view,,,Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted March 8, 2011 Author Share Posted March 8, 2011 Hello Not everyone is slacking off, here in Australia my good friend and ultra keen panel man Aaron has been toiling away on the Packard. I will let you judge the results for yourselves.Bernie j Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozstatman Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 Looking good Bernie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
30 Hupp Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Nice work!! Have really been enjoying your "resurection" of the '21!Dale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 HelloThings are moving on the engine front too. Visited Crankshaft Rebuilders yesterday, the new pistons had just arrived, the crank has been reground and they are working on the new centre main bearing cap. the block has been in their "hot tank' and is now cleaned of all the rust and rubbish in the water ways.Changing horses we drove out into the hills to Warburton East where I collected a complete actuating shaft for the "Dead-Easy" tyre pump from a fellow Vintage Drivers Club member. Now I can get on with its restoration. Watch this space........Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cben09 Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Hi Bernie Glad to hear things are progressing,,Don't forget to bolt the block to the case when working on the mains and cam,,,the block is what makes it stiff,,,Cheers Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted March 11, 2011 Author Share Posted March 11, 2011 Thanks BenI have passed that instruction on to my friends at CSRB.Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted March 21, 2011 Author Share Posted March 21, 2011 Hi All,Sorry but I have been incredibly busy the last few days. We have friends visiting from Wales UK and have also spent the last four days taking in the Phillip Island Historic Auto Race meeting and doing some extended touring in the 1934 Lagonda Rapier. Almost 400 miles since last Friday 18th. While I have been out enjoying myself I believe that work on the Packard progresses apace.Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48customfastback Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Bernie,Exciting stuff! I have a '21 Packard 116 Touring. If you need information etc... I would be glad to photograph things for you if need be. Take care,Rob'21 Packard 116 Touring'48 Packard Custom Club Coupe'50 DeSoto Convertible'69 Volvo 1800S'80 International Scout Turbo Diesel'97 Defender 90 Land Rover (Black) w/stock safari rack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted March 26, 2011 Author Share Posted March 26, 2011 Our Welsh Friends return to the UK on Monday. Yesterday and today we have had the Lagonda working overtime, another 250+ miles on the speedo and we still have tomorrow Sunday. Tuesday should see some Packard action at last.Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Mellor NJ Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 Bernie, I thought you might like this ad from Jacobsen Mfg Co of Racine,Wisc. I have a small Army portable generator from 1947 made by them. I also wanted to tell you that I saw your Dixie Flyer at the AACA Museum. Incredibly good job, Mate.<CENTER></CENTER> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted March 28, 2011 Author Share Posted March 28, 2011 Hi DaveThank you for the kind thoughts. Just one problem My name is Jacobson originally Jacobsohn my fathers family originated in the Principality of Hanover now part of Germany. The "sen's" tend to come from Scandanavian countries Probably very distant relations.Changing the subject. i have had a chance to check the Lagonda's log-book today. Over the past month it has travelled just over 1,000 miles all under its own power on the road. It really does need a good wash as there has barely been a day that it was not out doing what it does best.Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 Hi AllJust when I was ready to tackle the Packard water pump the Lagonda Rapier generator has decided to go on the blink. Having removed and dismantled it I find that it has thrown the solder off the commutator.... looks like an a re-wind may be needed. Fortunately I have a spare on the shelf so hope it checks out OK. Definitely back to the Packard before the end of next week.Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share Posted April 6, 2011 (edited) Good News or Bad News. The bad news is that both the armature out of the Lagonda's generator and the spare that I had on the shelf both have problems, so yesterday I delivered them both to be rewound. Ouch!The good news is that as promised I am back working on the Packard. With the chassis and body away with Aaron and the bulk of the engine bits at Crankshaft Rebuilders I can concentrate on some of the lesser bits that I still have here. The cylinder head has been thoroughly cleaned and all the surface rust wire brushed off and it now has its first coat of engine paint. Cleaning the head involved removing the priming cups. What a motley collection! Three are re-usable after some cosmetic work, two have broken handles and so present something of a problem. Do I use the centre out of one of the good ones and have two cast or do I look for replacements? This brings me to the sixth. This is a totally un-original and quite ugly replacement and has to go. So this means that I am now looking for three original type Priming cups. Please have a look in your boxes of small spare parts.Finally with gritted teeth I have removed the covers of all four Gabriel snubbers. The two from the front were full of mud-wasps nests. The two from the rear are basically in much better condition. Having said that they will all be totally stripped cleaned, the tin-wear wire brushed and painted before being re-assembled. At least two will probably need new webbing straps if someone knows of a friendly supplier?While you were reading all this I have dismantled the water-pump and have repaired the broken flange using a total of three full sticks of bronze rod in the process. The shaft will have to be replaced as it is badly pitted under the seal. Naturally the main body will have to be machined to provide a snug fit into the front of the cylinder block. The correct copper compression ring seal came in the very comprehensive set of gaskets from "Olsens"I was really very pleased with the quality of their gaskets and the speed of their service. I thought that their price was extremely fair.Bernie J. Edited April 6, 2011 by oldcar (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1928Packard526 Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Bernie — Restoration Supply Company in Escondido CA carries the proper webbing for use with snubbers. They also have priming cups for sale. The cup style is a bit different than the Packard originals, but if you replace all 6 it might be an acceptable substitution. I have looked for years for 6 correct cups in usable condition for my '28 without complete success. The original Packard parts have an unusually large diameter cup.I have just relocated to CA from FL, so currently I am out of touch with both my cars and their spares. When I can check I will look to see if I have any cups that might help you.Pete P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundog99 Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Bernie,In the UK, Cookes Patterns & Castings,West Avenue, Wigston, Leicester, LE182FB cookejohn@hotmail.com sell new Gabriel Snubbers (two sizes) and sell two sizes of webbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unimogjohn Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Bernie, there are quite a few to choose from on Ebay. Here is an example for eight. 8 NOS Primer Cups Packard Auburn Studebaker Nash Reo - eBay (item 400206554738 end time Apr-07-11 17:45:01 PDT) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 7, 2011 Author Share Posted April 7, 2011 (edited) Hi allThank you for the suggestions Pete, Anthony and John. Pete, I trust that you change of location is going to be beneficial.I will follow up your suggestions re the snubber tape. I have bought "stuff" from the Restoration Supply Co before. Not always totally satisfactory, nothing wrong with the quality or service just not quite the "right stuff".......Re the priming cup I really only need one to replace the non original one as I am sure that I will be able to repair the two ones with broken arms. If I cannot do it myself I am sure that son Steve will be able to assist.Bernie J. Edited April 7, 2011 by oldcar (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1928Packard526 Posted April 7, 2011 Share Posted April 7, 2011 Bernie —I used the snubber belt material from RSC on the rebuild of the WATSON STABILATORS that serve as snubbers on my '28. I found no problems with their belting as to installation, fit or service. My "shocks" still work and the belting is in good shape after some 20 years of mild service. I don't know what problems you might have encountered with other RSC products, but I think you won't have any problems with their belting as long as the 3/16" thickness is the correct dimension. The primer cups are a different matter. The ones offered are quite a bit different, compared to the Packard originals.Pete P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 8, 2011 Author Share Posted April 8, 2011 Hi PeteMy main gripe with RSC was due to some of their electrical equipment (fuse holders and headlamp reflectors in particular) not being as described in their catalogue. some of their other reproduction parts such as their Dash lamps leave quite a bit to be desired. But enough negative thoughts.On a more positive note below is a photograph of the original Packard Priming cup that I require one or possibly three of. I am not looking for freebies but are prepared to pay fair market value for the right thing.Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenHupp20 Posted April 8, 2011 Share Posted April 8, 2011 I have one that seems close , measures 1 3/4 " overall height.Also two others which might give you the handle portion you need for the others,with a little work.Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1928Packard526 Posted April 8, 2011 Share Posted April 8, 2011 Bernie —It appears "KenHup" has at least one correct primer cup. The taller one could easily be shortened, but it has a hexagonal wrenching point. The correct Packard cup has a square, 4 flat base. The other one could only supply parts, perhaps. This also means you must seriously modify one of the cups you have with a hex base or locate yet another. My friend in FL looked through my spares for me and it appears I have no correct Packard priming cups. This probably explains why I plugged the holes in the head of my '28 years ago. The proper cups were of secondary importance then. Later, Pete P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 9, 2011 Author Share Posted April 9, 2011 Hi Ken & PeteI have sent you both e-mails but now I have a question for all my Single Six owning friends. Both my foot brake and clutch "arms" have been nickel plated at some time long ago, probably from new. It appears that only the section that comes through the toe boards has been "polished" the rest painted black over the nickel. Is this normal Packard practice? Should I have them re-plated or have them stripped and then paint them?Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1928Packard526 Posted April 9, 2011 Share Posted April 9, 2011 Bernie —Since my '28 is 2400 miles away in FL, I could not make a direct check of its pedal arms, but as I remember they are black for their entire length. I also checked whatever photo evidence I have of other cars that might apply. I see and have seen no evidence of nickeled arms. You must have a singular example. I found nickeled pedals, (seems wrong to me), and other strange arrangements, but no nickeled arms. Here are two example photos that show arms. The pict on the left is of my car 5 years ago. I installed rubber covers on my pedals. The pict on the right is of a somewhat "over-restored" '27 car.Pete P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 9, 2011 Author Share Posted April 9, 2011 (edited) Thanks PeteI always value your opinion. Attached is todays photograph of my brake and clutch arms showing the remnants of nickel plating. Having just unearthed the pedal pads out of a box of small parts I can see that they too had been plated originally too. What is the experience of some other early 1920s single Six owner/restorers.The second photo shows the Gabriel snubbers ready to be re-assembled but first I have to obtain some new webbing strap. The main feature of the original strap was the brass strip riveted to one side. The replacement strapping available does not seem to have this. Bernie J. Edited April 10, 2011 by oldcar (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidMc Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 Bernie, The original pedal arms and the pedals on my 126 were nickel plated as were others that I have seen. I used the webbing from RSC for my Gabriel snubbers and it works perfectly. It does not come with the brass that separates the webbing where it wraps around the centre. The brass on my old snubbers was heavily cracked. I rebuilt mine using thin polished stainless steel material instead of brass. They still work although I have to say that when I first put the car back on the road I did not have the snubbers. When I fitted them a couple of years later the difference was barely noticeable!Unfortunately I do not have any spare primers. Incidentally I use the primers to put a small amount of fuel in each cylinder if it hasn't been run for a while. It makes the car easy to start.David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1928Packard526 Posted April 10, 2011 Share Posted April 10, 2011 Bernie —Considering the message from DavidMc I would guess that the earlier cars had plated arms which was a feature dropped in the "later" cars. I have no pictures of very early cars nor have I had a chance to actually check one out. My evidence of no plating may be "build-date" sensitive. At what point did Packard make the change would be the question since there appears a change was made.As an aside, in FL I lived on a dirt road which at times became severely rutted and "washboarded" by modern traffic. My '28 Packard rides over that bit of road as smoothly as my '96 Lincoln. It certainly handles that rough surface with more grace that my '29 Lincoln. I don't think the better ride was the result of the Watson Stabilators fitted to the car, but there is a very noticeable difference. The Packard has "poise" on rough roads that the older Lincoln seems to lack.Later, Pete P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 (edited) While I have been messing about with things like Snubbers and Priming cups, out at Sleeping Classics Aaron has been moving along with straightening out the fenders. Considering that they had all been savaged by a monster forklift truck during its 40 year long holiday on the docks I think that he is doing some excellent work.I have not been wasting my time entirely. I hope to have some information regarding a supply of snubber belt at a sensible price soon.Bernie J. Edited April 11, 2011 by oldcar (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Friartuck Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 Bernie, Perhaps premature, but nonetheless, how do you plan to finish the aluminum screw-on hubcaps? Leave natural cast and just paint the inside or were you thinking about sanding them smooth and polishing to a medium to high luster?Chris W. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cben09 Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 CAST hubcaps????? Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 11, 2011 Author Share Posted April 11, 2011 The hubcaps are a pressing as Ben suggests. I will probably leave them to my son Steve to polish. With his background in Jewellery he is an expert metal polisher, alternatively if he still has his anodising tank operative that could be an answer.Bernie J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Saxton Posted April 11, 2011 Share Posted April 11, 2011 As an aside, in FL I lived on a dirt road which at times became severely rutted and "washboarded" by modern traffic. My '28 Packard rides over that bit of road as smoothly as my '96 Lincoln. It certainly handles that rough surface with more grace that my '29 Lincoln. I don't think the better ride was the result of the Watson Stabilators fitted to the car, but there is a very noticeable difference. The Packard has "poise" on rough roads that the older Lincoln seems to lack. Pete P.You may find that the difference in handling you describe is due to the change in mounting the front springs, with the fixed pin at the rear and the steering box, and the shackled end at the front. So spring deflection interferes much less, if at all, with steering. The early series cars like Bernie's are not as impatient as the 5th series, because of engine developements. People who owned both, told me that the last of the sixes performed at least as well as the first small eight cylinder that replaced it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldcar Posted April 13, 2011 Author Share Posted April 13, 2011 (edited) A question for the judges......How far do I go. The original 1923 Packard Fueliser bronze Carburettor appears to have been plated over a "foundry" finish. The car is intended to be a "driver" albeit a very nicely restored one. Do I totally strip the whole carb and re-plate "everything"? Do I simply re-plate the obvious things like the cylindrical cover for the extra air diaphragm springs and the float bowl cover? Or do I simply clean and polish where applicable, bearing in mind that this after all is an 88 year old motor car.Bernie J Edited April 13, 2011 by oldcar (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexRiv_63 Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 Bernie,I know very little about Packards so forgive a dumb question - why is there a spark plug attached to that carburetor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 Do I totally strip the whole carb and re-plate "everything"? Do I simply re-plate the obvious things like the cylindrical cover for the extra air diaphragm springs and the float bowl cover? Bernie JJust my opinion, but I think if you just plated the diaphragm and float bowl cover, that would be enough (don't forget to dress those screw heads). If, after you're finished with the car, have it running just right, etc., and the finish of the carburetor bothers you, you can easily remove it and have it done then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1928Packard526 Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 Don (TexRiv-63)—Google "fuelizer" for a rather complete explanation of just what the spark plug did plug, and how the fuelizer was to operate. I don't know if it was effective or not.Pete P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cben09 Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 The spark plug thing,,,,Can someone copy a page from the owners handbook,,It's called a Fuelizer,,There is a by-pass around the throttle,,a pocket,,where a fire is going,,spark from the tag end of the coil s hi tension winding feeds the plugThe plug has a real large gap,,special plugTo make the mixture good,,,a small needle to regulate extra air is fitted,This arrangement feeds HOT gasses into the manifild instantly on startup,,to assist in vaporizing the bad gasolene of that time,,The gas of that time was said to be between gas[petrol] and lamp oil,,Time frame,,1915-1926 appox,,The priming cups are for Ether,,Additional info in Dykes,,,Cheers,,Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cben09 Posted April 13, 2011 Share Posted April 13, 2011 Most of the packard hubcaps I have seen are spinnings, I don't recall the details of the Packard "30 " [4 cyl ] car [1906-1912] but they were the same size ,,, some hex in the center MAY have been green,, Twin-6 and later are spinnings,,EXCEPT, around,,around,,1930 there were die cast ,a larger cap,,,and some Jr 8 had a small cap on rear like the Twin-6 [1915-1923] rear caps,, The diecast caps were chrome plated and usually/occasionally? fitted with a chrome sleeve over the hub ,,Alloy spinnings were polished and of course became a subtle gray,,,,like platinum,, I dont recall anyone polishing the alloy caps,,tho as new I am sure they were,, Platinum was the interior finnish of many closed Locomobiles,, Hope this helps,,Cheers,,Ben //PS the 626/633 were faster and smoother than the 1928-6cyl,,,,but the 6 was a better starter in --20f weather,,Both good cars,,I still have a soft spot for the old "30"There was a special STRAP WRENCH to remove the caps without dammaging the hex,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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