carbking

Ed - I am not going to be much help, other than history. 7-42A is the first engineering change (there were two) to the early production 1941 front carb on series 40 and 50 with Strombergs. These cars had MAJOR driveability problems with the progressive linkage carbs. This fact is evidenced by: 1941 front carb 40 and 50 with Strombergs: 7-42 (first run) Changed 7-42A Changed 7-42B Replaced mid-year 7-46 Changed 7-46A Superceded in 1942 with 7-59 Changed 7-59A Superceded post WWII 7-73 The 7-42 didn't last long enough for Stromberg to issue a field print. I do have the original blueprint, but it was archived to a 500 foot roll of microfilm, and I have not digitized it to date. The secondary carbs have approximately the same bad history. I cannot (easily get you the Stromberg part number for the switch). The above history of these set-ups illustrates why I have been suggesting two identical carbs and solid linkage for years. Jon

The number of the Stromberg carburetor is STAMPED (recessed number), NOT CAST (raised number), and may be found looking at the top surface of the airhorn (top casting) along one of the sides. IF BUICK, it will be a 7-nnnc, where the nnn represents a number from 1 to 3 digits, and the c represents an engineering status code. The engineering status code may or may not be present. This is the Stromberg "code" number, and the easiest way to identify Stromberg carburetors beginning about 1933 (with the exception of FoMoCo). The 7 was the Stromberg customer number for Buick. Other often found customer numbers: 3 (Dodge, later Chrysler), 6 (Studebaker), 10 (Packard), 205 (Cadillac). Examples: 7-69 (1948 Buick) 7-69A (one slight engineering change to the 7-69 carburetor) 7-69B (second slight engineering change to the 7-69 carburetor) The number in the Buick parts book, as well as the Stromberg "sales" number, are found only on the carburetor tag, which generally is not present. And even if present, are difficult to cross, as the Stromberg literature uses the code numbers. Jon.

David - I have had zero positive results in attempting to reseal a float which has previously been in fuel. Balsa wood may be used for a float (hobby shops). Have never tried the wine corks (might be enjoyable acquiring the corks ), but walked by the wine display in the grocery yesterday, and happened to look at the prices. Ouch! Glad my favorite beverage is tea! Should you machine a new float from either the above, the dope used to coat the fabric on model airplanes will seal the float. As to your float pin, once you have removed everything from the bowl that heat will hurt, heat the area around the float pin with an acetylene torch; the heat gun does not supply sufficient heat. As mentioned by Rod Wise above, the thread diameter is 7/32" and the thread pitch is 32 threads/inch. This was a favorite thread with Marvel. The part number for the pin is 33-501, and is a part that surprisingly, was used on many of the early brass Marvel carbs. Possibly a junk donor carb could be found to donate a good pin. Jon.

The Buick part number would be useful if one finds a switch in an original Buick box. However, there are probably many more Stromberg parts in Stromberg boxes, with Stromberg part numbers, than in Buick boxes. I do not have a Buick/Stromberg part number interchange. If you would supply the number of your Stromberg carburetor, I can see what I have available. Jon

For Sale - a new two volume reprint of the Chrysler Master Parts List Final Edition printed in 1934, basically covers 1925-1934 Chrysler cars. I bought this in my continuing effort to document the Penberthy Ball & Ball carburetors, HOPING that there would be parts information in this book. I called the vendor and asked, and the vendor told me there were several illustrations of carburetors. I don't expect the literature vendor to know the difference in carburetors, so ordered the books (paid $70. plus $8. freight direct from publisher). When I received the books, looked in the index for the carburetor section (section 14) and turned to that section. Stromberg and Carter are very well covered, but nothing on Penberthy Ball & Ball. Not the vendor's fault (I was willing to take the chance), so not even going to try to send the books back. But, I don't need them. So will sell at $50. plus postage ($8. book rate). You save $20. I have now pretty much given up on documenting the Penberthy Ball & Ball parts, and will do so myself from carburetors in my inventory. EDIT: just noticed city/state/country should be in ad. Apologies. Eldon/Missouri/USA. First telephone call with a VISA/MasterCard to 573-392-7378 (9-12, 1-4 Mon-Tues central time) gets the books. I will update this thread once they have been sold. Jon.

My most used indispensable tool WAS free. My Dad's advice: "Son, just good enough is NEVER just good enough!". And yes, it took awhile for this fact to be properly learned, and appreciated. Jon.

Is the automatic choke functioning normally, and you are waiting until the choke butterfly is completely open prior to attempting to adjust the idle? Also, rough idle or higher than normal idle is often a function of a vacuum leak. Jon.

The two-barrel will work well. A properly selected/tuned four-barrel will deliver more power at WOT, and should raise the maximum RPM of the engine slightly (maybe a good thing, maybe not); and, depending on the driving habits of the operator, SHOULD give somewhat better fuel economy. I can honestly state that, while some others like fuel injection, I personally do not live in an area that requires it. I can see no easier starting (it regularly gets below zero in Missouri winters), driveability, or performance with fuel injection compared to my carburetor vehicles (however, I may have a wee bit more experience in tuning carburetors than some ) I will grant that the vehicles I start/drive in the winter ALL have manual chokes. We have more trouble with electronic ignitions than anything else, even on modern vehicles. I will grant that while (so far) we have had no trouble with the 2014 Ford, average mean time to failure on factory electonic ignitions on everything else has been about 35,000 miles. My 1979 Ford Mustang that I special ordered in 1979, now has 55,000 miles, is always, has never seen snow, and rain only once, is currently on its FOURTH electronic ignition! Dad had two different vans (1988, 2008) that both had major fuel injection reliability issues. (And fixing efi AFTER it goes out of warranty is NOT inexpensive!). Other than those, 1997 van had efi problems at 80k. If I lived in an area such as Colorado, and regularly drove from about 2500' to 12,000', I would certainly consider fuel injection. While I can make my Carters work well at all of those altitudes, I would have to change metering rods (a 3-minute task). Fuel injection certainly handles major altitude changes easier than carburetors. The above just my personal experience. Those that prefer efi, or electronic ignitions, go for it! Just please don't try to convince me they are overall superior to carburetors, points, and condenser (well, condensers made in the USA ). Jon.

Changes can be made. Three things can happen: (1) there is an improvement, (2) there is no measurable change, (3) things get worse. I am reminded of a quote attributed to Coach Royal when he was a "ground-pounder" at Texas: "When you pass the ball, three things can happen; two of them are bad" Jon.

What size engine??? In 1957, Buick used the Carter AFB number 2507s on the 364 CID. The 1957 AFB's (first year) were not the best AFB's Carter ever made (still head and shoulders above the modern imitation AFB's). By 1959, Carter had updated the accelerator pump check valve, and the 1959 and newer carbs were great carbs. The factory replacement carburetor for the 2507s was the Carter 2982s (1960 carb). If you have a 364 CID, that would be my suggestion. Unless you have heavily modified the engine for racing, the factory carburetor is generally the way to go. To quote a friend who posts on a different forum: "Engineers do things for a reason". Jon.

Lots of good points in this thread, especially the parking. That vehicle would take up FOUR parking places in a modern Wal-Mart parking lot!!! You might need a parking pass on the football field at college! I really like the idea of keeping Grandpa's car in the family. I have my Dad's truck. Grandpa never had a car, he believed in "single horsepower vehicles" Redo the car over time, and do it right. I think many are underestimating the cost to make a nice driver out of a vehicle that has sat that long. Tires, all fluids, all hoses, all electrical ignition components including battery, complete exhaust, probably brakes, probably front end components would need replacing. Unless known to be otherwise, the engine, transmission, final drive, etc. are probably OK. Find a beater to drive to school. Jon.

Timing could certainly be the culprit; also a sticking intake valve. One other issue (don't laugh) is gasoline with too HIGH an octane! Many enthusiasts burn the highest octane fuel they can find, when their engine has insufficient compression or timing to make use of the octane. If the carburetor is perfectly tuned, and the ignition and compression are also good, av gas, racing gas, or 93 octane pump gas could cause a surge under high vacuum conditions in a lower compression engine. Just as an example, my shop truck 10.25:1 compression with 450 HP is very happy on 87 octane pump gas except when pulling the 16 foot trailer, or being driven in anger. Under either of these conditions, 93 octane pump fuel is used. Jon.

Consider this thread closed, as I purchased a copy of the 1924-1933 manual. Jon.

Anyone have a Chrysler model 75 factory parts book that would photocopy the pages on the Penberthy/Ball & Ball model DB-20 carburetor? I would be happy to pay for the service. After 50 years, I found and bought a looks to be complete carburetor for patterns. The castings are garbage as they generally are, and will probably be dust before I get it apart, but I would like to know factory part numbers to store the parts in my samples files. I think I have been asked twice in the last 50 years, but will now be able to offer a kit if anyone has one with rebuildable castings. Thanks in advance. Jon.

The suject of clones/tribute/whatever, as mentioned by others, CAN get polarizing. One thing I have not seen in this thread is legality. In Missouri, if you were to place GTO emblems on a 1964 Tempest, and you are caught (highly unlikely except when the car is retitled) by the state, the title changes from 1964 Tempest to 2020 Homebuilt. Have fun getting the 2020 Homebuilt past inspection, and then insured! Jon.

Buick compound carburetion (factory) for the smaller Buick inline eight cylinder. Bought this at a swap meet 40 years ago when I could pick it up and carry it under one arm. 40 years later, I cannot pick it up, so will not ship. You pick it up in Eldon, Missouri (located 30 miles SW of Jefferson City on US Hwy 54). I bought it with the intention of restoring and reselling (I have specialized in multiple carb sets for 50 years), but never got around to it; so selling as is. Two of our carburetor rebuildings kits are included in the price.Unit appears to be complete, dirty, rusty, and stuck. Unit has been in inside storage (metal building, concrete floor) since I bought it. Note all fuel fittings, air cleaner, both intake AND exhaust manifolds all are included. Unit will be sold as is, inspect to your satisfaction when you arrive.Carbs are factory Stromberg (both Carter and Stromberg were used by Buick).573-392-7378 (9-12, 1-4 Mon-Tues central time) to discuss.When you pick it up, we can accept cash, VISA, or MasterCard. Price - $850. in Eldon, Missouri.No offense, but no checks, or money orders.You will receive an invoice from The Carburetor Shop.I apologize for only one picture, but as stated above, I can no longer lift this item.Jon.

Stromberg type DD-3 used carburetor, needing rebuilding prior to use, listed on Ebay. Gears are bad, and will require replacement. To discuss, 573-392-7378 (9-12, 1-4 Mon-Tues central time). Ebay auction number - 363111051432 Jon.

"Gasoline" in the 19 teens, atomized about as well as kerosene. Many early carburetors used some form of heat to help atomized the gasoline. (1) water-jacketed carburetors (2) exhaust-jacketed carburetors (3) hot air taken off the exhaust manifold to intake to the carburetor (4) an electrical heater in the carburetor bowl to heat the gasoline. (TRUE!) As far as the Ford water heated chokes, GM used them as well on a few models in the early to mid 1960's. Virtually impossible to find one of these carburetors today that can be rebuilt without fabricating an entire new choke assembly. Jon.

Very few carburetors cross over EASILY, and still give excellent performance! I don't know (and frankly, don't care) how many e-clones are being made; however, Carter built 505 different AFB carburetors. They did not make so many different simply to spend money that would otherwise be awarded to investors, for R and D instead. And these, for the most part, do NOT cross over easily. If one has decades of experience, and a boat load of parts, they will cross over to a certain degree. Read the third line in my signature block Cliff has specialized in the Q-Jet for decades. I doubt there is anyone alive as knowledgeable about the Q-Jet as Cliff. A plug here: I have read hundreds, probably over a thousand carburetor books since 1959 when I did my first Holley carburetor. Cliff's book is absolutely at the head of the group in being "user-friendly" (one does not need an advanced degree in mathematics to use the book) to use the current vernacular; and would easily be in the top 4 or 5 for overall best. Anyone considering rebuilding a Q-Jet should first read the book. Lots of really sharp technical people are unable to convey their knowledge to others. Cliff can, and does. And to keep those interested from having to ask, "Weber Carburetors", by John Passini would be my favorite for best, but I had to dust off my college calculus books to understand it! Jon.

Check this link: Hard starting, hot engine Jon.

Adding some additional early multi-maker carburetor literature to the "for sale" section of my website; Lit_1043 - Motor Car Carburetor by the Automotive Journal 1916. 8 1/2 x 11 inches by 56 pages. Some of the red ink on the cover has bled onto some of the pages, otherwise nice. Operation and adjustment information on the following carburetors: Alco, Amplex, Bennett, Bowers, Capitaine, Chadwick, Carter, Durr, Economy, Franklin, G & A, G & C, Gaeth, Hamilton, Holley, Kingston, Locomobile, Longuemare, Maxwell, Mathewson, Mayer, Marienfelde, Peerless, Pierce-Arrow, Rayfield, S. G. V., Sleipner, Stearns, Schebler, Stromberg, Universal, and Willett. Price $200.00 Lit_1046 - 1923 Military Ignition and Carburetion training manual. 6 x 9 inches by 240 pages. Ex-library copy, excellent condition. Describing ONLY the carburetion section. Theory and service information on: Stromberg models G and M, Marvel, Cadillac (made by Johnson), Schebler H (motorcycle), Stewart (Detroit Lubricator) model 25 (Dodge), Zenith, White carbs; also Stewart vacuum tanks. Price $100.00 (This is the source for the information I posted on the White carburetor earlier). Lit_1044 - Automobile Carburetor Manual by ICS from 1938. 8 1/2 x 11 inches by 133 pages. Paperback, with rough cover. Inside pages are nice. Theory and service information on: Carter B & B, W-0, W-1, WD-0, WCD, Chandler-Groves, Detroit Lubrication (both updraft and downdraft), Marvel, ED1S, ED2S, EDS, B, AC (motorcycle), C, CD, Stromberg AA, AX, DDR, DXR, EE, U, UR, UUR, BX, Tillotson D, U, UR, DY, Zenith 20, 28, INxxx, K, CARBURETOR APPLICATION CHARTS, automatic chokes, and more. Price $150.00 Jon.

Instead of burying this in the White car thread, decided to begin a new topic. In going through carb literature to sell, I found the following information about the White carburetor: Apparently White made a two-barrel as well as the single barrel. The concept should be at least similar. Ed, I am really looking forward to the back to back test. Jon

I think we make kits for all 460 different Schebler model S carburetors. Like the Marvel they later married, very little is interchangeable from model to model, so finding the carburetor identification number is crucial to acquiring the correct kit. For single barrel carbs, the identification number is STAMPED approximately midway from top to bottom horizontally in a "boss" on the end of the carburetor OPPOSITE the air valve. For duplex (2-barrel) carbs the number is STAMPED over the "hump" in the top casting that houses the intermediate shaft. THE IDENTIFICATION NUMBER IS ALWAYS IN THE FORMAT "SX-nnn" where nnn is a one, two, or three digit number from 1 to 460. An example I remember SX-389 is the duplex used on the Duesenberg J. Another one often seen is the SX-7, which was a universal replacement carb, although why anyone would wish to put a Schebler S on something it did not come on is beyond comprehension! THE CAST (RAISED) SV NUMBERS ARE TOTALLY MEANINGLESS! Jon

Sometime when you are conversing with Cliff, ask him about the dyno test of his Pontiac 455? It was tested with a Q-Jet, and got some really nice figures. Then the operator made a comment to the effect "let's see what this engine will do with a REAL carburetor" and dropped on an 880 Holley. Lost several pounds-feet, and a few ponies. Operator was flabergasted! The Q-Jet is in my top three of street carburetors. Jon.

You might try a bit of valve lapping compound and lap the fuel needle and the seat GENTLY to remove any varnish, burr, corrosion, etc.; then wash both components in gasoline. If this does not work, then you might put in a new fuel valve and seat. As far as a neoprene tip, I have not figured out how to incorporate a neoprene tip on this design because of the leading position pin required to center the tip in the seat. The carb should NOT leak while running, but may when the engine is shut off. Jon.