1912Staver

In the late 1960's one of my primary school teachers bought himself a brand new 1968 Corvette, another slightly older teacher had a very nice Jag MK 2. Most of the other teachers cars were pretty ordinary. A couple of VW bugs and one Morris Minor come to mind. And a Mini Cooper, by grade 7 we could all grab onto a bumper or fender well and turn it 180 degrees in the teachers parking lot. It's a wonder we didn't pull the bumpers right off it.

Was Baker eventually taken over by Jaxon ?

Great information Layden ! I have to gather up some more catalogs. Neither my 1923 or 1930 catalogs show any of this.

Nothing that wide , mine are all 1912 / 13 era larger model Buick car.

I had a closer look at the Baker rims and wheels I have. There are " bumps ' pressed into the rim and felloe band to space the rim away from the felloe and ensure the rim mounts concentric with the wheel. Easily enough room for the plate as you have made up.

I don't belive Baker used a plate like that. I have a rim parts catalog that shows many rim small parts, drive plates, latches , lots and lots of things other than the actual rims. But no plate like you have made. But the one brand that isn't covered all that well in the catalog is Baker. I have a few Baker wheels and rims and those 4 pins just seem to engage into holes in the metal felloe band. I think a plate like you have made would make it difficult to center the rim on the wheel. Not by a lot , just the thickness of the plate. My guess is that it is important for the pins to have as much depth of insertion into the wheel as possible. Once mounted on the wheel it is impossible for the rim to seperate at the split anyway. the felloe band does just as good a job of keeping the ends together as your plate will. But Mark has a lot more experence with Baker rims { early teens Buicks } than I do so I would expect if he says there should be a plate there most likely should be one. Do they show up in Buick parts books ? I don't have any old enough to show Baker stuff. Just cage valve 6's and newer.

Hi Terry. I had a chance to have a good look at a FWD truck a couple of years ago. When I crawled under it with my measuring tape and measured the basic engine and sub frame measurements I was amazed at how close it all was to the sub frame of my Staver Chicago. That started me thinking that a Wisconsin might be a viable alternative to the almost impossible to find Teetor Hartley my car came with. But as you say, these Wisconsin's are quite rare as well.

Apart from the right front damage it does not look that bad. Asking 6 so they would probably take 5. One of the few 60's full size cars I really like. I think it could be a great driver for the right person. Like Ben says, non concours . A good start to a usable car you won't be worried to frequently drive. Quite close to me, but my project line up is full.

Thanks Terry , those are great scans ! It looks like the difference between Type A and Type B is actually the displacement. Type A , 4 3/4 X 5 1/2 vs Type B, 4 1/4 X 5. I always thought it was the mounting provision. In that case I am probably looking for a Type B with the narrow mountings.

The early Jaccox box is an easy one, plus it was also used in hundreds of thousands of Buicks in the same time period. So parts are relatively easy to find if needed. The later Ross box is probably a more difficult unit. Ed in Mass may have had experence with it. He seems to do quite a bit of steering box work on slightly newer cars.

Hi Layden, what year is your rim catalog ? I have the 1930 edition and it shows the exact same illustration as the E4 sleve drive, but it doesn't even mention the earlier Type E split base version. My 1923 catalog shows the E4 as well but does not show the two holes. Uses a different illustration.

Layden, of course you are 100 % correct as usual. I forgot all about Firestone E's. I think they may be the only Firestone rim to feature those two holes, but as usual I am always open to correction.

Bob, your rims appear to be Kelsey Hayes. The two holes on either side of the " split " are generally a Kelsey Hayes feature. But my rim catalog does not show any of the Kelsey Hayes of this style as large as 25 ". Most are 20 inch or 21 inch. Odd to see a split rim on a wood felloe wheel. Wood felloe wheels started to be replaced by metal felloe wheels by the early 1920's, around the time split rims started to be used. Your rim bolts and clamps look to be Firestone style. Perhaps your rims are newer than the wheels. Most rims and felloe bands are stamped with a makers name or trade mark. If you lightly sand blast or wire brush them you may be able to read it.

$4250.00 ? Cute enough for a garden tractor I suppose, but dosen't that strike anyone as a tad optimistic ?

Unfortunately in my area those restored cars are $40,000.00 and up ( well up }. Not $20,000.00. You could sell 20, $1400.00 , 4 speed car, 73 Z28's in a weekend around here. Needy 79, 80, 81 Z runners are $20,000.00 in this neck of the woods.

It's my belief thet of the 3 major club magazines ( AACA, VMCCA and HCCA } the Bulb Horn circa 1950's to somewhere in the 1970's was the best. Later years it is the HCCA , Gazette. Not sure what happened to the VMCCA, I suspect along with the AACA to a certain degree they lost their true early and pre war car focus and tried to be all things to all era's of collector cars and their owners. Just my personal bias. I can learn things about post war cars in many different places and formats. The early cars are very difficult to learn about unless you have the resources to actually own them or they are the focus of a club with a good club magazine. Even the best commercial old car magazine or internet article really only just scratch the surface of a featured early car. A few books are also very good , but there are frustratingly few of them, with only a tiny number of makes covered.

Hi Terry , I know where 3 of them { possibly 4 } ended up. Unfortunately none of them seem to be currently available. The Detroit library has an online scan of a Wisconsin engine catalog. Possibly the same one you have. I think I may use the catalog drawing to build a wood mock up of the crankcase and try that for test fitting.

I am still building up my shop fund. A slower and slower process these days I must say. So the " running and driving and everything " brass car fund is still many , many years away from achiving its objective. For decades I would attend the starting point gathering of the early car runs in my area . For a decade or more with my father , then on my own as he got more and more interested in seniors sports and usually had a game on old car days. It was always great to see the cars, and pick up bits and pieces of old car knowledge along the way. But of course always as an observer. Some day I really hope to change all of that, and have a drivable early car of my own. Its been a 50 + year ambition now and most likely still quite a long way in the future. At least I now know a few of the people in my area who are active participants and am ocasionally able to tag along on a much appreciated, back seat ride!

I would say a good chunk of the " better " brass cars are locked up in serious money collections. So no soup for those of us in the cheap seats for at least a couple of decades yet. It will be too late for me , but hope springs eternal. Still might be able to swing a " better " 1920's car by the early 2030's if I play my cards right. With luck I might have most of my old age to enjoy it.

Looks like a great trip. Not to be pedantic, but I think you will find the XK 120 is actually a Jowett Jupiter.

Rare and desirable car ! But could you find the rest of it in a lifetime ? For $2000.00 it would be worth taking a chance that a rough sedan might also turn up.

I like the Studebaker and the sedan delivery. Prices seem reasonable for California cars.

Those engine mounts might even be something with a big opposed twin engine like a Northern.

Sounds exactly like the group I learned the Marine Engineering game under here in Canada. " Up your kilt with a wire brush " was a favorite phrase of one of my Chief's. Thankfully rarely directed at me, but it had a real withering quality. He knew his stuff inside out and did not tolerate fools in the slightest. During a major overhall he was assigned to a ship in our company temporarily along with myself. At the end of his first week he started to pack up all his stuff as if to leave and not come back. The actual Senior Chief of the ship asked him what he was doing. The old Scots fellow said that having seen how things were being run for the previous week he wanted no further part of the overhaul. Senior Chief realised he was about to loose one of his best guys , Scots gent replied that he would stay under one condition, that the Senior Chief come back in the morning with his First Class engineers papers, " because I don't believe you have any ". Never saw him on that ship again.

Sounds like my place, but no Jag's here. Just MGA's, a friend and I are both MGA nut's and he keeps all of his here, as well the odd Lotus and TVR. When I sell cars I always price them fairly so apart from living in the hinterlands surrounding Vancouver a different approach to your guy. Like I say , there seems to be a fair number of late 1950's , early 1960's Jag's coming on to the market. They were good sellers around here and quite a few were tucked away awaiting better economic conditions starting in the 1980's and onward. Time is running out for many of those guys and the cars are changing hands after a long sleep. Most households are still in the cost of living doldrums and only a fraction of the cars put away have been returned to the road at this point. I am a good 10 years younger than most of the Jag guys, so not giving up hope yet. But with 3 MGA's and a few others, no Jags for me. I can easily complete all 3 MGA's { one for me, one for my wife, one for my son } for less time and money than one MK 2 would take.