1912Staver

I agree if you are talking GM muscle. The engine is the main proof the car is what the seller is saying it is. Fords and Mopars are a somewhat different case. The engine type shows up in the serial number . On 428 CJ cars the engine number is often extremely hard to read , even with the engine sitting clean on a stand. As long as it is a proper engine , say a 271 HP 289 in a K code Mustang or a CJ in a Q or R code Torino , Mustang ,Cougar , Cyclone then I don't get too concerned even if it is a non serial number matching block. I agree correct engine / non matching number cars should sell at something of a discount. Unless it is something like a ZL-1 car of course. But it's not something that would rule out a given car for me. A CJ car is a CJ car in my books, same with a K code Mustang. The fact that counts for me is the car is the real deal high performance version. Engines are more or less a consumable. Too many years messing with track cars I guess. How many GT 350 R models do you think still have the factory block? I expect very few indeed. Does not seem to hurt the price one bit.

The very sporting roadster is not one I recognise. I don't think it is a Mercer ? Also those rear tires on the truck are huge, and the rear wheels themselves look very unusual. The truck itself isn't that large , a 2 ton perhaps . But those are tires I would expect to see on a 5 ton or larger.

Welch was built from about 1904 - 1911. It was bought by GM in 1910 and was more or less absorbed into the GM organisation with cars only built for a year or two after the buy out. Only a very small number of Welch's have survived. One in particular was owned by noted author and early participant in the old car hobby Ralph Stein. The car is featured in one of his well known books about vintage cars. Yet another one of those higher end cars that for one reason or another were almost scrapped to extinction 80 to 100 years ago.

About the only thing any sane person would swap a 1917 Cadillac engine in to is another 1917 Cadillac.

Sorry if I offended you. Yes, there very wealthy people scattered from coast to coast in Canada. And they can own pretty much anything they choose. I have concidered moving back to the prairies from time to time , but my wife will have no part of it. She is no fan of the tiny bit of winter we get here in the Vancouver area let alone 4 or 5 months of it. But the price of property compared to here would allow me to have almost any vintage car I could think of. Unfortunately divorce is a costly undertaking. My main point was simply that most prairie cars are relatively ordinary sedans , plus a healthy dose of trucks. Yes the condition is often quite good. And as a basis for a rod what more could you ask for ? How many of those Sask. pickups stay stock I wonder ? But for something like that Jowet sedan just getting it to Vancouver would cost a good chunk of what it is realistically worth. Your friends Auburn sounds very interesting. Only a very small handfull in all of Canada . One lives close to me , a knock your socks off car that I see out and about from time to time in good weather. The owner is on the forum from time to time. But unless I move to your area no way I can afford one. I am sure your friend had to dig deep for it, unfortunately there is no Santa Claus. Sorry if I sound elitist if saying I want a upper middle class vintage car makes me that. I have been been around vintage cars for almost 50 years now and very few of the Ford's ,Chevy's , Plymouth's , Dodges, Nash's , Oldsmobiles etc do much for me anymore. I have seen a few Marmon 34's for around the $20 G's { U.S. } mark over the last 5 years, but always the wrong time for me and too far away. But hardly a rich man only price point. Do keep finding them ! And please do post them in the for sale section of the forum if they are ones you want to re sell. You never know, what is your transport price out to the coast ?

The only thing I am remotely in the market for is a upper middle class , sports touring or roadster., 1916 - roughly 1925, Stutz, Marmon model 34, Paige , Auburn or similar. Big 4 Cyl. or more likely a 6. Center lock wire wheels a must. What do you have that is close to this ?

I am not saying there are no interesting old car back on the prairies { I am originally from Winnipeg }, just the really good ones are very few and far between. Also, not much point in showing photo's from the Reynolds Museum warehouse. Those cars were mainly gathered up decades ago, and most of the important ones came from the U.S. { Barney Pollard collection }. Great collection { Reynolds Alberta } but hardly what someone is going to find in a old farm shed today.

From google it says they are in Castle Rock, Colorado. If you are going to have a large shop you need a location where land is reasonably priced. . A quick google search shows lots of 5 AC. places for $10,000 - $20,000 in rural CO. Around my area the same would be $1,000,000.00 - $2,000,000.00.

It all depends on what you are looking for. I agree there are still lots of " old cars / trucks " on the prairies. But most of them are quite ordinary vehicles that don't appeal to many besides street rodders. Transportation costs doom most of them to a date with the scrapper eventually.

The whole situation of matching up pre 1930 parts with the people who need them is a huge can of worms. The parts are often very rare, but only a handfull of people need them once you get away from the most common 5 makes or so. And North America's huge geography really works against us. In an ideal world it would all end up a giant version of Hershey each year, roughly in the geographic center of the continent. And everyone looking for parts would attend . But due to the vast distances and travel costs this will never happen. So every year tons of rare parts that someone someware would almost kill for end up as scrap. The U.K. is so much more fortunate. The Beaulieu Autojumble is huge. And the U.K. is small enough that almost anyone can travel to it. Really no good answser for a place as big as North America. The internet is no big help either. The parts needs to be identified, described, listed , priced. And it has to be posted somewhere where someone who needs it will see it. 99% of the time this does not work. Just too many moving parts to the process. Easier to just make what you need rather than spending decades fruitlessly looking. Would love to make it to Hershey one year, but just the trip alone is a few thousand dollars. And then if I do find something I am in a pickle getting it home. I would have to fly from the Pacific North West , and then have everything shipped by a freight forwarder to Canada..Serious costs at every turn.

Short anwser is you either make the part yourself, or pay someone else to make it for you.

Less than 300 1960 Edsel wagons produced. Interesting car.

Nice car. But for a fraction of the cost you could own a car that the alloy big blocks really put on the map { and vice versa } . A McLaren M8, circa 1969 or 1970. Some McLarens change hands as cheaply as $350,000.00. Seems a fantastic deal to me compared to 2.5 - 3 Mill for the Vette. And then you have a car that can put all that ZL-1 power to constructive use rather than just shreading tires.

So it sounds like these were made in 27", 25" and 23 " . Every couple of years Cadillac seems to drop the diameter 2 inches. I have a 1926 Cadillac rolling chassis, Kelsey Hayes wheels in 19 " . The rims are a completely different style by this point. Balloon tires starting I think in 1926 so a much wider rim. But also a split rim rather than a side ring style rim on these older Cadillac's.

My older catalog only covers 1916 and up. But I expect 1915 is the same. { Before 1915 I think Cadillac used Baker rims and hardware } It shows a Kelsey " Universal " in 36 x 4 1/2. The details vary, but I believe the Universal description comes from the fact they directly interchange with the much more common for this era Firestone rims. 36 x 4 1/2 is a 27 inch rim. My newer wheel assy is the same general style of rim , rings and felloe , but 34 x 4 1/2 or 25" . Acording to my catalog the 1916 and 17 Cadillac ,Kelsey 36 x 4 1/2 rims { and I presume 1915 as well } were not used on any other vehicles. But the 27" Firestone rims were used on many larger cars in the 1914 - 1916 era. { I think the rims in Ed's photo are Firestones as per his comments in the " Great White " thread } I strongly suspect you could use Firestone wedge rings on your Cadillac. But any 27 " rims, bands, or rings are quite pricy and hard to find these days. They are used on most of the more desirable late Brass / early Nickel era cars.

30 Dodge, yes , the last 4 in your catalog illustration are examples of what I am talking about. Kelsey rims of this type were used a few different cars . But Cadillac was probably the most popular. Somewhere I have a complete Cadillac wheel from about this vintage . So with some digging I could determine which cross section is correct. But be aware, as far as I know there are a few different diameters of this style of rim. So the rings need to be both the correct cross section , and the correct diameter. I think my wheel is from about a 1919 Cadillac and is probably a smaller diameter than one for a 1915. I think the rims shown in your second post are slightly too new. I have a older catalog in my files that may show the rims and hardware for a 1915 version of the Kelsey wheel. I will see what I can come up with.

It looks like you are missing the ring that goes between the rim and the felloe. It is a wedge ring and the lugs press on it to wedge into the gap between the rim and the felloe. That takes up the play and makes a solid connection .

Great explanation bloo. You raise an important point about 23 " on clinchers and 21 " on straight side. I am slightly negative on clinchers. They have their drawbacks. But on a light car like a Tthey seem to work fine.

As far as I know there are only a small number { 2 or 3 ? } Cuttings surviving .

If those are correct late Model T wire wheels and the matching hubs they are reasonably desirable and can be sold for a decent price. I expect the rear brakes are the later, larger version as well so when you are looking for wood wheel hubs you will also have to make sure you get some later version rear drums. Wood wheel hubs are common and generally quite cheap. Other than very ealy hubs they are all the same. Likewise the steel felloes are usually reasonably cheap. Like others have detailed there are several versions of the felloe so the real trick is finding 4 of the same type. The hard part is finding 4 good rims of the same type. They are reproduced but get quite expensive for a full set. Good condition originals are becoming rare . And the first thing you have to decide is if you are going to use clincher or conventional straight side tires. That will decide what rims and felloe bands you need. It probably seems a bit confusing , but do some research and eventually it will all make sense.

I have said it several times on the forums. In most cases the cars are reasonably cheap. It's the property and shop building that costs the serious money. Property and building costs vary to a massive degree depending on what part of North America you live in. It can be the make or break factor of the entire old car hobby question. Depending on where you live the land { and house } can be as cheap as $100,000.00 or as expensive as a million or more. The shop is at least 50 G's these days , and often closer to the 100 G mark. All this so you can have a hobby car that is 95% of the time sub $100,000.00. { probably at least 75% of the time sub $50,000 } Steel is cheap. Dirt , concrete and lumber is anything but.

I believe that's a Vancouver B.C. area photo. Arrow Transfer has been a Vancouver company since about 1920. I don't think either the truck or the shovel survives today.

I am always on the lookout for a 1968 - 72 Ranchero. Likewise a 73 - 77 .El Camino. But any that I find that fit my budget always have some serious problem or another. They seem to be a lot harder to find in Canada than the U.S. and usually quite expensive. I passed on a pretty decent deal on a 1968 Ranch about 5 years ago. I have not seen as much value for money since. I do have a 1966 Mercury 1/2 ton. Owned it for over 30 years now. Really a great old truck , but showing its age. And it definitely drives like a truck. The dilemma at the time the 68 came available was should I take on a new one or put the time and money into the 66 1/2 ton. The 1/2 ton won out, but I still really like the idea of a " sort of " truck that drives like a car.

Quite a small car , but a rather sporting body. Not one I recognise. Perhaps some owner customization ?

I have a feeling these electric conversions cost quite a bit more than a $5000.00 - $10,000.00 engine, trans rebuild.