1974 Dodge Charger Rallye Hardtop 4-Speed Project

[alsancle]

This is super cool!   However, I hate the flipper trailer.

 

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1974-dodge-charger-10/

 

This 1974 Dodge Charger is a non-running project that is finished in Bright Red and equipped with a 400ci V8 and a Heavy Duty four-speed manual transmission. The car was also ordered with the Rallye Package and features a manual sunroof, a pistol-grip shifter, and Magnum wheels. Acquired by the seller in 2023, this Charger is now offered at no reserve with a clean New York title in the seller’s name.

 

[Reynard]

Appears amazingly complete for an abused old street racer. I'll let the new buyer go ahead and sink a fortune in it, then grab it when he bails.

 

 

[rocketraider]

Unusual, and could be a stunner. If that much rust through is visible, what's hidden?

 

Northeast rust, not running, little to no aftermarket or reproduction support, and not exactly popular even in Mopar circles. Hard pass. But we should hope someone will take it on and love it simply for the sunroof and four-speed.

 

For $1500, I think this might be not so much a flipper but someone who bought what he thought was a cool car and quickly realized what he had stepped into.

[Reynard]

On 3/5/2024 at 3:44 PM, rocketraider said:

 

For $1500, I think this might be not so much a flipper but someone who bought what he thought was a cool car and quickly realized what he had stepped into.

 

It's bid to $2,200. with 5 days to go...           (03/07/24)        

[TAKerry]

When I was a kid, my next door neighbor had one of these, probably not the same drivetrain🤔, she was probably my grandmothers age. Every time I see one hot rodded up now all I can think of is 'this was an old lady car', LOL.

[alsancle]

9 minutes ago, TAKerry said:

When I was a kid, my next door neighbor had one of these, probably not the same drivetrain🤔, she was probably my grandmothers age. Every time I see one hot rodded up now all I can think of is 'this was an old lady car', LOL.

 

We had one across the street too.   Guaranteed it wasn't the same drivetrain!

[1912Staver]

I expect the number of these ordered  with a 4 speed is very small indeed. With the price of Mopar's from the sweet spot era { 1968 - 71 } way up in the clouds I have a feeling this one might sell for a lot more than would have been the case 5 years ago or so. 

[alsancle]

3 minutes ago, 1912Staver said:

I expect the number of these ordered  with a 4 speed is very small indeed. With the price of Mopar's from the sweet spot era { 1968 - 71 } way up in the clouds I have a feeling this one might sell for a lot more than would have been the case 5 years ago or so. 

For decades, a four-speed was holy Grail for any muscle car. Price guides would tell you 10% premium which was BS. It was a lot more than that. Now I understand that automatics and air-conditioning is what brings the money.

[1912Staver]

Seriously ? If so the hobby has evolved in a way that I can't even begin to understand.

[1912Staver]

5 minutes ago, alsancle said:

For decades, a four-speed was holy Grail for any muscle car. Price guides would tell you 10% premium which was BS. It was a lot more than that. Now I understand that automatics and air-conditioning is what brings the money.

I have always used the + 40 % premium for 4 speeds.  + 50% if a buckets, console and factory tach. It's been this way in my experience since the mid 1980's .

Edited March 8 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[alsancle]

17 minutes ago, 1912Staver said:

I have always used the + 40 % premium for 4 speeds.  + 50% if a buckets, console and factory tach. It's been this way in my experience since the mid 1980's .

This is what I have always thought.   Factory tach was why I bought my GTO even though the rest of the car was a POS.    Not completely sure on the console as a man sized shifter coming up from the tunnel was a thing of beauty.

 

We need @Matt Harwood to tell us about the market for automatics and air conditioning.  I'm hoping I'm wrong.

[Matt Harwood]

There's certainly a premium to be paid for a manual transmission, but I find that it isn't as significant as it used to be and probably not 40%. A lot of these guys are getting old and prefer an automatic. There's a reason the Corvette only comes with an automatic--they know their clientele, which probably overlaps quite a bit with the buyers for this Dodge. And we frequently hear comments like, "If it only had [transmission opposite of what is in it], I'd buy it!"

 

A/C is a nice bonus but since it's so rare for an old car's A/C system to be operational (I'd say less than 10% of them actually work) that its appeal becomes more in terms of scarcity than value. It makes the car more attractive but I'm not sure there's much of a premium for it unless it's 100% operational. I wish I had a dollar for every time I asked a seller if the A/C worked and he said, "You know, I never tried it." Yeah, sure. That means it's broken. They're ALL broken. I try to price the cars as if they don't have A/C and let the next guy figure it out (which he won't).

 

I think this auction will struggle. It's an abused, neglected, smog-era car. The photos are horrible and the undercarriage shots don't show you much so you can't see just how rusty this car is (probably very). It's only a 400, not a 440, and those fuselage styling cars still live in the shadow of their older siblings. If the seller is REALLY engaging and part of the discussion then he might do OK, but if he's absent it's going to wither on the vine. But hey, it does have a nice dash pad, so you won't have to replace that and I like that the description specifically calls out the alligator air freshener like that's some kind of bonus. Nice work there, BaT!

 

On the other hand, maybe someone does something crazy and pays a fortune for it. I've seen more than one auction go way over a sensible number because the peanut gallery made the car seem like a smarter buy than it was. It happens all the time. Auctions are fun because they're so unpredictable. The recent sale of my Marmon engine shocked the hell out of me.

 

But a manual transmission and a console do not add as much as they used to. Maybe 20% these days. Remember there's still only one buyer for any car.

[Ed Luddy]

As someone who was in the 4 speed no A/C club as a kid I'm finally over that. Gotta have Air and automatic.

Last year is 1st pic. This year 2nd pic. LOL

[alsancle]

24 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

 

A/C is a nice bonus but since it's so rare for an old car's A/C system to be operational (I'd say less than 10% of them actually work) that its appeal becomes more in terms of scarcity than value. It makes the car more attractive but I'm not sure there's much of a premium for it unless it's 100% operational. I wish I had a dollar for every time I asked a seller if the A/C worked and he said, "You know, I never tried it." Yeah, sure. That means it's broken. They're ALL broken. I try to price the cars as if they don't have A/C and let the next guy figure it out (which he won't).

 

 

You forgot the most common phrase of them all:  "AC just needs a recharge".

[alsancle]

22 minutes ago, Ed Luddy said:

As someone who was in the 4 speed no A/C club as a kid I'm finally over that. Gotta have Air and automatic.

Last year is 1st pic. This year 2nd pic. LOL

For now my knees still work so I'm sticking with the four speed, but I get it.

[Ed Luddy]

10 hours ago, alsancle said:

For now my knees still work so I'm sticking with the four speed, but I get it.

Yep. The knees do dictate the choice.  The increase in traffic doesn't help either! 

[Ed Luddy]

Last year I had 3 manual stick shift's none with A/C. I've done my time in the August heat/heavy traffic. Too old to Not enjoy cars. Only one for this year. 1972 TR6. 4 speed no overdrive and no A/C. Not going to see much wheel time after May until late September.

[Gearheadengineer]

One benefit of riding a bicycle 3,000+ miles per year: I fear no clutch. 😀

 

That said, I much prefer the hydraulic setup I put in my Galaxie recently.

 

A/C is nice but thankfully where I live I get by without it in my fun cars. I mostly drive mornings and evenings so that helps.
 

The posted car is pretty cool. Less common than the earlier ones and that is a unique drivetrain for that time. 

 

 

[rocketraider]

One of my longtime friends had a 400/automatic one when we were young guys. I think that car had a Slap-Stik shifter.

 

His 18 year old grandson is getting into the old car (and other stuff, the boy loves anything old) trap. I showed Richard this car and all he said was "Lawd. Don't show Ank."

 

Amazingly for a boy named after Anakin Skywalker he has no interest in Star Wars stuff. But old cars, old cameras, old stereo equipment and vinyl LPs? He's all over that.

[Matt Harwood]

Ostensibly sold for $6800.

 

But wait! There's more!

 

Apparently the seller is refusing to cut it loose at that price. He obviously expected more. I doubt we'll ever hear how it is resolved, but as predicted, the seller's lack of participation in the discussion combined with the crappy photos and the car's lackluster condition seem to have given us a predictably low sale figure.

 

This one left a bad taste in everyone's mouth.

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, Matt Harwood said:

Ostensibly sold for $6800.

 

But wait! There's more!

 

Apparently the seller is refusing to cut it loose at that price. He obviously expected more. I doubt we'll ever hear how it is resolved, but as predicted, the seller's lack of participation in the discussion combined with the crappy photos and the car's lackluster condition seem to have given us a predictably low sale figure.

 

This one left a bad taste in everyone's mouth.

Matt, you are a bringer trailer veteran so you can probably comment. But I believe there’s no actual contract to sell the car at the end of the auction. So theoretically, I can put something up no reserve, and then back out as a seller. As a buyer, I can back out also.  It would be interesting to know the transaction failure rate on allegedly “successful“ auctions.

 

Either party trying that with one of the land-based auction houses is going to run into a world of hurt.

[Matt Harwood]

BaT is technically just advertising, not a real auction. Nothing is truly binding. Yes, when you list a car there you acknowledge that you'll honor the high bid and if you're a buyer, you pinkie swear that you'll pay if you're the high bidder, but I doubt any of it has any teeth beyond BaT being able to take their 5% from your credit card. Deals that fall through, depending on the party responsible, either result in being banned from BaT (seller) or being banned and your 5% buyer's premium is not refunded (if you're the buyer). It's not really a major punishment, but as far as I know, that's all BaT can do. The seller in the case of this Dodge looks like a first-timer with no history, so being banned isn't going to hurt him. BaT will refund the 5% buyer's premium to the buyer who got stiffed and that'll be the end of it. I'll wager that Dodge will show up on the market with a price tag somewhat greater than the final $6800 bid.

 

I occasionally get E-mails that a car I was watching has been re-listed because the buyer refused to complete the transaction. BaT will re-list the car at no charge and does a decent job of pointing out that the prior buyer backed out, they kept his money and banned him, and it wasn't any fault of the car or the seller. Sometimes that works, sometimes it doesn't. My experience says that once a car is marked sold and then quickly comes back on the market, potential bidders assume that the first buyer saw it and ran away, so bidding may be depressed.

 

In this case, there's no real penalty for ignoring the result of a BaT auction and there may be some upside if he can find someone else willing to pay more for the Dodge. The buyer, well, he simply doesn't get a car he might have wanted, which happens all the time in the real world.

 

Another case of a seller expecting his audience to be stupid and being reminded that they aren't.

[Gearheadengineer]

I think the seller will eventually realize he should have taken the $6,800. Certainly more than I would pay for this project. It’s cool but there are so many other cooler options out there. 

[alsancle]

54 minutes ago, Gearheadengineer said:

I think the seller will eventually realize he should have taken the $6,800. Certainly more than I would pay for this project. It’s cool but there are so many other cooler options out there. 

I think because of the configuration it’s worth more than you would think it would be. Although project cars are getting harder and harder to sell all the time.

[1912Staver]

With most of the BAT auctions I follow it seems the seller did very well. But not always I guess.