Just wondering?

[George K]

I ran across this photo somewhere. Don’t know what or where. Thanks 

 

[wayne sheldon]

Interesting photo. Appears to be before or after a parade, small town maybe?  The cars in the background look to be 1940s, however the horse lady's attire and hair style appears to be nearer to1960. Everyone else could be almost anything post war. 

The main car is interesting, and unusual. Cord influence is obvious, but is there more than just influence? I am curious to see if it gets fully identified.

[58L-Y8]

It's a Bohman & Schwartz custom initially on a 1937 Buick Century for the Topper movies.  Later the body was transferred to a newer Chrysler chassis, modified further and used by Mobil Oil Company to promote its products.  Note the Flying Horse on the door.

[George K]

26 minutes ago, 58L-Y8 said:

It's a Bohman & Schwartz custom initially on a 1937 Buick Century for the Topper movies.  Later the body was transferred to a newer Chrysler chassis, modified further and used by Mobil Oil Company to promote its products.  Note the Flying Horse on the door.

Thanks I figured custom but thought the Topper car had a tail thing protruding. I bought a great car from a man in Minnesota in 1990. While finishing the deal we sat at a bar in his home. On the wall was a photo of what looked like the Topper car. I inquired and he explained that a Chevrolet dealer in Minneapolis liked the Topper so much he commissioned Bowman & Schwartz to build a copy to fit a 1937 Chevy. It was built but never fitted to a chassis. He found it still in the Chevy garage bought it and put it on a chassis and drove it for some time. He told me that the last time he saw it the car was owned by a kid in Bloomington Mn and laying out in a backyard.

Never chased it but often wonder if it survives. 

[George K]

Now as I look closer it appears the tail appendage is camouflaged by by horse. Remember that this photo was is a California archive.

[1937hd45]

Everything you need to know is here . 

 

Bob 

http://justacarguy.blogspot.com/2017/12/taking-part-in-mobil-economy-run-is.html

[George K]

6 hours ago, 1937hd45 said:

Everything you need to know is here . 

 

Bob 

http://justacarguy.blogspot.com/2017/12/taking-part-in-mobil-economy-run-is.html

Ouch! 

[58L-Y8]

The front restyle is equally unattractive:

[alsancle]

B&S was a like a stopped clock.  Right a couple of times a day.

[58L-Y8]

2 hours ago, alsancle said:

B&S was a like a stopped clock.  Right a couple of times a day.

B & S was an unfortunate combination of the ability and skills to build custom coachwork without the ability to consistently create finely proportioned and detailed elegant designs to build.

[1937hd45]

5 hours ago, 58L-Y8 said:

B & S was an unfortunate combination of the ability and skills to build custom coachwork without the ability to consistently create finely proportioned and detailed elegant designs to build.

I always wonder what it was like in a custom body shop back in those days. What did they have for tools to turn 4x8 sheets into fenders and body panels? 

[Gary_Ash]

40 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said:

I always wonder what it was like in a custom body shop back in those days. What did they have for tools to turn 4x8 sheets into fenders and body panels? 

Some tin snips, mallets, a stump with a dished surface, sand bags, hammers and dollies, an English wheel, and a gas welder will let you make anything you need.  A jump shear and slip roll would also be in the shop.  Here is an old photo of an English car body shop.  See all the "wheeling machines" and body bucks.  These might be Bristol 401's, circa 1947-50ish.

 

Here's the story of Bohman &Schwartz from the coachbuilt.com website:  http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/b/bohman_schwartz/bohman_schwartz.htm

B&S apparently had a power hammer, as well as the other tools.

 

 

[George K]

I’ve always been fascinated by coach building. Owned all types of forming machinery. Always liked this installation of a power hammer at the Crow Elkhart factory.

[Gary_Ash]

1 hour ago, George K said:

I’ve always been fascinated by coach building. Owned all types of forming machinery. Always liked this installation of a power hammer at the Crow Elkhart factory.

You can always go to Wray Schelin's classes at his Pro Shaper shop in Charlton, MA and learn how to do it yourself.  Wray builds a lot of big tools himself.  See his videos on the power hammer and helve hammer in his shop:  https://www.proshaper.com/metal-shaping-videos/  The power hammers are in the Shop Projects section.  It doesn't take long to put the basic shape in the metal with a power hammer, but it may take many hours of wheeling to fine tune and smooth the metal.  The two guys in the photo above aren't wearing ear protection, but you would want to!  

 

 

[Guest]

George, 

                       Your picture appears to show the car after the Mobil oil purchase and repaint but previous to the body restyle.

 

 

Of all it's incarnations, I believe the original was the best.

[Gary_Ash]

Criticism of Bohman  & Schwartz notwithstanding, they did produce the Phantom Corsair in 1938, way ahead of its time.  Rust Heinz helped to design it, wanted to put it into production, but he died in a car accident. See Wikipedia.  Maybe Alsancle might agree that this was one where the clock was stopped at the right time for B&S.

 

The Phantom Corsair by Bohman & Schwartz, 1938.  Photo by Alden Jewell.

[George K]

I have owned and used almost every piece of vintage metal forming machinery. First hammer I bought was ex GM experimental dept. Double headed Yoder. Still have my wheeling machine. A real English wheel from the Austin motor car company. 40 years have gone by since. Thinking about selling the wheel as doubt I need it anymore.

The reason I like the hammer post is if you study it you’ll see a proper hammer install. It can’t deflect or float in any direction. 

[alsancle]

36 minutes ago, Gary_Ash said:

Criticism of Bohman  & Schwartz notwithstanding, they did produce the Phantom Corsair in 1938, way ahead of its time.  Rust Heinz helped to design it, wanted to put it into production, but he died in a car accident. See Wikipedia.  Maybe Alsancle might agree that this was one where the clock was stopped at the right time for B&S.

 

The Phantom Corsair by Bohman & Schwartz, 1938.  Photo by Alden Jewell.

 

You can almost do the list off the top of your head.   The Bo Jangles Model J,  the Phantom Corsair,  the Maybeline Packard Victoria,  and a few others.

[edinmass]

The Flying Wombat is a national embarrassment, and should have been put in the crusher years ago. B&S fxxxxd up ten times more cars than they improved. Anyone who would admit to designing or building the Wombat has no soul.

 

PS- yes, I have had my hands on the Wombat…….only for a few minutes, so I know what I am talking about. It also smokes more than a WWII destroyer laying a smoke screen at the Battle of Leyte Gulf.

Edited December 20, 2021 by edinmass (see edit history)

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, edinmass said:

The Flying Wombat is a national embarrassment, and should have been put in the crusher years ago. B&S fxxxxd up ten times more cars than they improved. Anyone who would admit to designing or building the Wombat has no soul.

 

PS- yes, I have had my hands on the Wombat…….only for a few minutes, so I know what I am talking about. It also smokes more than a WWII destroyer laying a smoke screen at the Battle of Leyte Gulf.

 

What took you so long?

[edinmass]

7 minutes ago, alsancle said:

 

What took you so long?

Busy…..

[8E45E]

13 hours ago, George K said:

I have owned and used almost every piece of vintage metal forming machinery. First hammer I bought was ex GM experimental dept. Double headed Yoder. Still have my wheeling machine. A real English wheel from the Austin motor car company. 40 years have gone by since. Thinking about selling the wheel as doubt I need it anymore.

The reason I like the hammer post is if you study it you’ll see a proper hammer install. It can’t deflect or float in any direction. 

I bet you never had one of these! https://www.lbsbind.com/documents/cms/docs/FabricOctane.pdf

 

Craig

[George K]

44 minutes ago, 8E45E said:

I bet you never had one of these! https://www.lbsbind.com/documents/cms/docs/FabricOctane.pdf

 

Craig

I said metal forming. Never wanted to be a tent maker. Fabric body cars are are an anomaly. Rate right up with wicker.

[58L-Y8]

14 hours ago, alsancle said:

 

You can almost do the list off the top of your head.   The Bo Jangles Model J,  the Phantom Corsair,  the Maybeline Packard Victoria,  and a few others.

Of course, on the flip side B & S created the most egregious visual assault on the elegant Classic Era aesthetic...Father Divine's Duesenberg J Bus!

[George K]

I hope that isn’t where the term “Divine intervention” came from.

[edinmass]

When you build a car for God, divine intervention comes in the play somewhere! 😝

[1937hd45]

Walt, Sorry to sidetrack things but is there coachbuilding term for the dropped rear windows on the above Lincoln and Delage? This Packard could be added to the group. Bob 

[edinmass]

 

Yes, the exact nomenclature for that window is......... not particularly attractive rear side window. 

 

Thus ends today's lesson! 😂

[wayne sheldon]

11 hours ago, edinmass said:

 

Yes, the exact nomenclature for that window is......... not particularly attractive rear side window. 

 

Thus ends today's lesson! 😂

 

I need some good laughs about now. That helped. Thank you.

[edinmass]

It’s a Mayfair Packard owned by a friend........it’s actually a very nice car, and very well,restored. Most post W O Bentley era English coachwork does nothing for me..........

[8E45E]

18 hours ago, edinmass said:

When you build a car for God, divine intervention comes in the play somewhere! 😝

There were structural problems (frame cracks, etc.) with the car, as I recall reading about it!

 

Craig

[1937hd45]

5 hours ago, edinmass said:

It’s a Mayfair Packard owned by a friend........it’s actually a very nice car, and very well,restored. Most post W O Bentley era English coachwork does nothing for me..........

I really like the upholstery in that former coop, wish there were as found photos. 

 

Bob 

[58L-Y8]

18 hours ago, 1937hd45 said:

Walt, Sorry to sidetrack things but is there coachbuilding term for the dropped rear windows on the above Lincoln and Delage? This Packard could be added to the group. Bob 

The awkward quarter window shape on this Mayfair 4 passenger coupe is the result of basing the design on the typical English sedanca drop-head coupe, its belt-molding descending to create a well for the folded top.   The broad closed quarters and functional landau irons look natural to that design configuration, not so much as a closed coupe.