Smartin Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Just bought the car...symptoms are as follows... When I first started the car, there was no noise, but the car was sold to me as "transmission is out." He said it felt like it was stuck between gears. I was hoping it would be a linkage issue or something. So I started it, ran great. Upon putting it in any gear, it sounded like it was grinding a gear and not engaging fully. Car never moved, but the speedometer was spinning. I put it back into park, but the noise did not go away, nor did it re-engage back into park. I pulled the linkage off the trans to make sure it was fully in Park, then reconnected and there was no adjustment made to reconnect...so I know the linkage is not boogered up. I also removed the inspection cover to make sure convertor teeth or bolts weren't loose or beating on the bellhousing or something. Aside from removing the transmission and taking it to me trans guy, is there something else I should look for before blowing this thing apart? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpecialEducation Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Sounds like the splines in your torque ball are blown out. The torque ball can be replaced without removing the transmission or rear axle. Not easy or fun, but possible. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 43 minutes ago, SpecialEducation said: Sounds like the splines in your torque ball are blown out. The torque ball can be replaced without removing the transmission or rear axle. Not easy or fun, but possible. Or the U-joint in the torque ball. If the speedometer works then rotation is at least as far as the speedo gear. If you put back into park with it running there is nothing to stop rotation and it will grind the same as putting in Park with the car moving. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpecialEducation Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 hour ago, old-tank said: If the speedometer works then rotation is at least as far as the speedo gear. Yep, speedo (not Mr. Earl) working is a good sign (kinda). I doubt you need a new transmission. Either way, it sounds like an issue at the torque ball, so that’s where I’d open up first. Hopefully it’s in the ball and not the tailshaft or drive shaft. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 18, 2019 Author Share Posted January 18, 2019 Thanks for the suggestions and thoughts, guys. I think I needed some other insight on this.. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 The question is, what caused the splines in the torque ball to get wiped out? Either way, the torque tube needs to come out for torque ball inspection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancemb Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 20 hours ago, SpecialEducation said: The torque ball can be replaced without removing the transmission or rear axle. Not easy or fun, but possible. The only way I know this to be feasible is using a come-along to pull the rear axle back, which would make me nervous. Do you have another method? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpecialEducation Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 5 minutes ago, lancemb said: The only way I know this to be feasible is using a come-along to pull the rear axle back, which would make me nervous. Do you have another method? Like I said, not fun or easy... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 19, 2019 Author Share Posted January 19, 2019 Before the bitter cold sets in today, I jacked up the rear end off the ground and had my wife spin the tires by hand. It definitely sounds like it's coming from the rear u-joint section, or even the pumpkin. Not 100% sure yet. I guess I can keep my fingers crossed that it's not the transmission at this point, until I can figure out what the lovely noise is at the rear u-joint. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 19, 2019 Author Share Posted January 19, 2019 I'll close out this thread by answering the question of "what was it?" It's the female splined part of the driveshaft that slides over the splines on the rear end. Teeth are almost gone. 😒 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 On 1/18/2019 at 2:18 PM, lancemb said: The only way I know this to be feasible is using a come-along to pull the rear axle back, which would make me nervous. Do you have another method? No come along is needed. The method that works for me is jacking the axle up to be level with the tail of the transmission. There can be no binding at the torque tube and torque ball flange. I have removed and re-installed 2 torque tubes with nothing but a floor jack. Did both without assistance. The chassis manual is quite clear on the procedure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 On 1/19/2019 at 6:07 PM, Smartin said: I'll close out this thread by answering the question of "what was it?" It's the female splined part of the driveshaft that slides over the splines on the rear end. Teeth are almost gone. 😒 You have the rear end out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 Yep, the whole she-bang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 30 minutes ago, Smartin said: Yep, the whole she-bang. Great! Did not take much effort? Mine did not. More work but not a nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpecialEducation Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 On 1/19/2019 at 5:07 PM, Smartin said: I'll close out this thread by answering the question of "what was it?" It's the female splined part of the driveshaft that slides over the splines on the rear end. Teeth are almost gone. 😒 Aw, crap. That sounds expensive. Maybe you can get parts from someone converting to an open drive line. Even if someone is giving away a whole torque tube/rearend assembly for free, shipping is prohibitive. Hope you can find something within driving distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) I would believe that finding a replacement rear axle would be the least amount of work and cost. Open driveline is a major undertaking compared to finding a replacement axle assembly. Someone may have a pinion carrier instead of an entire rears assembly. Edited January 21, 2019 by avgwarhawk (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 I have a complete roadmaster parts car sitting in my yard 😁 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 45 minutes ago, Smartin said: I have a complete roadmaster parts car sitting in my yard 😁 Well, that is a color of a different horse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancemb Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 My secret plan to convert Adam to a 57 RM 75 guy is working! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 I may or may not have been swayed by the powers of the 57 lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, SpecialEducation said: Aw, crap. That sounds expensive. Maybe you can get parts from someone converting to an open drive line. Even if someone is giving away a whole torque tube/rearend assembly for free, shipping is prohibitive. All he needs is the rearmost section of the driveshaft, no? I dunno about availability, but shipping could probably be handled with a USPS Flat Rate box. Are there issues with balancing that require the driveshaft to be replaced as an assembly? Edited January 21, 2019 by KongaMan (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 Doubtful, but I will probably rob the entire driveshaft from the parts car so I don't have to replace the u-joint....assuming the u-joint in the parts car isn't trashed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, Smartin said: Doubtful, but I will probably rob the entire driveshaft from the parts car so I don't have to replace the u-joint....assuming the u-joint in the parts car isn't trashed. Remove the tube and check. Or, replace the u-joint. Just did it on my 60. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpecialEducation Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, KongaMan said: All he needs is the rearmost section of the driveshaft, no? The manual says the prop shaft is 2 pieces, and they can be separated, but I have no idea how big they are, I've never had the shaft out of the tube. There is no rear u-joint, that's the point of the torque tube. Adam: Is the car you are trying to fix also a Roadmaster? https://www.hometownbuick.com/1957-buick-rear-axle-service-procedures/ Edited January 21, 2019 by SpecialEducation (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 11 minutes ago, KongaMan said: All he needs is the rearmost section of the driveshaft, no? I dunno about availability, but shipping could probably be handled with a USPS Flat Rate box. Are there issues with balancing that require the driveshaft to be replaced as an assembly? The driveshaft is balance by itself. Should not require any balancing or affect anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 Yes...driveshaft will come out of tube. If u-joint in in good shape I will run it. And yes, they are two pieces with a rear joint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, Smartin said: Yes...driveshaft will come out of tube. If u-joint in in good shape I will run it. And yes, they are two pieces with a rear joint. It appears to be flexing at the joint. That's good. Can't be tight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 FWIW, Rock Auto says they sell new u-joints for this application. Should be easy enough to replace if you're at all concerned about the condition. It's certainly a lot easier to do it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, KongaMan said: FWIW, Rock Auto says they sell new u-joints for this application. Should be easy enough to replace if you're at all concerned about the condition. It's certainly a lot easier to do it now. Sound advise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 I am working on an order now. I'll go ahead and get one to be safe. I also did some cleaning on the long portion of the torque tube this evening, finding some cool factory markings and a very distinct lack of black paint. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dei Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 Any thoughts on how that tube stripped the threads? It does not seem high mileage wear for a part like that would be that bad... How are the splines on the differential looking? Inquiring mind wants to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 22, 2019 Author Share Posted January 22, 2019 The differential looks pretty good. I suppose it was a lack of lubrication from the get-go that killed this one. It looks like there was never an ounce of grease on the splines...ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancemb Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 32 minutes ago, dei said: Any thoughts on how that tube stripped the threads? It does not seem high mileage wear for a part like that would be that bad... How are the splines on the differential looking? Inquiring mind wants to know. I believe there is a good chance this was a factory defect and the splines were not properly heat treated (hardened) when new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dei Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 Thanks Adam. I don't think I have heard anyone else have an issue like this before so wondered if it might be something I should have to watch for. Looks like I should keep that part from my Limited parts car... just in case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 39 minutes ago, Smartin said: The differential looks pretty good. I suppose it was a lack of lubrication from the get-go that killed this one. It looks like there was never an ounce of grease on the splines...ever. I would concur. This is a slip joint. No grease would allow metal to be worn down to nothing. Note the most rearward splines are in good shape as they never were touched by the propeller shaft. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 28, 2019 Author Share Posted January 28, 2019 I got the car back together this evening. All gears work really smoothly as I run through the shifter. I'm short on fluid, but it is working for now. I'll grab some on the way home tomorrow. Only issue now is I have no PARK. Is the parking pawl accessible without removing the transmission? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 4 hours ago, Smartin said: I got the car back together this evening. All gears work really smoothly as I run through the shifter. I'm short on fluid, but it is working for now. I'll grab some on the way home tomorrow. Grab a bunch. If someone earlier in the ownership chain thought there was a problem with the transmission, no telling what they might have dumped in there to fix it. I'd drain it and refill just to be safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fr. Buick Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 No park? Replace your motor and trans mounts/thrust pad, and if that does not resolve the issue, adjust linkage as needed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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