JayG Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 I'm doing a full frame up restoration of my 25 Roadster. The chassis is done and the tranny is ready. The motor will be tackled next. My question is can I install the tranny and rear motor support now and install the motor later? Am I going to have issues getting the motor in or will I have to remove the tranny again to get it in? The Mechanic's Instruction Manual talks about removing the tranny to remove the engine. Does that also apply to the installation? I just don't want to make additional work. I also don't have any body/fender parts to work around. Like to hear from someone that may have done it before. Thanks in advance. Jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylormade Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Is the body currently off the frame? I would make a cradle for the motor and attach the flywheel, clutch, bell-housing, throwout bearing and transmission off the car, then lift the entire assembly into the frame as one unit. I'm not an expert on the 25 model, so there may be a fly in the ointment with my method on your car. If anything, install the motor first, then the transmission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billstewart Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 When I did the 25 I used to have I put the motor and tran together and put it in that way. It was just the bare fame when I done it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayG Posted July 18, 2015 Author Share Posted July 18, 2015 I took it out as 1 unit. but with everything nice and new I was hoping not to beat it up too much. Getting the rear engine support in to the frame rails as 1 unit concerns me. The fly in the ointment is that you can't just lower the unit down onto some mounts. The big circular rear support needs to fit inside the channels of the frame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWPerry Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 The last time I pulled the engine in my 1925 Coupe I followed the procedure in the manual I had which was to disconnect the drive shaft, unbolt the transmission and then remove the engine leaving the support in place. Reinstallation was then done in reverse order. It was not that bad and went fairly smoothly. It does take two people to get things lined up again when you are reinstalling the transmission to the engine until you get a couple bolts in. You do have to be able to support both the engine and transmission while doing this. Getting the drive shaft back in can be a little bit of a hassle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayG Posted July 19, 2015 Author Share Posted July 19, 2015 Doesn't the bell housing mate to the engine? This is the way mine was. The bell housing slips though the support from the from so that the surface of the engine and bell housing are connected. This means in order to remove the transmission the rear support must also be removed with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Scafani Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 The original method of removing and replacing the engine required 40 hours according to the flat rate manual. The body was removed to facilitate the removal of the engine and transmission. The only way to get the engine in and out with the body on is through the bottom of the frame and the transmission has to be out before. I usually relocate the transmission mounting yoke to the front of the bell housing and hang the engine in the frame and then mount the transmission. That is if the engine and trans are separate and with the body off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24 Roadster Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 I know most will not agree with this but my dad bought our 24 Roadster in 1936 out of a junk yard. He was a good mechanic. WW2 airplane mechanic. He had the engine in and out over a dozen times over the years. The way he showed me was to tilt the engine with the front higher and line flywheel up with clutch plates.and then lower the front of the engine into place. I have had the engine out 4 or 5 times in the last 15 years using this method. Never have I unbolted the transmission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.White Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 I know most will not agree with this but my dad bought our 24 Roadster in 1936 out of a junk yard. He was a good mechanic. WW2 airplane mechanic. He had the engine in and out over a dozen times over the years. The way he showed me was to tilt the engine with the front higher and line flywheel up with clutch plates.and then lower the front of the engine into place. I have had the engine out 4 or 5 times in the last 15 years using this method. Never have I unbolted the transmission.Your experience seems to contradict the advice given in the 'mechanics instruction manual' that warns of damage to the clutch mechanism if the engine is removed without first removing the transmission. If the engine can be removed and installed safely by your method then I should think it would be easier. If the clutch mechanism gets ruined we know who to point the finger at. Ray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24 Roadster Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 Point your finger all you want. All I am saying is my dad did it this way many times, and I have done it this way 4-5 times. Never damaging the clutch. I agree it your are not careful in lining up the clutch with the flywheel you could damage the clutch. Proceed at your own risk. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cahartley Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 I just looked at my '25 Sedan, which I bought from Bill Stewart, and it SEEMS with the radiator and front cross member removed there should be ample room to move the engine forward.The bell housing is not mounted between the frame rails.It is bolted to two brackets which are bolted to the frame so no problem there.Perhaps Roadsters are different?....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayG Posted July 22, 2015 Author Share Posted July 22, 2015 It sounds like your 25 has been modified to use the later single plate clutch. The rear engine support on those does drop in to rest on supports. That didn't show up until 27. Also the front support is not removable as it is riveted in place. What is the shift pattern on yours? Reverse up or down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.White Posted July 22, 2015 Share Posted July 22, 2015 I have not tried this myself but I can see what '24 Roadster was getting at when he said tilt the engine up at the front. Once the radiator and front mounting has been removed, if the engine can be persuaded to tilt up at the front, the cross member can be avoided. Ray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cahartley Posted July 23, 2015 Share Posted July 23, 2015 It sounds like your 25 has been modified to use the later single plate clutch. The rear engine support on those does drop in to rest on supports. That didn't show up until 27. Also the front support is not removable as it is riveted in place. What is the shift pattern on yours? Reverse up or down?Backward like all the earlier Dodges....... LOL ........reverse down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwollam Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 1924 had a different rear mount than 1923 or 1925. The 24's had part of the mount riveted to the frame and then the engine/tranny hoop had 2 bolts on each side that went through horizontal. Many of those, in fact all of the ones I have seen, crack the hoop near where they bolt to the frame mount, which I assume is why they went back to the old style slipped into the frame and a bolt down through it for 1925. Then finally in 1927 they went back to a "set down in" mount with bolts through the sides with a cast iron bell housing/mount combo. 3 different engines and setups in 27, ending with the 124 "fast four" engine. The 1924 was easier to set the engine and tranny units in together, as was the later 27's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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