Guest 54fins Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Elma Turl is a white 1954 Special, 4 door sedan. What is interesting is she never had a repaint. Dry Colorado car, the dessert sand sorta sandblasted her- which is nice, it didn't strip the chrome. In fact, the chrome is extremely nice- no pits. The windows are not delaminated, but the interior was a mousekateers dream. Pretty much shot, they love nesting in buick seats.pan was perfect, other than someone had cut in a tranny access panel. There is a little surface rust at the feet, but nothing significant. Gosh, I know alot of Buicks that could use this pan! But, Elma Turl needs to remain whole and find someone that can appreciate a sedan. The sand looks like iron oxide, the engine was scary but cleaned up easy. Perfect windshield- I happen to know another buick that could use it. But, best to leave things alone, it could be chipped trying to remove it. Did have a badly dented drivers's door. The irony- I just happen to have a driver's door from a 54 sedan, that has sat around for years. Yup- it's perfect, even has the trim on it. So much for the body.Well, elma turl gets a single stage white to match the original paint. She has a black interior and a green top. The white wth a black and white interior is very plain and simple, but surprisingly effective. Anybody wants a very fine 54 sedan, let me know. I would rather not do the interior, so if you want a very fine sedan and would like to do an interior, drop me a line. Engine runs like new and the tranny doesn't seem to leak. This car is rust and bondo free, pretty rare find. Too bad it's a four door! reminds me of the song-Elma Turl is a beautiful girl but son, She's my daughter... - Mike Cross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Fast Work 54. Tell us how did you get all the rust off of the engine and surrounding areas so fast? Looks good though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 wasn't rust- it was fine sand that looked like rust! washed right off, took 2 hours. The pan was knee deep in rat turds- washed right out and most was even shiny. If they hadn't eaten away at the seats, this car would be done. The out side was never repainted, the rust lookin stuff is red oxide primer. Damndest thing I ever saw, never had a car clean up this easy. Undercarraige just needs a dustin. The Chrome looks new and even the windows look new. Gaskets- not so good. I figured it was a good donor car, but it's just too clean to part out. Rear bumper was bent, too bad- the chrome was perfect. Only issue is the ignition was locked, door keys don't work. Guess I'll need to drill it out- any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Oh, Scratch Elma Turl. Car is named "Mr Earl" in honor of the Buick gardens! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 I see you have a 57. the 57 was not quite as good, but still good. It had been repainted once and did have a rust area in the back quarter. Probably rain dripping past the rear window gasket, but pretty minor. The rest is solid, cheapy teal paint job over the original white. Also didn't start right up so I'm going to go over it a little closer. Still pretty neat, these junkyard finds are rarely any good, even as donors. the chrome is pitted and the body rusted out. Just cause they are western cars doesn't mean they never drove on salt, you usually find the car lived in Chicago part of it's life. These were colorado- New mexico cars, also they were not convertibles which always loose the top and the carpet stays wet. Being 4 doors, they were not molested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 (edited) No..... don't drill anything. On the Buicks of this vintage, one key fits everything. Just do what I did. Take the driver's side door panel off and take out the lock. If it is part of the handle then just take out the handle, remove the tumbler and bring it to a lock smith. They will make a master key off of the numbering system on the lock tumbler itself. No drill. No dynamite. When you get back to the car check to see if it fits the ignition, glove box and trunk as it should, that is if no one has messed with these locks. Then reinstall door handle and lock and your good to go.Edit: Opps.... I now see that the door keys don't work the ignition lock. There is a procedure for removing the lock but you need to have it in the Off position I believe. I would try removing the entire lock from behind the dash and see if that works. You can always get a blank key and do the old insert, twist, remove, inspect, mark, file, insert, twist, mark, file etc..... procedure and make your own key. Have done that many times myself. Just need patience. Damn it. it took me 3 weeks just to paint tint match my original engine paint color as the original engine paint was too good to paint over. Just had to touch up with an air brush. Kinda wish I could of though, it would of made things a whole lot easier like this one. I would have been done with the engine compartment in 4 days. Edited September 19, 2012 by buick man (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 I pulled the locks and had a key made from the code. The ignition is locked, and the key won't work. The other ones all work. Can't stick a pin and pull the core, because it's locked. Very irritating, perhaps that sand got in there and jammed the lock. I'm wigglin and jigglin and nuttinn workin. I'm about to pull the drill, but I'm open to suggestions! Doesn't seem likely the ignition would have been re-keyedJust by luck, I have a rusted out 4 door donor car. the driver door is perfect, so that takes care of the bodywork. Looks like the donor ended up having most everything i needed, like the taillight lenses, some knobs and even a new headliner.The car gets primed and then a single stage artic white, just like new. Hate to remove the original paint, if the interior was better I might have left it all original, but the laquer was all sandblasted. shootin today. So far, fluids, master cylinder and paint. It's looking like the interior will be the only $ item. One dent in the back, that was it, other than a new door. Easiest resto ever, not even 40 hours total and that might even include upholstery. undercarriage will clean up easy. Tranny isn't leaking, I suspect that someone cut the hatch in the tunnel to service it. A shame, given the pan is perfect otherwise but there is always something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1953mack Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 (edited) . . . . . I pulled the locks and had a key made from the code. The ignition is locked, and the key won't work. The other ones all work. Can't stick a pin and pull the core, because it's locked. Very irritating, perhaps that sand got in there and jammed the lock. I'm wigglin and jigglin and nuttinn workin. I'm about to pull the drill, but I'm open to suggestions! Doesn't seem likely the ignition would have been re-keyed . . . . . Do what they did in the 1950's when your car was new and even nowadays. Get a good mobile lock & key guy out to where the car is located. It's not as difficult as the newer ignition key lock-in-steering columns are to pick. Cheape$t and fastest way to get 'er done. Al MalachowskiBCA #8965"500 Miles West of Flint" Edited September 19, 2012 by 1953mack (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 yup. Called AAA but the lock guy was dumber than a brick. He keyed the doors but couldn't do the ignition. I'll try someone else, this can't be that hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Check the service manual at the end of the ignition system (10-46 in the 55 manual) if there is not a procedure for removing a cylinder that cannot be unlocked with key, let me know and I will scan it.Willie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I don't want to pull the dash, so if you have a procedure that might save the day!If earl were to be judged, can you use a vynal headliner? The original one is cloth. you touch it and it turns to powder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 54 ... Are you stripping the lacquer paint and primer off to metal first? Or are you blocking down the original lacquers to a solid scuffed base leaving much behind, then final pre prep clean wiping surfaces then spraying a 2K urethane primer over everything? Just curious. If so, would suggest you do a complete seal coat first before applying the 2K urethane primer to prevent bleed through and lifting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 (edited) I have seen some with this drilled hole...The lock cylinder has to come out before the switch can be removed.Willie Edited September 20, 2012 by old-tank (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Ah, old tank to the rescue! Never had this before, they are ussually in the off position. If you get jammed in the locked position, it is a bigger problem than you might think!!As for paint, much to my dismay we sanded it down to the metal. It all buzzed off easy. Going urethane. Disapointing, I have had a desire to recondition and original paint job and do a "real" original car- paint and everything. This was almost it- but no dice. 1 very thin coat of red oxide primer, 1 coat of laquer. Piece of cake to prep and no "surprises"- like bondo caves. Not a drop. Now the donor door was a different issue. No bondo, but 10 coats of paint to strip. The door was more work than the whole car. Now the donor car has a nice vynal headliner, but original is cloth. For judging, would vynal pass? I'll have to dig up my judging guide but figured you might know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 well, sad to say it is no longer original. Once the original paint is gone, it's just another hot rodbut it is nice to see raw metal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1957buickjim Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 54Fins,If the car came with an original cloth headliner, then for judging, you would have to have a cloth headliner or otherwise you would lose points for non-original headliner. Not sure if it is an mandatory deduction, though. The BCA Judging handbook would show you what are and aren't mandatory deductions. The car is looking good, that is for sure. The engine compartment after cleanup is phenomonal! If they were all that easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 Being a convrtible guy, I never messed with a headliner. I can't figure out how they get them in there, much less remove it. The 57 is pretty nice too, I'll start a thread on that but I have a new rule, one car at a time and I'm not going to backslide. That dessert sand was weird. It's like it just stuck to all the surfaces and looked like it was all stuck to oil, and it was covered in mouse terds. When it just hosed off, if anything it was like a protective layer. Most cars its a layer of goo that takes a month to clean off, one inch at a time. Wish the seats were that easy, mice love this cotton stuff they put on the foam, and they nest in the seats. My 16 year old had a look of terror, but he wrecked his car so he didn't have much of a choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 (edited) 54... you can still get acrylic lacquer. It is easy to spray, very forgiving and has more resulting depth than urethane. Urethane although a nice choice, forms it's own clear coat like outer surface upon completing it's cross-link bonded curing process therefore resulting in it's noted urethane gloss. The resin rises above the heavier tint molecules. Although a single stage paint, it is very similar to any 2 stage paint system ( base coat/clear coat ) as you will not have the depth of color due to the resin coat on the surface which absorbs the light rather than deflecting it like a true acrylic lacquer paint would which has it's solids & pigmentation all the way to the surface which results in a fuller and deeper hue. Cannot be replicated. But you are right. Base coat/ Clear coat systems belong on Saabs, Fiberglass Credit Card Hotrods and the like.... As far as the head liner goes, it is easy to get the cloth. SMS for example out of Oregon. The original engine nailhead paint is a blue based hue paint. Note the uncleaned valve cover cap in the before photo. IMO: I think what happened is someone somewhere along the line copied the color off of an "acceptable" original engine. But did not take into account that lacquer residues from the fuels of days gone by, yellow as they become putrid and age. Yellowing lacquer over a blueish tinted original paint will make the resulting hue green. Yellow and blue makes green. Then somewhere along the line it became this lime like green and they put it in cans and tell everyone to use it as it is original. To justify their misinterpretation, they bolster the hype by telling you that different assembly plants used different tinted paints from different paint suppliers from around the country. Another myth. I'm not trying to bust anyones chops here but just for what it's worth, note the photo below of a documented all original engine bay that had only water and orange blaster applied to it, rinsed and then shop air dried. Note the "greenish" hue attached to the intake manifold. Look familiar? Edited September 23, 2012 by buick man (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 The nailheads 57 and on are definitely blue, at least from what I have seen. Now the 322 nailheads appear to be more greenish. However, your yellowing theory is logical. Many of the engines that are supposed to be original often are not. I don't know if they went to a different hue in 57, or just a different supplier. I'll take a shot of the 57 engine, it was scratched up and definitely blue, as was my 425. Now I have had several 322's, and I have had some engines that I'm pretty sure were not repainted, they are more of the greenish variety.For grins, I do some tracking of original owners. The first thing they say is the car was never molested. But further questioning is interesting, a story will surface that his son used the car and burned up the engine, it was replaced in 1960. Even "untouched originals" have some interesting history. A buick mechanic I met claimed his job from 57 to 64 was to rebuild nailheads and most of them dropped a valve, primarily the 322's. The oil passage to the valves is very tight, around a bolt thread. I can't say that I could 100% verify that I have seen the true, original paint as it looked from the factory on the 322 engine, and if so I can't swear it wasn't discolored from age and engine heat. Blue may very well be it, although I love the greenish!Now on Earl, the tranny tunnel was cut open. I do not doubt the 26K miles on the odometer is correct, or close. But the pancake filter was removed- but in the glove box in perfect condition. The fuel pump is a 55. I am tracking down the original owner, and I'll bet the engine and or tranny had work done. The tranny doesn't leak, that's a givaway right there. Engine is very smooth, but a valve job and touched up engine is likely, the question would be more of "when" than if. I wouldn't use it as a model for the engine paint.I am absolulely certain this is the first paint job. It's too late, but I notice laquer paint wears off of the high spots like the fenders. My theory is that's where you get lots of fingerprints and more vigourous washing. I would love to just shoot over it, but I am concerned that some rust under the paint would later bubble. The delima was part out the car (very tempting) or preseve it. too late now, the car was such an easy restoration I just had to see it live on. That pan could have brought a convertible back to life, but alas, it will make someone a proud owner. I do think the interior was original and had it not been stored in a mouse field we would have a car that could be classified "as original as possible"- I would have left the checked laquer paint and probably bang out the door. The donor door had 5 layers of paint! I must confess, I do have regrets on stripping the original paint. But I have the dented door as a model of what it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Good thread. Please tell us how you go about tracking down the previous owners. In California, one has to get written permission from each previous owner before the DMV will disclose any information about that owner. As far as I understand it, if you do not know the previous owners other than the party that sold you the car you are out of luck. It stops there as the DMV will give out no previous owner's information other than the seller to the buyer of the last transaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Ive been lucky to find some original title cars, I got an Alabama title for $200 and tracked down the owners. The Skylarks tend to be easier, people seem to remember a 54 Skylark. Now My Bama title gig dried up, so now I have to do a vin search. Colorado now has a deal where you can do a vin search that might identify the last owner. You don't have to get a bond, so I'll post how it goes. The owner did know the guy from Pueblo so I'm pretty sure I'll nail down the 54. California is brutal, bad state for messing with lost titles. I understand they crush the car first and ask questions later if there is so much as the slightest issue. The 56's and the 57 might be tough, but this new no-bond program is only $20 so I figure I'll give it a shot. Then we can get a salvage title or a hot rod title if all else fails.Once you find the last colorado owner and get a release, they will cut a title. Interesting to see how good the records are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Very Interesting..... Well in California what they do is make it very hard for a buyer to discover the complete chain of title. Also, if the car has sat for years that information will not be in their system anymore. Other states (Midwest) I understand made microfiches out of everything before computers and still keep them as an active archive. CA will disclose only the last "Seller" before you and only minor information to protect the party in question. So this makes it impossible to follow a chain of owners on just one particular car. I do not know how other states do this in allowing or disallowing a chain of title search. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Being a convrtible guy, I never messed with a headliner. I can't figure out how they get them in there, much less remove it. The 57 is pretty nice too, I'll start a thread on that but I have a new rule, one car at a time and I'm not going to backslide. That dessert sand was weird. It's like it just stuck to all the surfaces and looked like it was all stuck to oil, and it was covered in mouse terds. When it just hosed off, if anything it was like a protective layer. Most cars its a layer of goo that takes a month to clean off, one inch at a time. Wish the seats were that easy, mice love this cotton stuff they put on the foam, and they nest in the seats. My 16 year old had a look of terror, but he wrecked his car so he didn't have much of a choice.The headliner is not that difficult. I have a thread in the 54 Buick Highway forum of what I did for my install. It is a physical job but no more physical than the paint sanding, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Now if I could find convertibles this nice, life would be great. I'd settle for a hardtop. Well, I suppose someone will like it. Just a boring white, a green top and well, easy access for a family of 6. Reminds me of miserable 12 hour drives, 3 in the front, 3 in the back with my dad swattin' at us when we started fighting. Well, it's history I suppose!:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 The colors look great. Not boring at all. I like it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEarl Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 May be the light, but doesn't look like Arctic White to me. Almost like an eggshell white. just sayin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I agree! Artic white is well, very white! It's like matador red- chevy matador red is very orange, Buick matador red is much deeper. I have seen a lot of artic white cars that are this color, just a tad off white. That is the advantage of a 4 door. There is virtually noting I can do to make this car worth $5000. However, we bought a paint booth for $200 from a metal shop. This car was a test shoot, so I got what I paid for! I could sand it off, but it laid up so nice that it stays as is. This car is a shoestring budget, no looking back... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEarl Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) I agree! Artic white is well, very white! It's like matador red- chevy matador red is very orange, Buick matador red is much deeper. I have seen a lot of artic white cars that are this color, just a tad off white. That is the advantage of a 4 door. There is virtually noting I can do to make this car worth $5000. However, we bought a paint booth for $200 from a metal shop. This car was a test shoot, so I got what I paid for! I could sand it off, but it laid up so nice that it stays as is. This car is a shoestring budget, no looking back...as I said I was "just saying".... and since I'm "saying", I may as well go ahead and say, if it isn't the light then it is more than as you say "a tad" off. You're right, Arctic White is white, like the snow in the Arctic, I've never seen an Arctic White that wasn't "white", where have you seen "a lot" of them. How did the paint shop miss getting something "white"? Maybe they were working from an old yellowed paint chip? A tad more tint and it could have been Casino Beige which would have looked nice with the Baffin Green roof. and I feel obliged to ask and defend, why are you always talking down on 4 doors. what do you mean "That is the advantage of a 4 door" A 4 door deserves to be dressed up just as pretty as a 2 door. If you had a daughter with a fat ass, wouldn't you dress her as pretty as you would your other nice ass daughter. and what's with this "There is virtually noting I can do to make this car worth $5000"?" You were on the right track to having a nice "correct" enough '54 Special that "someone" could have taken it and added a correct interior and trunk lining and had a prestigious and stately looking little 4 door sedan. Granted even with buying it for your "around $3000" asking price and adding correct interior, "someone" would have had more in it than it is worth, but isn't that the name of the game with any antique auto restore.While I commend you for all the hard work and time you've put into the car, I'm not appreciating the seeming disregard you have for not at least trying to get the right color on it.Sorry for sounding like such a jerk here folks and yea yea I realize it is his car, he can paint it whatever color he wants, but there is a little more to it than that for me. It's a '54 Buick. Edited October 6, 2012 by MrEarl (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Ouch! Life is too short to take seriously, so it's not the first time my sarcasm has got me in trouble. Well, I actually do like four doors, I just like to make fun of them. 2 doors suck, it's hard to get the beer out of the back seat. Now convertibles are fun, until the top gets left down in a downpour. Had that happen once, a foot of water in the car. Let me explain a bit. If I didn't like the car, I would not have messed with it. I make fun of all my cars and It's mean and nasty. That's why they vapor lock after a car show! Some find me entertaining, some don't like it. As for the paint, that was an Oh **** moment. I thought, you idiot, why didn't you do the white laquer? Not the first time I used paint description an d it wasn't right. Gotta have a code or match a swatch. But that's another story about a paint booth. I could easily dust the car, but I'm out of town and I thought the paint looked kinda cool. I have yet to see it in person. I won't make fun of Earl anymore, he will get the respect a 54 Buick deserves. He won't be a home to rats (other than me) and that was only a single coat. Now the casino Beigh is a cool idea. Also, I'm not building this car to make money, I actually want to do it on a shoestring and offer it at cost (or below) to someone that would love it, but really doesn't want to or can't spend a lot. But poking fun at your namesake was in poor taste. Please accept my apologies. Now, the question- casino Beige or arctic white? any opinions on that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEarl Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 (edited) Sorry fin's I'm the one who should apologize, guess I misread your sarcasm. I'm a pretty sensitive guy when it comes to my fitty fo fo does Edited October 9, 2012 by MrEarl (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 we have some good news, and some bad news. First, the baddo check your paint first! wrong paint! Got back home and well, it aint white.now, the good news. The car came out absolutly stunning I had to put the chrome on. the man can definitely lay some paint.It's gotta go to Good guys in November. Of course, had the paint been correct it would have fish eyes and runs everywhere. Funny how that works. I gotta get a photo shoot on this one.well, I'm in it deep now. Up to 2500.00. The budget is 3k, $500 for an interior might be a bit optimistic.I think a sedan can be a show stopper- could win the 50's class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 It was too good to be true. All was going well. The paint fubar wasn't the end of the world. But as the car was backing up, there was a funny crunching noise. The rear passenger door was left open.The rusted out century has proven to be quite useful. So far it has donated the driver door and the rear passenger door.2 more doors to go.:mad:it was too depressing to photograph, but the driver's side looks great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Wrapping up the outside. Now if I charged my time, might be upside down! Now the budget buster- the interior. Was interesting to do a budget job. Any rust and it just would not have worked out. Well, it will soon be looking for someone to drive it to church and back, but I'll do an interior expose soon. Other than the wrong paint and a demolished door it went fairly smooth. The rusty century had the needed doors and other parts. I drove it around a bit and got a lot of interesting comments. I'm not a grandpa yet but everyone seemed to think I'm the original owner.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 NICE!!! Anyone should be proud to drive around in that. I know I would be. Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 54fins Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 I have a straw hat, a flowered shirt and depends. I like to go cruising in full regalia! Like I say, I love joking about it but it is an eye catcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhambulldog Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Very Nice!!:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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