Forum critcisms

[Guest REATTANEOPHYTE]

I have been a Reatta owner for only 18 months, and in that time this forum has been of great valuable to me, a car mechanic challenged person. With the assistance of Mr Eaton and Mr Finn I have learned how to repair/replace some items, and with the wealth of experience and knowledge I encounter on most of the postings I can diagnose problems and advise a trusted mechanic how and where to locate possible solutions. My 89 red/tan 92K now pleasureably runs with the elegance with which it was built and endowed, and is as enjoyable as my long ago purchased new entry into the USA BMW I loved. It's the first auto since that BMW that I love to take out for a ride through country roads to enjoy the handling and feel. And for that I thank Barney and Jim, and all others who have contributed their expertise to this forum.

Lately this forum has changed flavor and taste. There seems to be an lot of sniping and although some is tongue-in-cheek,some almost eliteist sounding posts take away from the concept of this forum. The posts which are indeed difficult to read because of spelling and syntax are from someone who intends to seek and learn from the forum, and it's that person's problem to learn to post more easily understandable queries. As good members it is our duty to assist that person, not turn them away.They will learn to take more time and use more patience as they compose.

I did not realize that ads within members posts were acceptable, and always thought that to place an for sale ad we used the space provided at the top of the forum. Is it allowable for me to place an ad for my items in all my posts? I don't see Mr Finn doing that, or Mr Eaton, who contribute knowledge and parts/repair sources, and should, since they speak with intelligence and experience. Or, can I post a one-time ad listing things I have for sale so that members can save my URL and contact me for purchasing and/or inquiries.

If some are offended, and distracted, about syntax/spelling, do what you can do to this posting, ignore it. Or offer some help to the deciphering of the message.But I would like to thank the many, many posters to this forum who have contributed to my enjoyment of a wonderful machine which did not enjoy the engineering and design progress for the car enthusiast with which it was put on the road. It is a remarkable auto from the skin to the heart.

[Guest mgibson]

There was a Reatta For Sale forum section tried for some time. It did not generate much traffic and the webmaster rolled it back into one heading. Search back about six months and you should find a complete explanation. I understand that posting for sale is perfectly fine here as most Reatta owners or want-to-be owners may not look elsewhere. Thank you for showing concern for things like spelling, grammar and syntax as it does enhance communication. I still use an analog dictionary!

[Guest MauiWowee]

Normally, responses that are petty and unkind are policed by the forum members themselves. Nothing is perfect, but if you have participated in any other forums, this one is a very civilized place to be compared to most. Now, what was the question?

[Ronnie]

If this thread is aimed at me and my website, here are the facts.

<span style="font-weight: bold">The advertisement in my signature line has been removed.</span>

[Guest TommyH]

I also belong to the bimmerforums.com, and I have not read a sing post that was kind. People are blunt, and get off topic more than I do, which is a lot(ADHD ) They are starting to crack down on it, though. I haven't read anything on here that was 'bad' or mean, yet!

[Reatta45]

Reattaneophyte,

you are right, :)but there are some very good moderators at this site. If things get TOO strange, ignorant or wrong, they do step in and make the necessary adjustments.

As to the overall flavor it will wax and wane through time. I choose to overlook those that are inconsiderate. They sometimes do it, as you say, tongue in cheek, but at times I am sure some think they are being cute. It may be from immaturity or bad manners or whatever, but it is usually easy to ignore those comments, and every now and then they will have something positive to contribute.

There are times that some things or comments are made within this forum that would be better if addressed with a personal message, available using this forum…

The issue of sales usually works itself out with normal posting. There have been several attempts to make things flow better in the past. I am sure there will be future attempts to improve things. The best so far is at the top of this page, the sticky post about selling your Reatta. It covers everything most people want to know. There have been for sale sites listed. Ebay is most likely the most popular, everyone knows that you are able to find almost anything you will ever want there…

The simple truth is most of us here do not want to buy or sell cars, BUT we all like to see cars that are of interest for sale. This is why the cars for sale within this forum is so nice and welcome. You do not have to go to another place to see it.

The members that have other things for sale, like you mentioned, have the dignity not to toot their own horn, someone will always refer people to them.

Over all this is a fun place to visit… I do look forward to the time I can set aside to follow what us going on. As was already mentioned it is for the most part, civil enough to invite most back… as to sentence structure and grammar well we all try … at times. KennyV.

[Guest NEMO]

AT a tude,no problem,its the new gender a ration,man nors, are a thing of the past and spelting too.

[Guest EDBS0]

I concur and have not be shy about inviting members to

"Take this to the grammmar forum,

this is the Reatta Forum!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

I lurked for months before registering in 01 and have seen good and bad changes.

[Barney Eaton]

Thanks, I think that was a compliment.

Stick around, sometimes I explode. You can only take so many repeated stupid questions. Someone said no question is stupid, but it would be nice is some of these people would at least hit the SEARCH button before asking questions about their car.

The most common problem is the poster not specifing the year of car. Our Reattas are very much alike but there are some areas that did change.....as noted earlier this week on the 1988 cooling fans being wired/controlled differently than the later years.

I spend several hours each day at the keyboard or on the phone. I even call people back at my expense (which my wife questions) I signed up for this job so I will live with it.

One additional item that helps diagnose a problem.... on your profile, at least give your state. Problems are different in Wisconsin than in Arizona.

If there is a defination for what I do, it would be " to educate the rest of the automotive world that the Reatta is a future collectable...it meets all the criteria, except it is not old enough........yet"

[DAVES89]

A couple of observations...

People are lazy. To often,myself included, will simply go on line and ask a question. As Barney states if they would just do a search, the question has already been asked [and answered] probably less then 6 months ago. Most questions are regarding Headlights,console/dash lights, brakes, stereo,cam sensor,coil/ignition.

Why don't we expand/update the FAQ section of this website?

Then we can at least give people a start with addressing these problems with a minimum of effort on the searchers behalf. [Look at the brake part of the site for how it could be].

When we have people sign up make it mandatory that the year of the car and state they live in be in their profile. If they don't put it in they don't get signed up.

Punctuation/grammer - This will be the hardest to fix. The people who come on are anxious to get an answer for their problem so they type fast and don't proof read. The real problem is that while they are waiting for an answer, the answer takes longer to get, because many times one really doesn't understand fully what is being asked!

I have seen other posters being teased [some in fun and some not] regarding grammer/punctuation and they still contribute[intelligently I might add] but have also cleaned up their posting. It does not help the issue to take sides about whether this is important or not, I think a simple posting of "I do not understand your post,please resubmit" will tell the poster to go back and redo his work if he wants an answer.

Regarding an ad within a post. We all know who is doing it,so I don't have to say Ron's name so I won't. Ron is doing a great service, both by helping address repair issues and offering a for sale site. Most of the people on this forum have all the cars they need. However we are always looking for parts. What Ron has done is give us an opportunity to get their extra parts out there for others to consider. I think that Ron should expand it by putting Jim's email address on the site as well to help those looking for parts not listed.

This is a great forum and as I have stated before I WOULD NOT HAVE/KEEP THIS CAR WITHOUT YOUR HELP

Thank you and please keep posting.

[Vincent Vega]

This is one of the most civil boards I frequent. Peter does a great job of policing. We have several members who are experts on Reatta's. You want to see whining and sniping? Read the comments on any article on usatoday.com. Gramer ant spellig are always going to be an issue. One board I go to has a deaf guy as a regular. His spelling and grammar are as to be expected. However, everyone is very respectful and understands his situation. Perhaps we can do the same.

[DAVES89]

I just wanted this to stay up near the top. I also see a lot more model years and state addresses on the postings...

Thanks!

[HRP]

I concur that this is an unusually polite and informative discussion board. However, those of us who prefer to see correct spelling and proper grammar have our right to properly express our discouragement at the direction in which our language is moving. Spelling and grammar are major contributors in forming the "first impression" of a poster on any discussion board and almost anywhere else.

Professor Henry Higgins proved this point quite effectively in "My Fair Lady". You are judged by your manner of speech and writing.

So please bear with those of us who shudder at things like improper spelling, the misuse of words, ending a sentence with a preposition, and the gramatical misuse of prepositions, conjunctions, and the verb "to be". Examples would include "different than", "I am him, and "a preposition is a bad word to end a sentence with."

We happen to believe that a society can be judged by the manner in which they speak and write. However, when we do offer corrections, they should presented gently, politely, and in a a manner not creating discord.

[Guest tomt]

That was put extremely well.

My wife's job was just downsized and her "superior" misspelled Memorandum in the letter to the staff. For my wife, who was an Engilish major, that is almost worse than the action.

What do you guys think about putting spell check and grammar correction in the base package for sending a message?

TT

[jonlabree]

Why don't we ask the forum to put up a spell check.?

[Guest MauiWowee]

Sorry.........

I suppose that having spell check would be great for those who choose to use it, but if the worst speller here has something to add to our knowledge I don't care if they can spell or not. We all have our own strengths and weaknesses so leave the non spellers alone.

After all, poor spelling is far less a crime than putting bull horns on a Reatta.

[Guest EDBS0]

Listen to your <span style="font-family: 'Comic Sans MS'"><span style="font-style: italic">"Long Term member"</span></span> R.H.I.P!

Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a toatl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe.

Or rather...for the reading impaired Reatta Forum members...

According to a researcher at Cambridge University, it doesn't matter in what order the letters in a word are, the only important thing is that the first and last letter be at the right place. The rest can be a total mess and you can still read it without problem. This is because the human mind does not read every letter by itself but the word as a whole.

[Roadster90]

Robert............

[Guest DTerry]

However, that doesn't make me enjoy reading it. HRP said it extremely well.

I really don't believe its actually poor grammar or spelling - which doesn't bother me - but its the "text messaging" style that annoys me something awful. If you don't have the time or the consideration of others to put the message in a form that doesn't have to be translated, then wait until you can. I have two college age kids who speak that language; most adults don't.

My apologies in advance to anyone offended by this, but having grown up in a home with an English teacher (my mother), it drives me nuts.

[D-a-n-i-e-l]

Hey look there is a Reatta

[Guest EDBS0]

XXXXXX

[Machiner 55]

I appreciate the point of view expressed by our Canadian brother to the North and others here but, (and there's always a but...)

I'm in the "yuzaspellchecker" camp.

I don't think that there's a computer out there that doesn't come with word processing software as part of the installed bundle. With a simple cut and paste, which takes only seconds I might add, all posts can and should be almost error free.

Thank God that the words have to be typed in order to be posted as opposed to handwritten otherwise we'd have something else to fuss about. (According to my Wife, I'm Mister Fuss-Fuss so I guess I know a little about making a fuss. Fuss... such a peculiar word.)

(This document was spell and grammar checked w/ MS Word. There’s at least one sentence that ends with a preposition but I like the way it reads out)

[charlie1]

IZZZ

Edited August 2, 2009 by CHAS1 (see edit history)

[Enoytsur]

Good morning, all ... good discussion. I can see where highly technical folks and even not so technical ones would get frustrated answering or seeing the same questions repeatedly. However, taking a devil's advocate look at the same subject of the questions popping up repeatedly I have a question...

If folks did not bring up past subjects, if everyone searched until they found the answers from past posts or some avenue completely, then what would be on this forum? What would be discussed? It occurs to me that if we didn't rehash stuff at some point the 14 to 30 folks on the forum at one time would dwindle to a handful.

Is our purpose to share a common bond of Reatta ownership and the trials, tribulations, and fun associated with that? If so then we should accommodate lazy folks as well as ones that dig for info until the cows come home ... that's what keeps things rolling along.

Just and opinion.

John

[Guest Ranger]

I can agree with most of what's been said. If a question is repeated, I can just skip over it without getting my undies in a bundle, someone will answer it for the new member. I do have a problem with those who "lecture" others on what is correct or incorrect. If we can all remember that some of us are stoopid and don't always use currect spelling and grammer, I'd think it would be less upsetting to the Adrian Monk types. The newbie, who dares to step forward and ask a question that was asked two years ago is not automatically an idiot, let's ease up just a bit and give others some slack. Maybe, just maybe, we'll keep the new members instead of driving them away.

Jim

[jonlabree]

Here! Here........

[Guest MauiWowee]

the Adrian Monk types

LOL

[89REATTAJIM]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 63viking</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here! Here........ </div></div>

Not wanting to be offensive, but to follow the point of this thread, shouldn't the comment be "Hear, Hear"?

[jonlabree]

No, It's Here! Here

[Guest crtnrds]

I agree with Ranger. If I can't read a post, or it's too long winded or has been covered too many times, etc., I just go on to the next post. No problem, mon.

All things said, this is BY FAR the best "motorhead" site I've been on despite, & because of all, the things mentioned above.

[Ronnie]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Reatta45</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Reattaneophyte,

you are right, :)but there are some very good moderators at this site. If things get TOO strange, ignorant or wrong, they do step in and make the necessary adjustments.

As to the overall flavor it will wax and wane through time. I choose to overlook those that are inconsiderate. They sometimes do it, as you say, tongue in cheek, but at times I am sure some think they are being cute. It may be from immaturity or bad manners or whatever, but it is usually easy to ignore those comments, and every now and then they will have something positive to contribute.

There are times that some things or comments are made within this forum that would be better if addressed with a personal message, available using this forum…

The issue of sales usually works itself out with normal posting. There have been several attempts to make things flow better in the past. I am sure there will be future attempts to improve things. The best so far is at the top of this page, the sticky post about selling your Reatta. It covers everything most people want to know. There have been for sale sites listed. Ebay is most likely the most popular, everyone knows that you are able to find almost anything you will ever want there…

The simple truth is most of us here do not want to buy or sell cars, BUT we all like to see cars that are of interest for sale. This is why the cars for sale within this forum is so nice and welcome. You do not have to go to another place to see it.

The members that have other things for sale, like you mentioned, have the dignity not to toot their own horn, someone will always refer people to them.

Over all this is a fun place to visit… I do look forward to the time I can set aside to follow what us going on. As was already mentioned it is for the most part, civil enough to invite most back… as to sentence structure and grammar well we all try … at times. KennyV.

</div></div>

It appears thread was aimed at me and my website.

<span style="font-weight: bold">The advertisement in my signature line has been removed.</span>ill aso tri to ignor spelling miskakes that mace messages hord to reed

Reason: Resistance Is Futile. I have been Assimilated!

[DAVES89]

Mace is spelled rong it is spelled mak. dummy lol

[Enoytsur]

Ronnie, that's a shame ... for the life of me I cannot see how a convenient link aimed at helping folks causes anyone undue concern.

Thank you for putting a lot of hard work and creativity into designing the Reattas For Sale web site in an effort to help members of this forum buy and sell Reattas and associated gear. Also, thank you for being willing to eat the costs of operating the site ... that was very generous.

Again, thank you, John

[jonlabree]

I agree Ronnie, Yoi could ask the webmaster to post your site at the top of the forum.

Jon..

[jonlabree]

I agree Ronnie, You could ask the webmaster to post your site at the top of the forum.

Jon..

[Guest MauiWowee]

Regrettable response

[Guest Reatta1]

Been following this with 'interest' but no 'principle' so will now toss in my penny or two. Some may not use the 'search' simply because they aren't aware of it (newbies) and some, like myself, who have trouble with it. Additionaly, it doesn't hurt to repeat a question for the simple fact that maybe someone has come up with a different solution, experience or resource since the last time a particular problem was discussed. Personally, I can't get my shorts in a knot over it. Life is too short, when you are my age anyway. So post away guys, and I ain't gonna worry meself bout no grammer or spellin neether.

[Guest Tammy]

I'm thankful this post was not here when I looked this forum up a few years ago. I probably would not have taken the time to check it out more. And then would not own my car today.

Everybody has their own "issues"! Until you have walked in someone's shoes , please don't judge.

Thankful I am! I would not own my car without you guys! This forum is GOLD to me. I realize I don't add much, seems I can open a can of worms every now and again, but I do appreciate everyone here.

[Guest imported_blazer1997]

I agree with Tammy. Since the purchase of my reatta five years ago this site has been extremely helpful.

Each day I check this site at least two time a day.

This forum critcism, and sentence structure, grammar has me at the point of leaving this site.

Maybe we should submit all new replys have them proof read let them submit the corrected version.

[Guest simplyconnected]

IMHO, this site brings many good but different things to its members. I am sure it is vastly different than when it first started.

For many of the long-term members, it is a social club of sorts. New members sense this immediately. They are skeptical about posting for fear of being chastised (for whatever reason). But, long-term friends are bonded by a history of similar loves and hates; they tend to support those who conform to their beliefs, (and ignore the others).

Newer members may be ignorant but they certainly aren’t stupid. Many have made mechanics/mechanical engineering their life, but are new to this forum and they may be very awkward in their posts. Is it possible to be so intelligent that it becomes difficult to communicate regarding a specific area? I am reminded of Edison and Einstein. Henry Ford barely made it through eighth grade, and his English was deplorable. (He never owned a driver’s license, either.)

All you English Comp majors speak with gracious eloquence, but what about the “one word sentence” guy who is new to all this computer/Internet business? Isn’t it the membership’s duty to also embrace him, and point him in the right direction? So what, if everyone solved your ABS lock-ups decades ago. Can we overlook some ignorance in favor of gaining a friend by helping him? Certainly, everyone has a forte. The new friend may just be very beneficial to the membership in some other manner, (AND you may sell him a few parts).

Again, IMHO, just because someone invests his life doing mechanics instead of English doesn’t make him less in the automotive mechanics field. Most engineers I know, HATE making instructional manuals because their English isn’t there. Kinda reminds me of American League pitchers… aren’t they usually horrible batters? And power-hitters usually can’t pitch for crap!

Let’s continue our valuable discussions about classic car problems, with others who desire the same. This exchange of information has thrilled both sides; those who really need help, and those who kindly offer free and real solutions through education and long-term experience. What a ride!

I truly appreciate this site. I am not disgusted with any portion of it, I enjoy the refreshing variety of subjects, and I have learned a few things here. I admit, I have instigated a few rows, bumping heads with the experts, but they seem to enjoy it too. Keep up the goodwill and genuine welcome to all restorers. - Dave Dare