Thriller

Here in Manitoba, premium is ethanol-free, at least for the moment. As a result, I pay dearly for it as a bit of peace of mind for the older Buicks. The Rainier gets regular, but it doesn't sit much since it's a daily driver.

Is it possible it differed by series? Or at least the big / small body cars?

Nice colour. Good night John Boy.

I try to take off my watch and rings, not that I intend to touch the car, but the less metal I have on, the safer it is. That said, if this does move forward, please note that there's a fairly significant proportion of folks with latex allergies...it would have to be the nitrile variety. Of course, if this goes ahead, I see it being another argument for those that want to move the National meet into the school year for cooler temperatures so that those of us with school age children have greater difficulty attending.

I think there is a lot of "correctness" going on here. First, I think Joe said it quite well - my opinion is strong, but I am concerned about the quality of the judging. Judge knowledge is important. Also important is understanding the judging process and what the judging forms mean. Every judging form I've had thus far has led me to ask what I think are serious questions about the process. I can understand someone being picky (even though judges are told "don't kill the car") and I can certainly understand some items being missed. However, there are some basics like mandatory deductions take all the points noted. Unfortunately it seems we have some judges who are too knowledgeable to grace the judging school with their presence in case they might learn something. I think Keith is also right to a degree. What proportion of "old Buick" owners are BCA members (or we could add in AACA as well)? What proportion of members have their cars judged and / or are judges? Of those judges, how many are truly knowledgeable? Unless correctness is documented well (and perhaps that is something the BCA should consider assembling with video / photographic evidence), there is a risk that someone will do something to their car, sell it as a correct car, and the error in knowledge is passed on. That is based on assumptions though. How often do we hear chuckle about ads that are quite ridiculous to the informed (say an "original" car with an SBC where a Nailhead should reside)? If the buyer knows their stuff, the error doesn't propagate, but if they are new to the hobby, or come to Buick from a lesser brand, I can see Keith's point being valid. Steve is also correct. There's a local '66 Wildcat that is customized. I bug the owner (a fellow BCA member) about his pimped-out 'Cat. Does the chrome under his hood make mine incorrect (ignoring the "unacceptable" Nailhead colour)? No. That isn't to stop anyone from making assumptions, but you know what they say about Ass U Me. The problem with the argument is simply whether or not there is the "gold standard" to ensure that we know what is original. For now, the closest we come is a combination of BCA judging manual, BCA judging school, and knowledgeable judges. This is somewhat fallible at present as we know errors are made. I'm sure I've blathered on longer than anyone wanted to read....

Sounds like time to have a chat with your mechanic. Part of the chat needs to be that he'd better smarten up, or you'll be looking to replace him. Your money fits into the other guys till / wallet just as easily. Now, expectations are part of the problem. You can't expect a 1960 to be like a new car. However, any noises you may hear should be able to be explained, such as road noise from a less tightly sealed cabin. Mechanical noises like a bam should not occur. Good luck.

You are not supposed to. However, that brings us back to the question of defining over-restoration. For something like a chrome bumper, the problem may actually start to become one of being correctly restored...I can't say I remember any of my cars when they were new, but according to everything I've heard, the chrome on bumpers was shiny, but not perfect. With so many on the show field having the "show chrome", I wonder if it is possible for someone with a basic chrome job which would be correct to get dinged since it is a different colour, less shiny, whatever, when compared to the others. BCA judging is supposed to be against a standard, not comparing the cars to each other, but if all the others you have to look at are a step above, I'd be concerned about it. Paint is a similar thing...we have way better paint now than the '50s / '60s. If 9 cars being judged have new BC/CC flawless paint, and the tenth has original enamel or laquer, or a correct repaint, but isn't as shiny or deep, or the colour doesn't "pop", does the correct car run the risk of deductions because it isn't as "nice" as the over-restored examples? I would hope not, but I am concerned that day may be coming. The clamps was a deliberately facetious example...it was just something that came to mind.

The mould was cut out first.... Had some pie tonight...normally wouldn't have dessert during Lent, but we had company. No, not sugar free...that would be wrong.

Thanks for the reminder Bill. We actually are working on processing our last pumpkins from last year (a bit late as we got some mould action...which is why they are being processed). It isn't pie yet, but will be someday...or at least some of it. Video not available due to copyright. Sigh.

Generally, over restoration is considered where more modern materials / methods are used. Exterior paint (base coat / clear coat) and plating (show chrome) are probably the most common. Beyond that, I think there gets to be some disagreement. It seems to me the BCA has stated that gloss level underhood doesn't matter. I don't like that. I mean, I can buy rust protective paint, as an example, in flat, satin / semi-gloss, and high gloss. If the satin or semi-gloss is correct, with otherwise the same paint formulation, I have trouble understanding how it could be considered over restoration rather than non-authentic. While slightly silly, I could go to the parts store and get different types of clamps...however, if I put on a better hose clamp so the car doesn't leak antifreeze, that is incorrect and a deduction. So, I struggle with why you can do that with paint, but not hard parts. As others have noted, body panel alignment tends to be better on a restored car than original. Also, better materials may be used, for instance in weatherstripping. I too would like things better defined, ideally by consensus, but I don't expect that ideal to be met.

"This Video is not available in your country" Grrrrr.

Are you calling our Mike spinny? :D:rolleyes:

At least you aren't alone....

David, Post #38 hits on a problem point. This may very well be a site for hobbyists, but there is a wide range of folks with a wide range of reasons for joining the hobby and a wide range of reasons for joining this site. If you want to come in here and figure you know better than the AACA and its moderators, then go crazy, but don't expect everyone here to be all happy for you. That said, I don't care for postings that are here as just a link to eBay. However, I have a wide variety of cars and if I trolled eBay and Craigslist for stuff I may need, then I wouldn't have time to participate here any more. As MrEarl suggested, if it ain't broke, don't fix it...and while it may be somewhat broken, it probably isn't that bad. Personally, I have a much bigger problem with subjects that aren't descriptive. "Buick Parts" listed for sale in the Buick Buy / Sell forum is kind of stupid. At least put in a year, and better yet a part as well...that way we'll know whether or not it is something that may be of interest. I find that a bigger time waster than someone who has something I want / need who just happens to list it on eBay as well. Another thing is that this site isn't the be all and end all for Buick parts. There are probably more Buick folks not on this site than on this site...consider that there are many other boards covering specific years / models / eras of Buick, so not everyone is going to post here, but if they have stuff for sale, why shouldn't they be allowed to list it here, with or without a link to another sale site? Postal money orders are good for many things, but they aren't nearly as timely as Paypal. If you don't want it / like it / whatever, don't click it. On top of that, your proposal would also add significantly to the amount of moderator work that would be required in this sub-forum which presently isn't required now. Sorry for seeming obstinate. I have nothing against you nor your idea. I think it is overkill for a relatively minor problem here. I'm also with MrEarl on the idea that the more restrictive the rules get, the more frustrated folks will get, and will ultimately leave the site, making it less useful to those that remain.

How did that commercial go..."I can't see the difference, can you see the difference?"...or something similar. I love the before and after shots together like that. It just reminds me how lazy I am compared to you....

Nicole, A couple more points to consider. As others have mentioned, the only judging that you would lose points for the changes you describe is the BCA 400 point judging. If you are looking at local car shows, it is typically either "people's choice" or "driver's choice" which just refer to which folks get to vote...they typically don't care about originality. If you are looking at wanting an authentic car as it rode off the assembly line, the BCA 400 point judging is probably best for you. Judging can be a real turn-off for a lot of folks. For me, I have found that the last few items to correct get quite expensive, so you really have to consider how strict you want to be in that regard. Mild modifications can also lead you to consider the BCA modified judging, which would allow you to do the things you describe, while still potentially winning an award with the car at a BCA event. Red would have been an optional colour for wheels in 1956. Body colour was also available, and I believe black. Choose which one you think will look best to you. The seat fabric should generally be available...if not perfect, something close. The question you will want to ask is which you prefer. Personally, as a fat guy, I like cloth because it doesn't heat up in the summer sun like vinyl does, particularly an issue if I'm wearing shorts. Good luck. Please feel free to share your story and photos in the Me And My Buick forum. We like pictures.

The compression on the straight 8 is relatively low, so you shouldn't get valve seat recession from using unleaded gas. It would typically only be an issue if the engine is working hard, like towing, or in mountains. You probably want to try to stay away from ethanol if you can. In my part of the world, that means buying premium gas at the pumps. Good luck. Your father may want to consider a membership in the Buick Club of America.

Vinyl is the same shape as pie.... Flash...there are some others, aren't there?

2fit661 - there is a Buick Buy / Sell sub-forum here...that is probably where this post belongs.

Perhaps Suzanne will photograph and write about it...I know she has a bunch of hub cap / wheel photos....

We have been for years, just on a larger scale than automobiles...they ride the rails.

If I recall correctly, 1967 was the first year Buick offered optional radials. It is in the BCA Judging Manual. The thing that surprises me is that AACA judges would be stricter than the BCA about something like that, but while claiming to be the know it alls miss things like the decal (not that I could have picked that out myself). BCA judging says don't deduct for radials if it is 1967 or later. It doesn't make sense that they would deduct for something that is correct on the car unless you can prove it came with that option...especially when you have proof. I'm of two minds (at least) about judging. Every time I've had a car judged at a BCA National, I have come away angry about something...typically it is because they deducted for something that in the judging school you were told not to deduct for...or the forms not being filled out correctly or..... Better stop now before I get into rant mode.

I like the suggestion so far as it is a considered approach to get the strict eBayers out or the ones that simply post a link and run away. However, if you are forcing out the likes of MrEarl, a long time contributor (look at his post count compared to yours, as well as join date) to this site, then I for one believe you are off base. At least eBay offers feedback mechanisms, and some buyer protection, which this site does not - simply because it is a forum.

Seafoam is absolutely fantastic in small engines. Of course, a lot of guys use it for cleaning up carbs to prepare for storage. I have used it in cars as well to help stabilize gasoline, but like Adam, can't honestly say it has a definitive impact.

The other thing with respect to hardened seats is that the composition of Buick blocks makes it unnecessary...a good grind will do the trick. I paid less for the engine in the Wildcat, but that's six years ago now too...of course the shop did a bunch of other mechanical work on the car, so the total bill was more than Bob's.