Antique car, 1927-28 Paige 8-85 Straightaway 5 passenger sedan , not mine.

[cjmarzoli]

Early form of "backwoods" EGR?   Looks like the crankcase vent tube is aimed directly into the intake throat of the carburetor.  Of course there is no room for any sort of air cleaner.   Carb is probably a non stock replacement.  The more we see of this car the more "hacked" it looks, but we'd still love to know what it actually started life as!

[Xander Wildeisen]

45 minutes ago, 29PierceArrow said:

Here's some pics I took yesterday. Wierd looking carburetor. Can someone help identify the year of this motor. I'm considering buying it.

 

Tom Griffith    lincoln1955@msn.com

 first picture of a Home made crank case venting valve/pipe to recirculate back through the carb

[29PierceArrow]

When I was there yesterday I did notice that the vent pipe is aimed directed into the air intake port of the carburetor. Does that recirculate the air back through the carb??

Why would you need to do this?

[29PierceArrow]

Question for you all: 

He's come down some from the $9k. What is this engine and drive train worth knowing I have to spend $20k to rebuild it [according to my engine rebuilder].

[Xander Wildeisen]

8 minutes ago, 29PierceArrow said:

When I was there yesterday I did notice that the vent pipe is aimed directed into the air intake port of the carburetor. Does that recirculate the air back through the carb??

Why would you need to do this?

Owner went green before anyone else.

[kar3516]

4 minutes ago, 29PierceArrow said:

Question for you all: 

He's come down some from the $9k. What is this engine and drive train worth knowing I have to spend $20k to rebuild it [according to my engine rebuilder].

There isn’t any way to tell what it’s worth until you know for sure what it is.  And then it’s going to be what it’s worth to you because I doubt a long line will be forming at the door to buy it 

[58L-Y8]

14 minutes ago, 29PierceArrow said:

When I was there yesterday I did notice that the vent pipe is aimed directed into the air intake port of the carburetor. Does that recirculate the air back through the carb??

Why would you need to do this?

Suck up the crankcase blow by oil/combustion fumes that were asphyxiating the driver...

[Xander Wildeisen]

Does the engine spin freely?

[29PierceArrow]

Yes engine spins freely.

[classiclines]

The defining feature of the engine appears (to me) to be the top of the engine/head that has the structural reinforcement taper beginning at the radiator connection and extending the entire length.   The taper is not a feature on every car.  On the L29 Cord, the taper only goes half way.  This one goes the whole length.  And, it is different than the taper on the Auburns that quickly rise up to the radiator connection and then taper down the entire length.  Tried Google image search but it's not working (engines are too complicated for AI at this point LOL). 

Edited 18 hours ago by classiclines
fix typo (see edit history)

[classiclines]

Found this pic of a 1930 Graham 822 block - from this AACA previous thread:    ...but, just the block, not a fully-configured engine

 

Edited 18 hours ago by classiclines
Forgot details (see edit history)

[rydersclassics]

Carb looks like a Detroit Lubricator air valve Model 51 style ? 

[classiclines]

The 1930 engine and our unknown engine differ by the items highlighted with the white arrows - not sure the function

[29PierceArrow]

I did notice the white arrow object on the right when I was there. Not familiar to me either.

 

tom

[prewar40]

 

2 hours ago, classiclines said:

The defining feature of the engine appears (to me) to be the top of the engine/head that has the structural reinforcement taper beginning at the radiator connection and extending the entire length.   The taper is not a feature on every car.  On the L29 Cord, the taper only goes half way.  This one goes the whole length.  And, it is different than the taper on the Auburns that quickly rise up to the radiator connection and then taper down the entire length.  Tried Google image search but it's not working (engines are too complicated for AI at this point LOL). 

I'm not sure what this engine is - the 299 big eight has the short radiator connection. The smaller 226 & 247 eight had the long radiator connection. My 1928 Lycoming 8 has the manifold on the drivers side.  I don't think it's a Lycoming engine, I see other things that don't match.

Edited 15 hours ago by prewar40 (see edit history)

[Xander Wildeisen]

This was the engine in my 1931 Auburn 8-98 Cab, going by the tag on the engine. It checked out to be a 1930 Auburn Lycoming 8. Maybe the pictures can help.

[Xander Wildeisen]

4 hours ago, 29PierceArrow said:

Question for you all: 

He's come down some from the $9k. What is this engine and drive train worth knowing I have to spend $20k to rebuild it [according to my engine rebuilder].

I think you first need to know what you are looking at. On the restoration end it needs to be correct, what ever it is? On the custom end, it is a roll of the dice. You will compete in the market with modified cars that are a lot more desirable. If most of the parts can be used in a vintage speedster/race car. then you have to compare it to other like cars. 7-9k for a usable chassis, engine, transmission, rear axle, steering system, fuel system, brake system, cooling system, dash, gauges and wheels. Is a pretty good buy when you add up what you are getting. Part out the rest. sad but true.    

[wayne sheldon]

Paige and Graham were both in a state of transition through most of both 1927 and 1928. Things got confusing those two years, and it would not surprise me if there was a major engine change in the product lineup during that time. So take this with the proverbial grain of salt.

I happen to have an original Paige 8-85 owner's manual in my small collection of Paige literature. Paige was not consistent about the location of the valves and manifolds. Some models had them on the right side of the car, other models had them on the left side of the car. This subject car photos show the manifolds on the right side of the car. My original 8-85 owners manual shows the manifolds to be on the left side of the car.

[Xander Wildeisen]

Maybe this car is a unicorn with it’s horn cut off to stop poaching?

[rydersclassics]

Could this be the larger  Continental 8 ? 

 

Quote #1

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58L-Y8

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Posted June 24

The engine powering the 1928 Graham-Paige Model 835, 1929-'30 Model 835, 827 & 837 and 1930-'31 Graham Model 127 & 137 is the 322 ci straight eight manufactured by Continental Motors Corp. Model 14K."

 

Quote #2

Eystein Sedberg

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Posted May 19

Hi, a novice to Grahams, but looking at an 837 from 1929 which is for sale.

 

Two questions :

- Where on the car may I find the chassis number ?

- Have problems finding photos of the engine on the net.  Only thing I found was from a car in which the engine appeared to be a mirror image!!! (No- photo was not reversed -checked that with reference to the steering box) Can anyone confirm that the engine in the attached pictures from the car I am looking at is original to a 1929 837 ?

 

Edited 4 hours ago by rydersclassics (see edit history)

[58L-Y8]

12 minutes ago, rydersclassics said:

Could this be the larger  Continental 8 ? 

 

Quote #1

"

58L-Y8

• 
• Members
• •  3.4k

 

Posted June 24

The engine powering the 1928 Graham-Paige Model 835, 1929-'30 Model 835, 827 & 837 and 1930-'31 Graham Model 127 & 137 is the 322 ci straight eight manufactured by Continental Motors Corp. Model 14K."

 

Quote #2

Eystein Sedberg

•  
• Members
• •  33

 

Posted May 19

Hi, a novice to Grahams, but looking at an 837 from 1929 which is for sale.

 

Two questions :

- Where on the car may I find the chassis number ?

- Have problems finding photos of the engine on the net.  Only thing I found was from a car in which the engine appeared to be a mirror image!!! (No- photo was not reversed -checked that with reference to the steering box) Can anyone confirm that the engine in the attached pictures from the car I am looking at is original to a 1929 837 ?

 

The Michael Keller Graham-Paige history notes the Continental 14K 322 ci engine serial numbers are found on a plate on the right side of the block.  For each model year

1928 835: 503001-504299.

First Series

1929 835: 504300-505145.

Second Series

1929 827: 555001-557179.

1929 837: 506001-507014.

 

For the 1928 Paige 8-85, the carburetor is noted as a Johnson, the ignition as Delco-Remy.  The Lycoming 298.6 ci straight eight as Model 4H, the concurrent Auburns running a version were 1926-'27: 4HM; 1928: 4MD; 1929: MDA, all with Schebler carburetors and Delco-Remy ignition

[rydersclassics]

 

Given Graham Page bult most of their own bodies and contracted some engines from Continental is it possible they lowered the roof line and put this together in 28 before the later styling changes?

 

It seems odd to me that anyone else would pick this car to modify the body or put that much effort into customizing a sedan body and upgrade the engine from 6 to 8. 

 

It's kind of cool either way.    

[29PierceArrow]

This appears to be the motor that's in this car. Even those two hex nuts, one short one tall, that level out the spark plug holder match up.

Thank you for the research.      Tom Griffith

[29PierceArrow]

The distributor was replaced. The original Mallory type 13 is on the floor of the car. Cap is shattered.

[58L-Y8]

Here are engine photos of the DuPont Model G Club Sedan by Merrimac, the 12K Continental 322 ci L-Head straight eight shown at the 2021 Hershey.  The polished aluminum cover was DuPont's way of concealing the L-Head, implying it was an OHV/OHC engine.