Extra set of eyes needed (online) for purchase 1959 Imperial Crown

[The Creative Explorer]

Hello all,

 

I am sorry to bother you, but I am not very familiar with the subject and even though I know my way around cars, nothing can beats the trained eye and level of knowledge of the specific enthusiasts.

 

The thing is; I am looking for a nice hobby-car , to make a dream come true and I can enjoy it with my young family, making memories.
I have found a 1959 Imperial Crown in The Netherlands (where I live) and it seems to be an ok car, not perfect, but good enough to get me started and I can work on the little things along the way.

I love the design, it is also for me in the sweetspot of modelyears and the car is just s impressive.

 

I have only the pictures as attached, nothing more than that. I am trying to get more, but it is very difficult appearantly.  At least I got some more pictures of the trunk and engine bay.

 

The car is for sale at 16.500 Euro's, which would be roughly 17,600-18,000 Dollars? For over here, it is a decent price for a project car, V-8 fifties cars go very easy over 20K over here.

For me, 16.500 € is a lot of money and I am not treading lightly. Even though my heart is stolen, I try to keep my head and make a solid decision.

 

According to the seller;

-He has it since july 2023, and is selling because he bought another one in a different color. (sounds dodgy, but it could be)

-It runs and drives ok, but could use a service (Don't know what he means by could use a service, could be anything from a oil & filter change to a complete overhaul)

-When braking, it pulls slightly.

-The AC is not working

-The Cruise control is not working

-The car has been alligned after purchase, the mechanic who did that, said that the car looks very nice underneath (according to the seller).

 

From the poor photo's, it seems to be a solid car, but I have not seen anything from underneath.

 

I think this could be the one, but I am very keen to hear what you guys think.

[alsancle]

The story is dodgy, you are correct.    Too bad you are not in the USA.  You would have many many choices under 20K, especially if 4 doors is ok.

 

You need to get under the car and carefully look for rust.   Check under the doors, in the quarter panel over hangs, floors, etc.   Hopefully a Chrysler expert can tell us the secret spots to look.

 

Secondly,  does the engine smoke or make noises.  If it does than do not buy.

 

I don't hate it, but the pictures do lie. 

[The Creative Explorer]

And if you have any helpful tips of where to look for specifically for these cars, other than the generic things one has to look at, Please do share them.

[The Creative Explorer]

1 minute ago, alsancle said:

The story is dodgy, you are correct.    Too bad you are not in the USA.  You would have many many choices under 20K, especially if 4 doors is ok.

 

You need to get under the car and carefully look for rust.   Check under the doors, in the quarter panel over hangs, floors, etc.   Hopefully a Chrysler expert can tell us the secret spots to look.

 

Secondly,  does the engine smoke or make noises.  If it does than do not buy.

 

I don't hate it, but the pictures do lie. 

Thanks and I can't agree with you more. Photo's are quite sometime very misleading, but can at least give a first impression.

The car is 2,5 hours away from me and before I spend/invest my time and gas to come over, I'd like to have a complete picture.

 

I know, although I did live in the states 17 years ago. My wife is from Portland, OR.

 

And I am looking specifically for a 4-door, even though the coupes do look a tiny bit better, it is the practicality of the 4 door that I prefer. Plus prices are a bit more friendly on a 4-door and more so on a 4- door post.

[alsancle]

I am not a 59 Chrysler expert but generic rules apply to all cars.

 

1. Avoid a car with rust or a poor paint job covering rust.

 

2. Interior and chrome work is very expensive so it has to be presentable.

 

3. You don't want to have to rebuild the engine, so listen for noises and look for smoke.

 

Good luck, hopefully one of the Chrysler guys chimes in.

[Narve N]

1. Study the model, use Imperial Club Online pages and all the literature you can get hold of. Get to know what an Imperial is supposed to look like. Ask for an expert on 50s Mopars to come along and check, or be available via the telephone/videolink while you inspect the car.

2. To me the interior looks like a quick job in plain materials to smooth a quick sale. Imperial interiors would normally be more intricate and had patterns embossed in the leather in the late 50s?

3. Some Imperials used pot metal instead of stainless for mouldings and as a result had brightwork that is almost impossible to rechrome.

4. The pictures might indicate straight body sides which is good. Generally it looks like a non-restored car that has had a little work done.

5. These cars rust, get to know where and check all rustspots. Bring a large jack and an overall to inspect the car if the vendor doesn't have a lift available.

6. Do not think it must be this car or nothing, take your time. Lots of alternatives around, eg in Sweden with at least 4 Imperials advertised on this web-page: https://www.blocket.se/annonser/hela_sverige/fordon/bilar?cg=1020&mye=1969&page=2&q=chrysler

[alsancle]

4 hours ago, Narve N said:

1. Study the model, use Imperial Club Online pages and all the literature you can get hold of. Get to know what an Imperial is supposed to look like. Ask for an expert on 50s Mopars to come along and check, or be available via the telephone/videolink while you inspect the car.

2. To me the interior looks like a quick job in plain materials to smooth a quick sale. Imperial interiors would normally be more intricate and had patterns embossed in the leather in the late 50s?

3. Some Imperials used pot metal instead of stainless for mouldings and as a result had brightwork that is almost impossible to rechrome.

4. The pictures might indicate straight body sides which is good. Generally it looks like a non-restored car that has had a little work done.

5. These cars rust, get to know where and check all rustspots. Bring a large jack and an overall to inspect the car if the vendor doesn't have a lift available.

6. Do not think it must be this car or nothing, take your time. Lots of alternatives around, eg in Sweden with at least 4 Imperials advertised on this web-page: https://www.blocket.se/annonser/hela_sverige/fordon/bilar?cg=1020&mye=1969&page=2&q=chrysler

This is great advice but #6  I want to emphasis   There are ALWAYS more cars. 

 

On this note, I would say become an expert in what you are interested in so that by the time you buy a car you know more about it than the seller.   You can kill a lot of time and have fun before the purchase.  And sometimes you get lucky and never make the purchase!

[c49er]

Not an easy car to repair or find parts for.

Dashes/instruments  are difficult to repair and work on...

Some have complicated swivel seats.

Centerline power brakes...

AC system repairs can be very costly.

Power windows...power door locks? On and on.

Need a lot of back up to get one of these very luxurious cars up and going correctly.

Jump in and hang on for the fun ride!

[The Creative Explorer]

Thanks everybody for the input.

 

Bringing the jack is a very good idea, there is for sure no lift at hands and I have a good jack at home, so definately will bring that one along.

 

The interior is I believe original, I had the exact same thoughts as I could not find the crown embossed, but that is I think the angle of the photo's, it just missed the crown. The interior looks a lot (identical) to style 623. So I don't think it is redone at some point.

 

@c49erwhat do you mean with a lot of back-up?

This car does have the swivel seats, AC, Power windos and I believe power door locks, would I be in a lot of trouble to get one of these cars? If so, then it might not be the right choice. I can handle a lot of things, I exchanged engines, rustrepair, wireharnesses etc... And I believed that American cars from the fifties were rather uncomplicated put together.

I did find a junker nearby, it is a '57 and I want to use at least the sparrowcatcher on the inner side of the right wing. And perhaps the molding on the left passenger door.

 

For sure; this is not the one and only car. I like, I like what I see, it is right in the sweetspot, but I am not interested in a moneypit or someone else's junk. Even though I know my way around, I will bring a extra set of eyes with me. It is hard to find a '50-s Mopar expert, but he knows his way around cars as well. And he should be able to talk sense into me if the cars takes my heart :-). But no, it does not must be this car. Even though the Imperials in Sweden are way above my budget 😉 .

 

 

[JACK M]

Many differences between a 57 and a 58. Especially the engine.

Not sure what a sparrow catcher is but take very close looks and measurements on that molding to be sure it is the same.

[28 Chrysler]

Rocker panels, lower 1/4 panels, lower rear of the front fenders and the top of the fenders above the head lights is were the rust starts.

[The 55er]

Be aware that the left rear passenger door moulding & the quarter panel tail lamp inner ring (sparrow catcher? )do not match on Imperials from 1957 to 1959. The part numbers aren't the same as there are some styling differences. 

[The Creative Explorer]

On 2/8/2024 at 6:53 PM, JACK M said:

Many differences between a 57 and a 58. Especially the engine.

Not sure what a sparrow catcher is but take very close looks and measurements on that molding to be sure it is the same.

Those are the gun-sights at the back, they have the nickname sparrow catcher 🙂

[The Creative Explorer]

17 hours ago, The 55er said:

Be aware that the left rear passenger door moulding & the quarter panel tail lamp inner ring (sparrow catcher? )do not match on Imperials from 1957 to 1959. The part numbers aren't the same as there are some styling differences. 

Thanks, I took a better look at the donor car (which is practically around the corner) and you are right, the moldings are different. too bad.

[The Creative Explorer]

Well, I received some more pictures today and to me, it doesn't look all that bad.

There is one area which doesn't seem right to me, it is in the last picture and I circled it blue. It looks like there is a crack in the lower body. Maybe it is suppose to be, maybe it just looks funny, but I do bring it out to your attention.

[Narve N]

Did he show you that new Imperial in another color? The seats look like they have been recolored with lots of red paint and they will need immediate attention to avoid the leather ripping apart, but they appear original and saveable. The underside also looks alright, not covered in fresh underseal to cover up rust etc. That underside crack looks like it is supposed to be there.

 

But,

have you checked the areas around headlights, lower fenders and rocker panels for excessive use of plastic filler? A gauge for that is not too expensive. If you can borrow a endoscope and look into the inner wheelarches that would also be good. Have you tried driving it, does it steer straight and does the brakes pull up straight? Is there excessive smoke for the engine, is it hard to start cold or hot, does the engine temperature and oil pressure at idle stay normal?

[The Creative Explorer]

@Narve N none of that all, I have not been at the car yet. It is 2,5 hours away from me. I am planning to visit next week saturday.

I think that the seats are like that, I have seen other interiors with the 623 option, and they all look very red.

As stated in the first post, when braking, the car pulls to a side. To that has to be checked.

 

I also received a video of the car idling:

 

 

[Narve N]

The color might be original, but the seats appear to be re-dyed with lots of red color to cover up cracks with paint instead of a more thorough repair and refurbish. This might result in stiff and uncomfortable seats and even faster decaying of the leather.

[The Creative Explorer]

Thanks everybody for the help.
I went to see the car today and decided to leave it be. It had some work done on the right side and there was quite a filler patch on the right rear fender and at the lower side of the rear right door.

Even though I drove it, it strongly pulled to the right when braking. It did drive ok, the gear change was a bit rough, but not too bad.

 

The interior was a little bit of a mess, when using the power seat, the fuse blew and the car was dead. So it has somewhere dodgy wiring. The interior seemed to be original and not been dyed of any kind.

 

There were dents and scratches all over. Paint was faded, chipping and rubbed away, so it would need a full respray at some point.

 

For this price, I think I can expect a little bit more.