Glue recommendations for wood frame

[MG1927]

For those who have experience with rebuilding their wood frames, what glue is the best to use?

Thanks,

Marty

[Hubert_25-25]

I like the glue the www.rotdoctor.com sells.  2 part epoxy.  It is slow to set which I like.  I also like his clear epoxy sealer for coating all the old wood.  Also consider getting Q cells if you want to mix it with the epoxy.  It makes a great filler that you can put tacks in.  Q cells are by another company.  They use it for repairing surf boards.  I have used Max GPE with good results as well.    Hugh

 

[1924 6-55 Sport Tourer]

My opinion - none.

 

You want the body to flex with the chassis. I dont believe that any adhesive was used "back in the day".

Prove me wrong.

If the frame is too tight, stresses occur which will lead to undue damage to the panels/paint.

Rabbet joints with screw fixation is all you need.

 

Respectively

 

David

 

[Mark Shaw]

I have used good old Elmer's wood glue for non-structural splits and breaks.  I have also used Gorilla Glue for structural parts with good results. 

IMO; Thin epoxies mentioned above, are more for rotted wood or for hardening wood bodies in preparation for hard automotive paints.

[Hubert_25-25]

    There was glue used in the wood frame during assembly.  I believe several sections were assembled and glued to be very rigid, and then the metal was installed over the rigid structure.  I have a touring car and like many, the rain came in as the top and the rest of the car degraded.  There are pieces that were definitely glued together and other places that were not.  The glue did not hold up well with moisture.  For example.

The sills are made from 3 pieces - tongue and glued together.  The wood piece that goes over the rear axle was glued to the top side of this sill, and the rear most board was glued to this.  

I do know that the door frames were glued together before fitting with wood.  The doors are very weak when the glue breaks and that is when you see doors that are not pulling closed at the bottom when the top of the door is closed.  Some of these parts like the doors are glued with the bottom "in further than flush with the door" so that the door always touches at the bottom first before the latch secures it.  

There are also places where the pieces should not be glued together.  This is a snipet from my files showing how the body wood is assembled.  The first 2 photos shows a splice that I made into the sill that clearly shows the glued assembly of the sills.  In this case the sills were made from 3 long pieces and glued together to prevent warping.   

The reason I indicate gluing some pieces together first and then adding the screws later is because Epoxy is 100 times the glue of the day.  If the Epoxy gets on the screws and cures, the screws will never come out.  When using Epoxy, I glue and then add the screws after the glue has cured. 

Hugh

Edited January 17, 2020 by Hubert_25-25 (see edit history)

[Morgan Wright]

Back then, all they had was hide glue. They didn't even have casein glue yet. Hide glue always fails over time as it decomposes. 

[Bloo]

For what it's worth, Fisher used hide glue. There may have been some joints that were not glued and allowed to flex a little, but I think something like a door should be rigid. Hide glue is incredibly strong, and lasts practically forever under the right conditions. There is furniture from Tut's tomb that still has solid hide glue joints. The trouble is, the right conditions are just never going to exist in a car. Get it too wet it can come unglued. Get it too dry and it turns to powder and releases. There were finger joints in the doors of my Pontiac that Fisher drove a screw through sideways. There is no possible way that screw didn't weaken the joint. Fisher must have understood the hide glue would fail, and the screw would be needed to keep the joint from falling apart.

[Bloo]

2 hours ago, Morgan Wright said:

They didn't even have casein glue yet.

 

When did that come along?

[MG1927]

Thank You guys for the input, and thank you Hugh for the insight and details that you provided.

Marty

[Morgan Wright]

On 1/17/2020 at 7:22 PM, Bloo said:

 

When did that come along?

 

.

Casein glue came along in the 1930's, made by Borden's milk company about 6 miles from me. In the Civil War, Gail Borden invented canned condensed milk and set up a factory in Brewster, NY. They marketed the stuff with a cow named Elsie. Union soldiers won the war because they drank condensed milk. Then Borden's found out that milk/cheese protein made a strong glue, created the character Elmer, the husband of Elsie, because the glue was strong as a bull. Everybody started using it and calling it "white glue" and Borden's selling tons of it, then during WWII when somebody invented PVA (poly-vinyl-acetate), which is much stronger than casein glue, but is white, they sold the technology to Borden's who changed the formula of their "white glue" to PVA but kept Elmer as the mascot. The rest is history.

Edited January 19, 2020 by Morgan Wright (see edit history)

[Morgan Wright]

It's from the 1930's. Elmer's casein glue:

.

 

 

 

[1967 - 1997 Riviera]

 

The last time I had to repair something made of wood back together again (a trash bin), I used a Super Glue variation that was supposed to have some flex in the joint after it cured yet still remain tightly bonded together. I injected the glue into the pre-drilled holes,  put in the brass screws and used a clamp to hold it all together overnight. After more than a year of rough usage, it is holding tight.

 

So there must be some modern glues one can use that will solve both problems of the wood framing remaining bonded tight, yet not so rigidly that they won't flex a little bit.