Brooklyn Beer Posted September 11, 2018 Share Posted September 11, 2018 The working out of the bugs in the long sitting 1946 Dodge with fluid drive continues with what I am now guessing is a throw out bearing deciding to take a dirt nap. This past week it began making a growl when put in reverse but would go away when depressing the clutch. Did it about 6 times off and on during the week but never constant. It was put on the list of repairs. Tonight when driving into town to get some rare ethanol free gas it didn't growl in reverse and seemed fine. Then 8 miles from the house while cruising along at 55 in third gear it started a LOUD growl where upon I depressed the clutch to take it out of gear. Bam. clutch pedal planted to the floor with no return, yet no more growling. It stayed in third gear and thankfully being fluid drive and using a little skill I was able to nurse it home and into the garage. Have not been under yet to see what actually happened and I do not know when the last time it was serviced. Car sat for quite a few years and it had a little throw out growl the first week I had it but went away as I drove it. Always in reverse. I am new to fluid drive cars. Once I get it up on stands is there anything in particular I should be looking for other then the remains of the throw out bearing? And being I will be dropping this off for repair as I have no means to remove the transmission from the car here, I plan on just doing the full clutch replacement. Besides the throw out bearing, pressure plate, clutch disc, springs, etc is there anything else that should be replaced when it is out? And is there a supply house that offers such a complete kit? Thanks in advance, Chris near Fort Worth, TX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
61polara Posted September 11, 2018 Share Posted September 11, 2018 (edited) I don't think it's the throw out bearing. A bad throw out bearing makes a noise when the clutch is depressed not released. You will need to get under it and see what is going on. I'm thinking something in the clutch linkage let go, because the clutch is still engaged. Nice looking car! Edited September 11, 2018 by 61polara (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Beer Posted September 11, 2018 Author Share Posted September 11, 2018 Thank you ! Yes, the growl, noise, vibration would happen when in gear but stop when clutch pedal was depressed. Normally when in reverse. Once while in second. But that was when I first got the car and seemed to go away the more driven. This time at 55 mph was a first and was louder then what had happened before. Car did have a shudder begin to start (slippage?) as well last week I now remember when at low RPM starting out from second but went away at around 20 before shifting into third. It would not do it when taking off in third if coasting to a light at 25 mph and accelerating back up to speed though. Was a good firm normal feeling pedal with nothing that would make you think anything was wrong there. Thanks for taking the time and for the advice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 11, 2018 Share Posted September 11, 2018 VERY nice looking car! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JACK M Posted September 11, 2018 Share Posted September 11, 2018 It could be (or have been) a missing spring that would pull the bearing away from the clutch when driving. If that spring is missing the bearing could be bouncing off of the fingers on the pressure plate and the noise going away when loaded up via the pedal. But it sounds like something finally broke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Beer Posted September 11, 2018 Author Share Posted September 11, 2018 About to start tracking it down. I did not think about spring tension keeping pressure on the bearing so it stayed engaged. As long as this car sat the "shudder/chatter" at low rpm at take off I was thinking was slippage. Was becoming a nice vibration really. When the noise growl started, depressing the clutch made it go away instantly. What (if any) bearing would that be in a fluid drive clutch? It only made noise when in gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
61polara Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 Sounds like you need to look inside the transmission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinneyhill Posted September 12, 2018 Share Posted September 12, 2018 (edited) The transmission front or input pinion bearing might be rumbling a bit. My Dodge 8 rattles in neutral and becomes silent on depressing the clutch. I believe it is the front bearing, which I put in new and it did it from the day I put it in. The shudder on take off might be oil on the clutch plate, causing it to stick and release and stick and release.... = shudder. Edited September 12, 2018 by Spinneyhill (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Beer Posted September 12, 2018 Author Share Posted September 12, 2018 Thank you sir. As long as the car had sat and a couple of the other issues that I have had with it (linings falling off the brake shoes) I suspected that sooner then later a clutch issue would rear up. The noise I got wasn't so much a rattle as a growl you could feel in the clutch peddle. I am just going to bit the bullet and have the entire clutch replaced a couple months earlier then was planned. There is some oil leaks here and there as well that can be addressed during that time too. I was told there are 2 different sizes of clutch for that year but all I can find is one for the 6 cylinder car. It is a bone stock fluid drive car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 Fluid Drive used a smaller clutch than a manual trans car. You are only supposed to use the clutch to shift into gear then drive like an automatic. You are not supposed to slip it like a manual trans car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Beer Posted September 13, 2018 Author Share Posted September 13, 2018 Thank you sir for your time. Being the car sat for so long and I have no clue when any work was last preformed I am going to have the entire clutch assembly replaced. Pilot bushing, release bearing, springs, pressure plate, etc. I am pretty sure after reading up on driving a fluid drive it was not functioning properly as the car had a very hard time launching in first and slipped a bunch in 3rd. Shuddered in 2nd. So take off was always in 2nd and upshifted to third. Lots of chatter in 2nd. Have not gotten under the car yet to determine why the pedal was nailed to the floor. (I brought it back up by hand after getting home and it stays up but something is no longer engaged some place) Not knowing the last time it was replaced and how long it sat I am sure any number of parts in the assembly were no longer up to the task at hand. Watching a great vid on 1950 chrysler clutch repair (Period shop movie) has basically said it can one of a number of things in the clutch assembly itself so when it is apart, best to replace it all for piece of mind. They did say one thing and tell me if this how I heard it right. It could be the pilot bushing as the noise happened while in gear or worn or uneven levers not keeping pressure on the release bearing. Noise never came with pedal releasing the clutch and only while in gear. When the clutch pedal went out it was as a loud growl and vibration occurred in 3rd gear that was easily felt in the clutch pedal itself. When I depressed the pedal it stopped the noise but the pedal stayed rooted to the floor. It never disengaged the clutch and I nursed it home the 5 miles. When I pulled into the garage and stopped I heard a little growling again but nothing like it had done. The fluid drive unit worked fine at a couple stop lights launching the car while it was in 3rd gear as I was getting it home but I was making sure to take it easy and get her home so if anything was slipping I really wouldn't know.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 Some more things to look at.... Fluid Drive coupling bellows seal possibly leaking oil on the clutch.. You need to also look at the two input shaft bushings in the FD coupling ...check for excessive wear. You also need to check for the alignment of the clutch fork to throw out bearing... there is a ball stud pivot that can sometimes snap off. This will prevent proper clutch fork to release bearing operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Beer Posted September 13, 2018 Author Share Posted September 13, 2018 Thank you Bob. Wish I had a lift here at the house to do all this myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Beer Posted September 15, 2018 Author Share Posted September 15, 2018 OK, just done crawling around under the car and investigating and here is what I found using the shop manual as reference. The clutch fork rod was no longer sitting in the socket of the clutch release fork and the clutch release fork pull back spring was dangling from the release spring bracket, not attached to the fork. The fork itself is just slopping around all over the place like it is not attached to anything. Rest of linkage is attached and can shift freely by hand under the car. So what are folks idea's on what might have broke? The fork pivot? Being I never looked into it before it broke I am not sure if the fork is supposed to move freely of the pivot or if that fork is snug. When I mean the fork is slopping around under there I mean in all directions. And it is an oily mess. I thinking the rear main is leaking pretty bad. Can that be replaced with transmission out ? Thanks for the help ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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