56 Buick Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Hi all Just bought this car and really haven't had it on the road as I needed to repair the brakes. I have replaced wheel cylinders, pads and bled the hydraulic system. I note I followed the manual by bleeding the brakes closest to the master cylinder first - which is contrary to everything I was ever taught about bleeding brakes! Anyway, now I have never had a car of this vintage and perhaps I am too used to modern cars with power assisted discs but the brakes on the 56 are not what I expected. You really have to almost stand on the brake pedal and hold it down with some considerable force, my question is whether this is normal for the standard brakes (not power brakes)? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks Drew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD1956 Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Did you put new brake shoes on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56 Buick Posted July 1, 2018 Author Share Posted July 1, 2018 Yes, new shoes all round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56 Buick Posted July 1, 2018 Author Share Posted July 1, 2018 Essentially new wheel cylinders, shoes and fluid. Haven't touched the master cylinder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Drew, assuming a couple things here. If wrong, feel free to correct me. First time working on drum brakes? The shoes either need to be "ground" to fit the drums or worn in. Drive it a bit , using the brakes. Perhaps around the block a couple times, slightly riding the brakes. Pull a couple drums and observe the area, from wear pattern, of the brake pad contacting the drum. If this is good, i:e, most or total contact, the replacement shoes, or pads, may be hard long life ones. I like to use the softest material I can find. If contact area is as I suspect, small, the shoes can be seated in. Or, as stated earlier, worn in. Ben 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 COMMON PROBLEM that I had. Probably the number one reason people think they need to convert to disc brakes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Drew .. No you should not have to stand on the brake pedal to stop the car … first what you should only have to do is apply a steadily increasing pressure to the brake pedal from your knee downward and not simply your angle like you would do with a power brake setup … also important lastly you must set the drag on the brake shoe / drum surfaces once you reinstall the wheel by spinning the tire and by clicking the star expander/rod expanding it till the wheel as it is spinning creates an intermittent " shh-shh-shh-shh-shh " sound which is created by the shoe surface making contact on the inside surface of the drum itself …. You may also want to recheck the rod adjustment at the brake pedal / master cylinder rod plunger assuring you have the correct travel and free play in the pedal as per the specs found in the shop manual … - uncle dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 7 minutes ago, buick man said: You may also want to recheck the rod adjustment at the brake pedal / master cylinder rod plunger assuring you have the correct travel and free play in the pedal as per the specs found in the shop manual … Check ALL adjustments as outline in the service manual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56 Buick Posted July 1, 2018 Author Share Posted July 1, 2018 Yes first time working on drum brakes, so thanks for all the useful insights here.. Much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted July 2, 2018 Share Posted July 2, 2018 … no bad Drew just follow the manual …. standard brakes are brain dead simple … put the components on, reinstall the drum … adjust shoe drag as explained above … bleed the brakes as per manual and your set to go .. take some short stop runs and if one side is pulling … go to that wheel jack it up readjust the shoe drum drag and take it for another short stop run … the brake pedal should have a slight 1-2 inch drop as you apply the pedal and should get firm about 3/4 down and a good 5 inches from the floor and the psi from your leg should not be strenuous at all but smooth and firm ….. - uncle dave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56 Buick Posted July 6, 2018 Author Share Posted July 6, 2018 I went for a drive today after adjusting each brake so you can just hear the shoe touching here and there as the wheel spins. The good news is that the car stops but the brakes still don't seem to pull up perhaps as they should...maybe the shoes are not yet seated. Of course I haven't touched the master cylinder, is it possible that is the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beemon Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 Are you losing fluid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packick Posted July 7, 2018 Share Posted July 7, 2018 Drew, a tip from a knuckle-busting mechanic. Don't forget to adjust the eccentrics. This will ensure both shoes in each drum make contact at the same time. Maybe you only have one shoe in each drum making contact. The Shop Manual gives step-by-step instructions on how make this adjustment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56 Buick Posted July 7, 2018 Author Share Posted July 7, 2018 I can't see any loss of fluid in the MC level so theoretically the MC should be good. I thought the eccentrics of the shoes were dealt with by the star wheel nut/pin and the fact the bottom of the shoes effectively float but I can look into that. I did see a post on Jalopy Journal and someone there was referring to the same problem and noted the shoes just did not seat themselves for about 100 miles and then the brakes began to work properly. Having pulled the drums it does appear not all the shoe face is contacting the drum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packick Posted July 7, 2018 Share Posted July 7, 2018 Drew: I could be wrong but I believe using only the star wheel would only center the bottom of the shoes; the top of one shoe could still not be making contact with the drum. A correct eccentric adjustment, however, would center both shoes in the drum and ensure that the entire surface of both shoes would make contact with the drum, especially if both shoes were arced to the drum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted July 7, 2018 Share Posted July 7, 2018 On 7/1/2018 at 10:52 AM, old-tank said: Check ALL adjustments as outlined in the service manual. 21 hours ago, packick said: Drew, a tip from a knuckle-busting mechanic. Don't forget to adjust the eccentrics. This will ensure both shoes in each drum make contact at the same time. Maybe you only have one shoe in each drum making contact. The Shop Manual gives step-by-step instructions on how make this adjustment. We don't do like sick computers: "I want to skip this step and try something else". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56 Buick Posted July 8, 2018 Author Share Posted July 8, 2018 I read the manual again. Loosening and adjusting the anchor pin sets the eccentrics. I certainly missed that previously. I will give it a go. Thanks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 On 7/7/2018 at 8:18 PM, 56 Buick said: I read the manual again. Loosening and adjusting the anchor pin sets the eccentrics. I certainly missed that previously. I will give it a go. Thanks. I was thinking about this post as I drove my 54 this weekend. As I pressed the pedal hard for a bit of a panic stop the Buick nosed in as the drum braking action took hold. I have manual brakes. I see you noted not all of the brake shoe was contacting the drum. Check the eccentrics as you read about. These drums, that are not as good as discs, do stop these 2 ton cars to good effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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