Oldtimelampshop Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 Hi. What is the correct colors and shades to paint the engine bay?kanter sells green but not in a spray can. Anyone know where I can get spray cans?what color is the green and is it gloss?how about the black: fan, generator, radiator, etc. is it gloss or flat or satin?and Packard intake and exhaust manifold color?im ready to start cleaning and painting a few itemsthanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bkazmer Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 not sure why you are looking for spray, as the Hirsch/Kanter paint levels to a factory finish (engine blocks were not finished like fenders).The 356 is greenMost 288/327 were gray. Some say all, but I've seen what I believe to be original engines in green. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimelampshop Posted August 12, 2014 Author Share Posted August 12, 2014 TThanks it's easier for me to prep and use a spray can to paint the engine. Are you saying the original engines were brush painted? I'm confused. I had not seen gray anywhere. I have a 327 and want to get close to original so important to understand if I'm painting Gray or Green. But I'm not making a point car just a nice local car show cruiser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bkazmer Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 I'm not saying they were brush painted - I am saying they were not buffed to a high sheen like one sometimes sees. Go over to PackardInfo site for more on this. But yes, gray was common on the "small block" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrpushbutton Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 As much as it pains me to say this, Packards International has it all over PAC in this area, I would check with them for one of their judging guides, they actually take the silly game out of authenticity with their judging guides, they outline what they consider to be the original finishes for all of the various under hood bits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HH56 Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 If you don't want to mess with setting up and cleaning a professional gun, buy one of the disposable spray setups for around $10. I used the 8oz Crown Spra-Tool and it did a more than commendable job doing my 47 engine using the quart can of Hirsch green. They are available at many paint and hardware stores as well as McMaster-Carr. The paint needs to be thinned slightly but went on smoothly and covered well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packard Don Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 As far as the engine bay itself, it's body color and the engine accessories like oil filter, starter, air cleaner etc. are black although I've seen show cars with them painted engine color but it just looks odd that way to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 I have been using ValSpar Satin Black Polyurethane for frames, chassis parts, and under hood items for a couple of decades. It has just the right gloss and is really durable.My '64 Riviera got the treatment in 1994 with an expoxy primer subcoat and still looks great.Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD in KC Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 There were some green engines for the early 1948 356's but... officially [for judging purposes] they should all be gray. All three of my 356's, one 1948, and two 1949's were gray from the factory. The black bits are semi-gloss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimelampshop Posted August 13, 2014 Author Share Posted August 13, 2014 Thanks everyone. I guess gray it is. Good thought on the sprayer, will think about that, but may check if an off the shelf engine gray is available pending close match to the original gray? I'm looking online for engine pictures showing the shade of gray now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozstatman Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 One place to start looking is BigKev's Blog on PackardInfo. Pictures of painted engine start on Page 4.http://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?viewmode=flat&type=&topic_id=57&forum=10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packard Don Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 One place to start looking is BigKev's Blog on PackardInfo. Pictures of painted engine start on Page 4.http://packardinfo.com/xoops/html/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?viewmode=flat&type=&topic_id=57&forum=10I've been really enjoying the blog above, which I had not seen before. I'm skimming some of it but am looking in detail at the photos and repair details and see that he has done an excellent job and especially in setting up his shop. On the car itself, some small things I would have done a bit differently but that's just me, being basically lazy. For example, I would have bought pre-bent steel or SS fuel, oil and brake lines as they are being properly reproduced with all the correct bends but maybe they were not available then when the work was being done and those he made look good.Someone else had made a comment to not use stainless for certain things but they might not be aware that there are many grades of stainless so maybe his history with it involved an inappropriate type for the job. Some stainless is quite soft while others are more brittle although the latter also often have more iron in them, making them hard but also less resistant to corrosion. As a journeyman toolmaker (prototype machinist), I worked with many different types during my career.However, back to the topic, presuming the photos or my display depict the engine color accurately, it looks many shades too dark to have been the original engine color so it might not be the best guide for this answer. It looks good, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD in KC Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 (edited) The paint used in the aforementioned PackardInfo.com blog came from Bill Hirsch. There has been a great deal of debate over which gray shade is closest to to the original Packard engine gray. I got my paint from Kanter and it appears to be lighter with less brown added. Since I have some Kanter gray left over for convenient matching, my next engine will probably get painted with the closest match I can find at the local auto parts store. Edited August 15, 2014 by JD in KC (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 We have at least 4 partial quarts of "Packard Engine Green" from the above mentioned sources. No 2 match each other exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen_Dyneto Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 Just as the Packard green varied a bit from time to time (generally the earlier prewar cars having a darker green) and have no doubt the gray varied a bit as well from time to time. Crane Gray is what Packard used on their factory-reconditioned cylinder bores for the 320 and 385 engines in the 30s and is probably similar to what they used later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packard Don Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 (edited) Just as the Packard green varied a bit from time to time (generally the earlier prewar cars having a darker green) and have no doubt the gray varied a bit as well from time to time. Crane Gray is what Packard used on their factory-reconditioned cylinder bores for the 320 and 385 engines in the 30s and is probably similar to what they used later.I'm sure that's true as my 359 engine color varied a bit between two cans. On the grey, I used Bill Hirsch's paint and I would expect some variation but based on the photos it was many shades darker, not just a slight mixing difference, and closer to what I've seen over the counter in auto parts stores. Here is a photo of my 1952 Henney-Packard Nu-3-Way engine which was in good low mileage condition and the paint I added closely matched what was originally on the engine.Sorry that the photo is rather small as it was scanned from a snapshot but when I find the negatives I'll upload a better image. In the background is a 1951 Henney-Packard combination getting ready for a rear axle assembly swap. Edited August 15, 2014 by Packard Don Adding more details (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimelampshop Posted August 15, 2014 Author Share Posted August 15, 2014 Was the Intake Manifold painted engine color? Or same as exhaust manifold. Or was exhaust simply raw cast when new. Thanks all. This info is helpful. My goal was to match a close auto store spray off the shelf. I believe I can. There is a few grays and some state Ford but one seems close to JD in KC engine color. I will move forward with that and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packard Don Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 My 1952 which has the 327 5-main engine was originally black but I've seen them either black or a silver color on various show cars. They were not engine color, however, as they require a special very high temperature paint and engine paint would burn right off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HH56 Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 You might also look thru Massey Ferguson tractor engine grays. Some have mentioned that one of those is a close match but didn't say which one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 Wasn't there one base shade in both gray and green with 4 varying tints that were incrementally darker for each ten thousandths of piston or rod deviation from the standard?Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen_Dyneto Posted August 15, 2014 Share Posted August 15, 2014 Where did you ever hear that crazy story? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimelampshop Posted August 15, 2014 Author Share Posted August 15, 2014 Thanks for note on Intake I didn't think it would get as hot as the Exhaust manifold. So I will paint both the same with a silver header paint. Dad and I first have to get the engine running so I'm painting parts while I assemble then we will go back after and degrease entire engine to paint it as a whole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Someone was pulling my leg?Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packard Don Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Sounds like it and it sure gave me a laugh!On the colors, keep in mind that manufacturers didn't usually paint individual covers and other engine pieces separately as it took too much time so something like manifolds would have been painted as an assembled unit. That quasi rule-of-thumb might make it easier to determine what was which color. Accessories, for example, added after the engine was assembled and painted would be black and many had decals applied to them, reproductions of which are available from different Packard parts houses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimelampshop Posted August 16, 2014 Author Share Posted August 16, 2014 Well the engine paint is good for around 500 F where header is 1200F. So would the Packard intake manifold reach more than 500 to burn the paint off? I've painted small and large block chevy V8 engines and the engine paint held up on the manifolds. Sometimes it would darken in color from heat but not fall off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen_Dyneto Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 You should have no problem with paint holding up on intake manifolds with exception of the exhaust gas pass-thru on the V8 engines of 55/56. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimelampshop Posted August 16, 2014 Author Share Posted August 16, 2014 Thanks that was my thought originally. But with some of the posts, I then wondered if due to it being so close to the exhaust manifold if it did get more hot and could cause issue. Im not making a point car. But to me esthetics is important. I just think it would look better engine color than same as exh.manifold. In still trying to leave the Intent of factory look when people look in my engine bay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HH56 Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Several have also used the POR 15 gray manifold paint. That has a nice fresh cast iron look and seems to hold up well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packard Don Posted August 16, 2014 Share Posted August 16, 2014 Whatever kind of paint can be used on a manifold, Packard did not use engine color because both exhaust and intake were painted as a single unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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