Price/value advice needed.

[Guest ken bogren]

I haven't talked to the seller of this car yet.

I know it's hard to give this kind of advice, but I'm just trying to get a general idea if a price is close to reasonable or no not.

A few years ago I saw a 1923 Buick at a show and afterward became interested in owning it or one like it. I've been looking for the last 5 years, I finally found one, might even be the same car, not sure.

I'd describe the car I saw as a mid-3 in condition, serviceable but not really show quality, except possibly in some "survivor" class.

So the Old Cars Price Guide says about $8,000.00 - 9,500.00 depending on the exact model (which I don't know for sure, but I think it's the 4 cylinder series).

I looked at the NADA guide and it only goes back to 1926. It lists a 26 model at around 11, 12,000.00. Not much help, but as close as I've come so far.

I don't have a real sense of whether either end of that price range is reasonable for a running, drivable 1923 4 door sedan in a number 3 condition.

The interior and top seem to be fair condition. There is some issues with the paint, but no real obvious rust issues on the body that I can see in the photos on the website where I found the car, but the seller did mention the paint issues.

[Paul Dobbin]

Your price range of $8,000 to $12,000 sounds reasonable, but it's condition that establishes value and without knowing the model, engine, color, upholstery, glass, etc, etc. with pictures and hearing it run, the range is all anybody can offer.

Good luck. If you like it and the seller will take what you think it's worth, then both of you will be happy and that's it's value at the moment.

[490touring]

The magazine sections at bookstores have classic car price guides that go back further than NADA, also, I believe Hemmings has an online guide.

[Guest ken bogren]

I looked at Hemmings, they list 4, 23 Buicks at the moment, priced from 9500.00 to about 15,500 or so. But those are all open cars. The online value thing seems to be tied to current ads? Is that right?

I'm not really tuned into prewar cars, but I'm guessing a similar condition open car would be worth more than a sedan

Right?

[caddyshack]

Ken, if you have been looking for five years and finally found one, I would say buy it now. It might take another five years to find another. The price range is realistic. How many times have we paid to much and regretted it? Does it really matter? The chase is about over. The condition sounds good. If the seller agrees with your offer and you both are comfortable with the outcome, buy it. Sounds like a heck of a find. Just my opinion.

The snow is coming so do it soon.

[Guest ken bogren]

Well I found another ad for this car, so I know it's a 4 cylinder model

I'm going to go see it in the next couple of days.

(anyone know how tall these cars are? I'm wondering if it will go thru a 7 foot tall garage door?)

[60FlatTop]

The purchase price is just the "Entry Fee". Once the car is yours the real spending starts. If it is truly a condition 3 you will have $8,000 to $10,000 before you achieve a condition where you can have a sharp car and go on a hundred mile trip without issues.

A friend of mine once told me I shouldn't tell potential purchasers things like that. He said if they knew that they probably wouldn't buy the car.

I do know that "Entry Fees" for convertibles are only slightly higher and the refurbishing costs are about the same.

Bernie

[old car fan]

You can have a good #3 without spending 8 to 10 grand ,good reliable cars are fun,If it is need of restoration,restore it ,otherwise without pics, we wont know,make it drivable,and have fun.I love dusty ,early cars.make that car your own.Spend the cash on getting it safe,drive the wheels off of it

[Guest etolen]

Ken,

I don't know anything about a 23 Buick, but my 25 Oakland is 6'-4" from floor to top of roof. No problem with getting it through a standard garage door, but if your car is that tall and you have or get an enclosed trailer, you need to get one that has a little extra height and the door is taller than the standard height. I believe that most standard height enclosed trailers only have a door opening that is 6'-2".

HTH

[Guest ken bogren]

Well I saw the car today. Paint is worse than I anticpated. The lower body/hood/cowl would need to be painted. Fenders and upper body seem fine, not show quality really, but decent driver/cruise-in quality.

The roof seems fine.

The front seat has been reupholstered sometime and doesn't match the rest of the upholstery, color is close, but pattern isn't.

The headliner is not ripped up, but sags a bit. I wionder if there should be cross bows supporting it?

The running boards have been replaced with painted plywood, so that needs work.

The glass is another thing I'm not sure about. The windshield appears to be original, which I think is not safety glass. Would the side glass on a 1923 car be tempered like on a modern car? One side window has about a 6 inch long crack across a lower corner. The windows seemed to go up and down fine. None of the windows had any frosting around the edges that I noticed.

The whitewall tires look good, wood wheels looked ok as far as I could tell. There is no spare tire or rim though.

The engine fire right up and ran nicely. Oil pressure held at about 40.

Other than the paint, the body seems to be very straight and solid, even with the flaking paint, I couldn't find any obvious rust. I suspect the car was repainted sometime ago and the primer surface wasn't prepped well enogh so the color coat is flaking off in spots.

The car is about 6'2" tall so getting it through a regular garage door is no problem.

Oh yeah, the car has no bumpers, I'd want to get a set of bumpers promptly.

[Marty Roth]

The 1923 Buick 4-cylinder 4-door sedan was the Model 23-37. It had a production run of 8,885 for domestic sales, and one special export right hand drive model; cost $1,395, and weighed 2,875 pounds, used a Fisher body on a standard 4-cylinder 109" wheelbase chassis. The engine, as in 1922, was 3-3/8 x 4.75 inch bore and stroke with 18.23 SAE horsepower from 170 cubic inches. Bumpers were an optional accessory.... all according to "Seventy Years of Buick" by George H. Dammann.

Try looking at this site for Pre-war Buicks:

Buick Club of America Pre-War Di

hope this helps..

Marty

Edited November 11, 2011 by Marty Roth (see edit history)

[old car fan]

They are old cars ,buy it ,drive it and enjoy it .Put cash in it when you can

[Guest bofusmosby]

Marty

On the 3rd photo, it's an odd use for a fire extinguisher.

[skyler]

jim, that seems to be a popular spot to put fire extinguishers at a judged car show that requires one. i would forget and run it over. skyler

[Chris Bamford]

...The glass is another thing I'm not sure about. The windshield appears to be original, which I think is not safety glass. Would the side glass on a 1923 car be tempered like on a modern car? One side window has about a 6 inch long crack across a lower corner. The windows seemed to go up and down fine. None of the windows had any frosting around the edges that I noticed...

None of that glass, if original, would be "safety" glass, either laminated safety glass like a modern windshield or tempered safety glass like a modern side window.

Any window with a crack is not tempered glass, as tempered will shatter, not crack.

Frosting around the edges is indicative of laminated safety glass that has deteriorated.

[Guest ken bogren]

Bamfords Garage

Thanks for the info. That's pretty much what I thought, but I wasn't sure, so I really appreciate your help.

[dibarlaw]

Ken:

Check my Thread on the BUICK Pre-War General site "Looking for a driver Buick" about my misadventures!

Larry

[Guest ken bogren]

Hi Larry;

I read that thread the other day. Lots of interesting stuff in it.

[Guest ken bogren]

Well, it's been a tough choice, but I've decided not to chase this car, as much as I'd like to own it.

It's too nice to tear apart and do right,which I probably couldn't afford anyhow. And it needs more than I could justify to make it safe to drive (in my opinion) and otherwise restore, money again.

Might be a great car for someone with more DIY skills, and more money for this sort of thing.