Frame fiinsh on my '53 roadmaster

[53buickconvert]

I have finally got my Roadmaster body off the frame and onto the rotiserie that I built. I have now sandblasted the frame and I am wondering if someone can recommend the finish on the frame, inner fender walls and engine compartment. Satin, semi-gloss, I am not sure what the original was. I would appreciate any suggestions.:confused:

[Pete Phillips]

Semi-gloss black is correct. As far as I know, "satin" and "semi-gloss" are the same. I'm sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.

Pete Phillips, BCA #7338

Sherman, TX

[Guest Earl]

Satin has less gloss than Semi-Gloss. Eggshell will be in between the two, and flat would be like a chalk board. Hope that helps.

[JohnD1956]

I don't think you lose points if the finish is too glossy, however, I would use the POR 15 Frame paint if it were my car. Especially if I planned to drive it after the restoration. That stuff is durable.

[Guest Earl]

You can get a flattening agent for paint to add to it if it has too much gloss. I would think it will work in that POR 15 paint as well as that must be an oil based product. I doubt the flattener will work in a water based product. I painted a frame once for a '50 Chevy pickup that I sandblasted out in the back yard. I just put black floor paint on it and added Penetrol. It was oil based paint and I would have done this in the late 80's. As all restoration projects go it took much longer than I though and ended up being out in the back yard for about 5-6 years here in Iowa. After my Dad died I sold the truck unfinished and you know, after being out there all that time it still was not rusting. I don't know what Penetrol does to oil based paint, but it sure makes it hold up a lot better. I'd still go with the POR stuff, but always kind of wondered about that "experiment". And I looked that thing all over before it left to see where all it was rusting through. No primer either, go figure!

[JohnD1956]

Interesting information Earl. I'm not certain you'd need to flatten the POR 15. I think it comes in a satin finish already. Also I understand it can ( and should) be painted on with a brush. I'd still prime it before topcoating but supposedly the POR products will settle out to a smooth finish from brush strokes. Unfortunatley it must be noted: I only have limited first hand experience with this, so please correct me folks.

[Guest Earl]

That was why the old rubbing varnishes were slow to dry, it gave them time to level out and "fill in" low spots in the wood. They used to call them "self leveling". So many of the finishes dry so fast today that they don't give you time to work with them and get them brushed out. The POR stuff probably sticks better if it's brushed as the helps work the paint down onto the surface of whatever you are putting it on. If you brush out the paint on your house, it will stick better. Those airless paint guns are nice for getting the material where you want it on a house, but you should still brush it out once it's up where you want it.

[Bob Engle]

I've had good luck with the Eastwood chassis blacks.. If youdon't have a spray gun, you can use their aeresol cans. They can be purchased in gloss of satin so no need to mix. They also sell a rust encapsulator that I use as a primer to seal all the riveted joints on the frame.

Bob

[Guest martylum]

Hi-I'm restoring a 53 Buick Skylark on which the body and chassis began life at Buick as a 53 Roadmaster convertible. Thanks to an early zealous owner, the chassis and body underfloor was completely sprayed with undercoating preserving the original chassis paint.

Heating and scraping off the undercoating revealed the original paint finish in a low gloss black with the original stenciled chassis part # and build date on the outer frame rail under the driver's door. I'm planning to repaint the chassis and suspension with a semi-gloss black acrylic enamel undercoated with epoxy primer. It's hard to tell at this point what gloss level may have been lost to the undercoating but feel a semi-gloss will capture the spirit of the original finish quality. There was no primer coat under the black paint so I'm overrestoring by priming with epoxy primer but the better adhesion qualities of the primer and better gloss holdout on the black paint outweigh the overrestoration issues for me. Yes, I will be making a new stencil and restencilling in white paint as original. The stencil details include the car model, chassis part #, and build date of the chassis. I guess this stencil could be made to fit any 53 Buick by altering the data.

Where primer was used, it's all a rusty red enamel primer. Too bad Buick didn't do a more thorough job on the inside floorpans which had only a very thin coat of red primer-no body paint. The only remaining inner floor primer is undr the rear seat where no moisture holding carpet underlay was used.

Since the whole underside of the floor was sprayed at some time with undercoating, I'm left wondering how much, if any, of the underfloor was undercoated for sound deadening purposes. Anybody have an original car from 53 which hasn't had the undercoating treatment?

Martin Lum

53 Skylark

[Yellowriv]

Martin,

I have an original 53 Super Riviera 56R which has never been painted underneath. Mine has no underseal and the outer floor edges are body colour (Osage Cream). I'm wondering though if the underside finish depends on the plant where the car was built. Mine was built in California.

I know from my Mustang days that California cars didn't have underseal while east coast cars did. Anyone know?

I will try to post some photos over the next couple of days.

John

[Guest martylum]

John thanks for the observations. My underfloor still has a fair amount of the original paint and it is a black enamel primer. But it seems to me there is an area in the back floor where the paint color might be red. Guess I'll need to take another look. Since it's a Skylark there's a fair amount of white overspray on the areas underneath near the wheel openings as the 4 wheel opening areas were sprayed white on this blue car.

I think any undercoating sprayed on the bottom side in this era was for sound deadening rather than concerns about rustout. The whole top floor of my 55 Desoto is sprayed with a fairly thick coating of undercoating from the factory.

On the road, it makes for a very quiet car. These cars seldom have floor rust problems. Wish Buick had done the same.

If I understand you correctly, there was no undercoating anywhere on the underfloors. Does this apply to the wheelwell areas as well? I'm going to have to refinish all these areas sometime in the next year and would like to get it right.

I made an attempt to attach a pic of the chassis with stencil-did it work? Stay tuned.

Martin Lum

Martin Lum

[Guest martylum]

John-thanks for your observations on your 53 Buick underbody finish. I think any factory applied undercoating would have been applied for sound deadening purposes so it should have been uniform from one factory to another.

I'm hoping that a picture of my LH frame rail just under the driver's door attached to this letter. If it did, it will show the factory or frame manufactuer's stencil for my 53 skylark and the surrounding original black paint which is certainly very low gloss at this point. the top # is the factory part numer for the frame rail. Bottom left is the number for a Buick Roadmaster convertible chassis-76C which is how my car's life began. The bottom right # is the build date for the frame rail. It seems to be May 16, 53.

If I understand you correctly, your car underfloor had no undercoating anywhere? Is this also the case for the wheel wells front and rear and the detachable splash pans in these wheelwells?

thanks again.

Martin Lum

[BillMadden]

I have used POR-15 and can offer some advice. Once a can is opened don't expect to get the lid off again after it is opened, unless it is cleaned meticulously. I had an occasion once when the lid could not even be removed at the counter of the store where I bought it. Also, if you used it in a paint gun there could be the same problem, if it wasn't cleaned well enough.

NOTE: I used the silver on the inside of my newly chromed bumpers too, and on the gas tank.

Bill

[buick5563]

Marty,

I'm doing the same thing during the restoration of my 55. When I uncovered the frame number on mine, it was on the passengers side and upside down. I couldn't get a good pic of mine. I like the details.

[Bhigdog]

I have used POR-15 and can offer some advice. Once a can is opened don't expect to get the lid off again after it is opened, unless it is cleaned meticulously. I had an occasion once when the lid could not even be removed at the counter of the store where I bought it. Also, if you used it in a paint gun there could be the same problem, if it wasn't cleaned well enough.

NOTE: I used the silver on the inside of my newly chromed bumpers too, and on the gas tank.

Bill

There is a way to save and reuse the contents. Instead of removing the cans lid, turn it upside down and punch two ice pick size holes in the bottom. Pour what you think you will need out, clean the area around the holes well and seal them with two layered squares of geen masking tape. I have a can I've been stealing from for almost a year. Once you remove the lid you are done. Use it up quickly or throw it away...............Bob

[msmazcol]

We just received a quart of Eastwoods 2K ceramic satin chassis paint. Did a quick spray out card and like what we see. It is a product that uses an activator which means it will chemically cure when properly mixed. After pondering the finish for a Divco chassis I'm working on I think we have a winner. The frame has been sandblasted, epoxy primed and any and all pits filled. We'll apply another coat of epoxy primer after a scuff and then go to a wet on wet application of the Eastwood ceramic. The finish will be durable and seems to wipe clean easily. Its not too shiny but also not flat which can be a nightmare to clean.

They also claim very resistant to gas etc. on the Eastwood stuff. Too many other frame paints are just old school thinking, just a form of a soft enamel type finish. While this is better than many car builders ever used under their vehicles we were looking for a step better.

A quart of the Eastwood ceramic sells for around $60 with the activator.

Best of luck.

[Yellowriv]

Martin,

Here are some photos of the underside of my Riv. As you can see there is no underseal. Hope these help. I can provide more detailed shots if you require.

Regards

John

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[Guest martylum]

John-thanks loads for your pictures. It would appear you've added a trans. cooler just behind the transmission. Did you do this to solve a problem with the dynaflow unit? My 56 Buick Century has some problems with trans. leakage over the Winter even tho I've had the unit rebuilt. I've come to expect this problem in auto trans. cars as it been a problem with 3-4 of my 50s cars. In the Spring adding 1-2 qts of trans fluid seems to solve the problem for the Summer.

Martin Lum

53 Skylark

[Guest martylum]

Further puzzling information on my 53 Skylark project-I scraped aftermarket undercoat off the entire underfloor revealing the original black chassis and underfloor paint. When i removed the fuel tank, it appeared the trunk floor above the tank was unpainted altogether. Could the chassis have been painted after the tank and body was installed? It doesn't seem like a logical assembly sequence but how to explain the absence of paint above the tank? I would also expect the tank to show black overspray around the edges. Wonder what's on the trunk underfloor under your gas tank John?

Marty Lum

53 Buick Skylark

[Yellowriv]

Marty,

The trans cooler was added before I got the car, so don't know if there was an issue with cooling, the Dynaflow has been rebuilt and seems fine - I gather the moan is fairly standard for these?

As to the underfloor, I'll have a good look next week and try to provide some more detailed photos. Generally from what I can see there isn't much paint on the floor.

I have just finished sorting out the heating system, wipers and washers. The underseat heater matrix is a work of art.

regards

John

[bhclark]

The underseat heater matrix is a work of art.

regards

John

That's what I thought when I started to replace heater hoses on my '58.

I asked for 20 feet of heater hose and the guy behind the counter said "Working on an old Buick, huh?"