Engine oil

[Guest gwatkins]

On a '24 Sedan is there no dipstick? All we can find is a little "bobbing" rod on the left side of the block. Is this an oil level indicator? If so, how is it used? I see no markings on it to indicate levels.

On a related question, I've seen some discussions about detergent vs non-detergent oils. As I recall, when dropping the oil pan if there's sludge accumulated that indicates a non-detergent oil has been used and one should not switch to detergent. Is that correct and still the prevailing opinion?

We plan to do an oil change asap and want to use the most appropriate oil.

Also, (and this may sound dumb but we don't yet have manuals so please bear with me,) is the oil filter mounted under the front of the engine? I assume it's an insert type rather than a spin-on and is available from Romar or Meyer?

Thanks,

Gordon Watkins

[Phil 32DL6]

Even if you were to clean up all of the crud in the pan there'd be a lot more lurking in cracks and crevices throughout the engine. Detergent oil would eventually loosen that up potentially causing major problems.

The only safe way to make the switch would be to completely strip and clean the whole engine.

I find 30W ND readily available locally.

Edited October 7, 2009 by Phil 32DL6 (see edit history)

[Guest oldodgeboys]

No oil filter. There is a small screen behind the oil pick up tube at the oil pan. You have to take the bolt(s) off anyway to drain the oil, so pull the screen off at the same time.

[Joe Cozza]

Hi all,

I asked that same question when I got my 23.

I drained the oil where the oil pick up tube is, cleaned the screen and stuck my finger in the hole and scraped as much crud I could out. then I filled the engine with the proper amt. of oil (5to6 qts) and measured the height of the "oil gauge" which is 2 inches.

[Guest oldodgeboys]

There are also two horizontal lines cast onto the block...the stick tip should be between the lines. That's what I was advised, but when you see how far the lines are apart, i wonder about that.

Cleaning out the oil pan: When I stuck my finger in the first time I wasn't sure I was going to get my finger back! When I took the pan off there was at least 4 inches of muck everywhere.

[Joe Cozza]

oldodgeboys

I know what your talking about. When I stuck my finger in I was hoping nothing was going to bite me

[dwollam]

5 quarts is the correct amount and will put the float halfway between the 2 casting bumps. Think of the bumps as "add oil" on the dipstick for the bottom one and "do not over fill" as the top one. I won't go into the detergent vs non detergent debate except that I run detergent in everything, new or used with never a problem. But DO drop the pan and clean the muck out regardless.

[FMF]

My '25 has 43,000 original miles -- engine never rebuilt.

I use 40W non-detergent and change it once a year in July.

I drive it approx. 250 - 300 miles/year.

[Guest oldodgeboys]

I'm no oil expert, but my understanding is that (petroleum) oil oxidizes regardless of actual use. That's why it's recommended to change oil based on miles or time, not only miles.

These old engines have poor temperature regulation and poor crankcase ventilation. Water/humidity gets into the oil easily, but thorough engine warm ups and long drives help prevent oxidation.

I change the oil twice a year on my '25, which is about 800 miles per oil change.

[fraso]

gwatkins said:

On a related question, I've seen some discussions about detergent vs non-detergent oils. As I recall, when dropping the oil pan if there's sludge accumulated that indicates a non-detergent oil has been used and one should not switch to detergent. Is that correct and still the prevailing opinion?

We plan to do an oil change asap and want to use the most appropriate oil.

If detergent oil were available back in 1924, Dodge would have specified it. If you have a severely sludged-up engine, a detergent engine oil will help to remove the contaminants. Heavy Duty Engine Oil (HDEO) is cheap (especially 15W-40 grades) and you can change it at the first sign it is starting to thicken-up. Continuing to use an HDEO once the sludge has been removed will help keep it clean.

About scraping out sludge build-up, I would be concerned about have a chunk fall into the engine. I think engine cleaners (like Auto-Rx, Exxon System Cleaner, and Lube Control LC20) would be more effective.

Chrysler Engine Oil Recommendations

Edited January 22, 2017 by fraso
Link Update (see edit history)

[Guest occrj]

Rather than start a new thread....

5 quarts is the correct amount and will put the float halfway between the 2 casting bumps. Think of the bumps as "add oil" on the dipstick for the bottom one and "do not over fill" as the top one. I won't go into the detergent vs non detergent debate except that I run detergent in everything, new or used with never a problem. But DO drop the pan and clean the muck out regardless.

I was curious about checking the oil level on my '24, so thanks for the info, I'll check out the two horizontal lines/casting bumps.

I've got "classic" 20w/50 and straight 30 (non-detergent) on the shelf, which is preferable? I'd be interested to know what grade(s) were used when these cars were current.

thanks, Richard.

[platt-deutsch]

I have 25 with 14,000 original miles. I use 20/50 Castrol Detergent oil.

[MikeC5]

One other thing I've read is that detergent oils are designed to keep dirt particles in suspension so they will make their way to the oil filter and thereby get removed. A non-detergent oil doesn't do this (a matter of degree, I suspect) and the crud falls to the oil pan where it hopefully stays. All I can say is when I removed and cleaned out the oil pan, it sure had a nasty layer of muck stuck to it but the crankcase didn't look too bad. None of that heavy sludge I used to find in valve covers/heads on OHV engines (with insufficient oil changes).

[fraso]

Modern engine oils have to meet many performance specifications in addition to keeping engines clean. The latest passenger car motor oil (PCMO) specification is service category API SN while the latest heavy duty engine oil (HDEO) specification is API CJ-4. HDEOs often have dual specifications so that they meet the performance requirements of PCMO as well (eg, API CJ-4/SM) which means that they are suitable in both gasoline and diesel engines. Every service category includes the performance requirements of the previous categories.

An important component of a detergent engine oil is its detergent and dispersant additives. Detergents act on surfaces to lift deposits to keep them suspended. Dispersants keeps suspended deposits in solution. Non-detergent engine oils (API SA & SB) obviously do not contain detergent/dispersant additives.

 

Additives XII-Multifunctional additives

Impact of Low Quality Oils on Engine Wear and Sludge Deposits

Edited January 22, 2017 by fraso
Link Update (see edit history)

[Guest occrj]

5 quarts is the correct amount and will put the float halfway between the 2 casting bumps. Think of the bumps as "add oil" on the dipstick for the bottom one and "do not over fill" as the top one. I won't go into the detergent vs non detergent debate except that I run detergent in everything, new or used with never a problem. But DO drop the pan and clean the muck out regardless.

I re-filled my 24 today, the instruction manual says 4.25 US quarts (=4 litres), which doesn't sound a great to me for a 3.5 litre engine. The oil rod is approx 1.5 ins above the flat level of the casting that it pokes up from, should I be bringing it up to 5 quarts, as per the post above?

thanks, Richard

[MikeC5]

I had never noticed those casting marks for oil level on the block. Thanks for the tip!

[TonyAus]

I re-filled my 24 today, the instruction manual says 4.25 US quarts (=4 litres), which doesn't sound a great to me for a 3.5 litre engine. The oil rod is approx 1.5 ins above the flat level of the casting that it pokes up from, should I be bringing it up to 5 quarts, as per the post above?

thanks, Richard

Keep the top of the rod half way between the marks. I found that any higher will result in the oil being thrown out the top of the engine breather. About five litres of Penrite Shelsley Medium gives me this result.

[platt-deutsch]

I formed a cone shaped screen and put it in the top half of my breather/filler.. end of the oil coming out of it. I just lift it out when adding oil.. I think they may have come originally with a screen of some kind in there..

[MikeC5]

Mine does have a cone shaped screen in there although it's a pretty coarse mesh (it's really more like a punched holes than a screen). I was thinking of adding some steel wool on top of this to add some surface area for oil vapor to condense on. My JD lawn tractor has something like steel wool in the oil breather.

[1936 D2]

Mine does have a cone shaped screen in there although it's a pretty coarse mesh (it's really more like a punched holes than a screen). I was thinking of adding some steel wool on top of this to add some surface area for oil vapor to condense on. My JD lawn tractor has something like steel wool in the oil breather.

Consider using some "Chore Boy" scrubbing pad in either stainless steel or copper. Probably better than steel wool. Coarser too.

[Guest occrj]

Keep the top of the rod half way between the marks. I found that any higher will result in the oil being thrown out the top of the engine breather. About five litres of Penrite Shelsley Medium gives me this result.

With 4.25 Quarts (4 litres) added, it brings the marker to here:

I'll look at adding another Quart and see if it brings it to halfway. Coincidentally I'm also using Penrite Shelsley, mine also has a cone-shaped screen within the filler neck. I wish it had a normal dipstick!

rgds, Richard