Let's be careful out there...

[Guest Paul Christ]

Two recent collisions in Maryland have taken the lives of Old Car enthusiasts. While neither collision appears to be the fault of the antique vehicle driver, they are gone nonetheless. Please be careful, and expect the worst out of your fellow driver.

Man, 73, driving 1936 Ford dies in two-car Crofton crash

The Baltimore Sun June 27, 2009

A 73-year-old man driving a 1936 Ford was killed Thursday evening when he was struck head-on by another vehicle in Crofton, according to Anne Arundel County authorities. Firefighters responded to the crash about 7:45 p.m. on Defense Highway, just west of Nob Hill Drive, said Division Chief Michael Cox of the county Fire Department. Howard Herbert Wright of Gambrills was pronounced dead at the scene, according to county police. The driver of the other vehicle - Andre Savvas Pantelides, 19, of Annapolis - was taken to Maryland Shock Trauma Center in Baltimore, where he remains in serious condition. According to the initial police investigation, Pantelides was driving his 2003 Toyota Corolla east on Defense Highway when he crossed the center line and struck Wright's vintage car. Cox said it took 18 firefighters about 10 minutes to free the men from their vehicles. Police do not believe drugs or alcohol were factors in the accident, but preliminary evidence suggests that the Toyota may have been speeding.

Man, daughter, killed in crash of antique car

The Baltimore Sun July 2, 2009

A 62-year-old Bowie man and his 10-year-old daughter were killed Tuesday night in Howard County when the antique car they were riding in was struck from behind and overturned on Interstate 70 near the Route 97 exit in Lisbon. About 6:30 p.m., Richard Thomas Dashiell of the 11000 block of Saturn Way was driving east in the far right lane when his 1929 Model A Ford was hit by Paul Davis of Glen Burnie, police said. Witnesses told police that Dashiell's vehicle was going about 50 mph when it was hit. Dashiell and his daughter, Amelia, were thrown from the vehicle. Davis, who was driving a 2007 Dodge, was not injured. No charges have been filed, but the accident is still under investigation, police said. Police said Dashiell's car had a "Slow Moving Vehicle" sticker on the rear window.

Edited August 29, 2009 by Paul Christ (see edit history)

[Steve Braverman]

Seat belts might have helped.

[1937hd45]

Were the killers checked for cell phones?

[Jim Rohn]

plus this one:

BangShift.com : Forums : GTO Judges just got a little rarer.

[HarryJ]

Remember when the Pennsylvania Dutch were required to put the red reflective triangles on their wagons? From what I am seeing, today's automobiles have outclassed cars of 25 years old or more, to such extent as it is dangerous to venture onto the roads in a vintage vehical.

[LINC400]

Remember when the Pennsylvania Dutch were required to put the red reflective triangles on their wagons? From what I am seeing, today's automobiles have outclassed cars of 25 years old or more, to such extent as it is dangerous to venture onto the roads in a vintage vehical.

What? Please explain to me how my 7.5 liter 33 year old Lincoln is incapable of keeping up with Hondas and Focuses. And I would much rather be behind the wheel of it in a head on collision with either of those.

[West Peterson]

Seat belts might have helped.

Steve

The Model A was equipped with seat belts.

[Steve Braverman]

Steve

The Model A was equipped with seat belts.

Then why were they both thrown from the car?

I recently installed seat belts in most of my cars, and plan to get to the others over the winter. I know in some old cars, there is not much to anchor the belts to, such as my dad's 1925 Franklin with its wood chassis and aluminum and wood body, but aren't Model As all-steel except for some of the open body styles?

[West Peterson]

I don't know, but I'm not sure if it's better or not to have seat belts in a roadster.

[Steve Braverman]

I don't know, but I'm not sure if it's better or not to have seat belts in a roadster.

I have wrestled with this thought myself.

I grew up riding around the neighborhood in Dad's 1910 Sears. I'd like my kids to have the same fun. My father feels that the Sears is not worth being strapped into, and that may be true. However, even a very slow speed collision (there isn't any other kind in a 1910 Sears) could be deadly if the passengers are tossed out on the road.

Driving and riding in antique cars is an accepted risk, much like riding a motorcycle. Regardless of what many people may think, no antique car, even a 6,000lb. behemoth from the 60s or 70s, is as safe as a modern car.

[alsancle]

So how much engineering do you think an automobile company has to put into their seatbelt design before they statistically make you safer in a crash? Do you think someone in their backyard bolting some aftermarket belts onto a car with a wooden framed body is actually making themselves safer? Would belts in a 1909 Oldsmobile save you when you get slammed by a F150?

I think we are all deluding ourselves by thinking that these crude belts you see bolted into cars that were not designed for them are somehow making things safer. Sadly, accidents happen.

[DAVES89]

I went to the website for more pictures... I hope the guy is OK.

But I can't help thinking...

What do want to bet that the person driving that car was not the owner?

[MCHinson]

On average, I drive my My Model A Ford less than 500 miles per year. I drive a police car about 12,000 miles per year, and I drive a Chevrolet Tahoe a little less than 12,000 miles per year.

The modern vehicles are designed to crumple upon impact, absorbing the energy of a crash, and thus protecting the occupants from injury. The Model A is not designed to crumple on impact. It will fare better than a modern vehicle in a low speed impact with a modern vehicle. In a high speed impact, the Model A will crumple but it will not provide the cushioning effect of the modern vehicle due to the lack of softer impact absorbing interior components.

While the Model A is not as safe as a modern car, my chance of injury in the Model A is much less than in a modern car because I drive it much less, I also drive it much more defensively. I don't drive it as fast as I drive the police car, or the Tahoe. I am also much more aware of everything happening around me because when I am driving the Model A, I am much more involved in the actual driving. I do not have the added distractions of the modern cars in the Model A. When I drive the Model A, I am just driving, I am not adjusting any Air Conditioner, or Radio, or other modern stuff.

I don't drive anywhere in a modern vehicle without seatbelts. I do not have seatbelts in the Model A. The Model A is an open car. With the limited amount of anchor points for seatbelts available in the Model A, I don't think that it is worth trying to install seatbelts in the car for the limited amount of decrease in risk that it might provide under the conditions that I drive the car.

Life is not without risk. I will be glad to take the added risk involved in driving the Model A for the amount of driving that I do in it.

[LINC400]

Linc400 it isn't necessarilly about keeping up, although in city traffic, acceleration is an issue, but about stopping. I feel like I am being swarmed by bees when I drive in city traffic, they pass on both sides in a 3 lane street, and pull in front and slam on the breaks.

Anyone that has driven a 1970's Mark would know that brakes are not an issue. The car stops extremely well especially considering its size. I would imagine that most cars from the 1980's, '70's, and late '60's would not have any issues in modern traffic. Prewar and some 1950's cars may not brake and handle as well, but the original poster said any car over 25 years old, which is not true.

While lots of people like to speculate, I have actually been in 2 accidents with 1970's Mark V's (neither my fault). One was in a head on collision with a newer car. The other was rear ended by a newer car. Unfortunately, due to corrosion from salt, neither Mark held up as well as if it was new. However, I received no injuries, no pain, no anything from a car with no air bags, no energy absorbing crumple zones, no safety hype of any kind. The drivers of the other cars with all the safety stuff were injured. So again, I would much rather be behind the wheel of my Mark in an accident than in the Honda or Focus that hits it.

The problem is not the car, but the idiots driving. Years ago, people would give extra room and respect to antique cars on the road because the prewar ones did not always brake, handle, and accelerate as well as the newer cars. Now, idiots think nothing about cutting off a 5,000 lb. car in their Honda and slamming on the brakes. It never occurs to them that the car behind them might not be able to stop. Also plenty of idiots too busy on cell phones to actually pay attention to something unimportant like driving.

Of course the antique car isn't always in the right either. I went to a car show this past weekend. It was open to anything. However, on exiting, every muscle car or streed rod had to pull out in traffic and burn rubber. Some burned rubber long enough that oncoming cars had to brake to avoid hitting them. You would think that someone that put all the time and money into these cars would have more brains than to put them at risk just to show off.

[MochetVelo]

I was happy to read of this loving father and daughter (Amelia and Rick Dashiell) in this month's Antique Automobile, and their mutual interest in vintage cars, and shocked at the tragic accident. I doubt seat belts would have helped in this case. They seemed like great people.

Phil