THE 1952 BUICK ROADMASTER LIMOUSINE...ANYONE KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THIS CAR

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Hello All:

During one of my recent searches on the Internet, I came across this Buick.

I'm totally unaware of this car.

It is a 1952 Buick Roadmaster Limousine and it appears to me to have Derham Bodied Coach Work.

Although it's an interesting looking Buick, I'm having doubts of it's authenticity.

Is this Buick a special build by Buick, maybe a Motorama car, or is it a conversion sometime after production?

Below are the two photos I found on the web, and for comparison, several coach builds by Derham.

The Derham Limousines are on a 1949 Hudson, 1953 Packard, and a 1955 Cadillac. It is easy to see the similarities to the Buick.

Does anyone know anything on this very interesting Buick???

[5219]

I think that this is the Harlow Curtis car. It has been written about in this forum previously. GM styling did for Curtis when he was president of GM. I think it still exists

[Centurion]

5219 is correct. The car was indeed built by GM for Harlow Curtice, who opted to utilize Buicks for his company cars even after he ascended to the presidency of General Motors.

Member Tom Gibson shot some wonderful photos of the car when offered by RM Auctions within the last few years. As I recall, the car bid only into the low $50-thousand range, which I found disappointing in view of the car's history.

I hope that Tom will see this topic and link his excellent photos here.

In contrast, the '53 Roadmaster sedan built for Howard Hughes sold for something on the order of $500,000 (or was it $1-million?) when it was offered a few years back.

Edited December 5, 2012 by Centurion (see edit history)

[5219]

The Howard Hughes car sold for 1 million. I remember the buyer crowing on TV that he had bought a piece of history. I remember wondering at the time if Hughes even knew that he owned such a car.

His various companies probably all kept cars around for his use in case he showed up one day. I doubt if he personally had any involvement with these purchases.

The Curtice car is far more interesting.

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

I found two more photos of "The Roadmaster Limousine".

[Guest shadetree77]

Dave, check out this link. Lots of good pictures and info. about this beautiful car.

SOLD - 1952 BUICK ROADMASTER HARLOW CURTICE CUSTOM LIMOUSINE SOLD A

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Update! Update!

With the help from the posts all have provided, I have been able to come up with the following. Full text from ConceptCarz.com.

Photos to follow. Awesome car. Some where someone is a lucky owner.

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[TD=colspan: 3]Sold for $110,000 at 2007 RM Auctions.

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This 1952 Buick Roadmaster is a unique creation constructed for Harlow Curtice. Curtice was the Head of Buick in 1933 and the Executive Vice-President of General Motors in 1948. In 1953 he became president and C.E.O. of Buick in 1953. In 1955, he was Time Magazine's 'Man of the Year.'

Buick began with a Roadmaster 72R chassis and incorporated styling inspired by Harley Earl's concept and Motorama cars. The car began a rolling tribute to the design inspirations of General Motors that had transpired in the prior years. The roof was removed in favor of a sloping, padded limousine-styled unit which gave the rear passenger compartment blind quarter roof and rounded window panes. All windows that could be opened and closed, including the center divider window, were given hydraulic power operation. This design had been used on GM Concept Cars.

Modifications and customization continued on the interior. The door handles were replaced with sliding-style handles. The passenger compartment is finished in light blue broadcloth while the driver's compartment is dark blue leather.

All appropriate and available amenities were included in the car. This included a single seeking radio, power brakes, power steering, backup lights, floor heaters, and special ducting to the rear compartment.

Under the hood was a 320.2 cubic-inch straight eight Dynaflash engine mated to a Dynaflow automatic gearbox. The engine was modified to an 8:1 compression ratio and given special camshafts which drove the horsepower to 200.

The car had remained in the possession of General Motors until it was purchased by its first private owner in 1988. Two years later it was added to the Bortz Collection of concept and prototype automobiles. Nearly two decades later it was sold by RM Auctions at Arizona to the Motorcar Portfolio collection. The car has since been given an extensive restoration.

This 1952 Buick Roadmaster;Harlow Curtice Limousine was offered for sale at the 2007 RM Auctions held in Amelia Island, Florida. The car was offered without reserve and estimated to sell between $50,000 - $70,000. It has four-wheel power drum brakes and a Dynaflow transmission.

It is extremely hard to place value on a vehicle, especially one with this degree of customization. This unique car would be a welcomed entrant at many concourses and automotive events. It is a car that tells a progressive story of General Motors attempts at designing futuristic vehicles that could answer the desires of next generation of automobile buyers. At auction, bidding make a mockery of the estimated values, as it quickly surpassed those estimates and continued to climb. A final bid of $110,000 was enough to secure the vehicles next owner.

Edited December 5, 2012 by xp-300 (see edit history)

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Dave, check out this link. Lots of good pictures and info. about this beautiful car.

SOLD - 1952 BUICK ROADMASTER HARLOW CURTICE CUSTOM LIMOUSINE SOLD A

Thank you shadetree.

This helped me find the info in post#7

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

I think that this is the Harlow Curtis car. It has been written about in this forum previously. GM styling did for Curtis when he was president of GM. I think it still exists

5219:

You were right, Harlow Curtis it is.

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Note the hood ornament.

Stunning.

[Centurion]

I'm pleased to see that the car sold for about double what I remembered!

This car makes one wonder about the other special cars created for Curtice. Many of us have seen or seen photos of the very unique GM Styling 1960 Electra 225 convertible that was built for Curtice after his retirement. I have heard that the car was a common sight around Flint during the 1960's. The car still exists and is owned by a Pennsylvania collector.

Many years ago, "Collectible Automobile" magazine published a couple of small photos of two additional, special Buicks. I have never read nor heard anything more about these two cars. One was said to be a Western-themed 1950 Roadmaster convertible custom-built for Harlow Curtice; the other was a Western-themed 1958 Caballero Estate Wagon custom-built for Bill Mitchell. Perhaps the '58 wagon utilized some of the ideas included in the better-known '58 Limited "Wells Fargo" convertible.

I'd welcome any additional information / photos of the Curtice '50 convertible and Mitchell '58 Estate Wagon.

By the way, newer members of the forum may not be aware that Curtice also had the '54 Landau kept for his personal use at GM's New York offices. The car was probably saved from destruction after the 1954 Motoramas because of Curtice's personal interest in the car. Late forum member Charles Barnette wrote extensively about the car's history in these forums two-or-three years ago, and this was new information for most of us.

Edited December 5, 2012 by Centurion (see edit history)

[Guest shadetree77]

Thanks for digging up more info. on this car Dave. I've been interested in this car ever since I bought my '52. When I got on Google to look up '52's for the first time, this is one of the first cars that popped up. I've been using photos of it for my wallpaper ever since. I've never seen pictures of the interior before. Interesting side note, a scam artist has tried to sell this car on EBAY several times over the last year or so. As I look up "52 Buick" almost every night to look for new parts, I've been able to catch it each time. With the help of fellow forum members, the owner of this car as well as EBAY have been contacted each time and the scam artist foiled. On the hood ornament, from what I've seen that was a popular modification to do on '51 and '52 hood ornaments. I see a lot of them on customized Buicks and they come up for sale like that on EBAY all the time. While I do agree that it gives it a streamlined look, I just love the gunsight look much more.

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Here's another photo I found of "The Roadmaster Limousine".

Front seat. Photo from the link below.

Cars From the Past - 1954 Buick Harlow Curtice Limo

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

...And of course the gentleman for whom "The Roadmaster Limousine" was built.

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

In studying the photo of the rear compartment a bit further...I noticed the following.

1- The wood grain on the doors and window divider appear similar if not the same as used on the 1941 Limited.

2- Note the interior door handles. Same type to be used in the 1954 "Landau", only two years later.

[Barney Eaton]

I believe this car was on display at the Sloan back in 2008 when the BCA national meet was held there.

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Who owns it now? Does anyone know?

[TG57Roadmaster]

The Curtice Roadmaster lives in the large, private Michigan collection of Mr. Dick Kughn, acquired at the 2009 RM Meadow Brook Auction for $45,100, a paltry sum for what the car represents. I was there covering the auction for Cars & Parts and fell in love with its unique design. GM Design reportedly modified a Cadillac 75 rear roofline to create the closed, custom greenhouse, and made special C-pillar trim for the rear door trim. A similarly-modified 1951 Cadillac 60-Special (with the same roofline and C-pillar trim) was built for GM Executive Albert Bradley, the head of finance, and was shipped to GM's New York Columbus Circle HQ for his use. Bradley would go on to succeed Alfred Sloan as GM Chairman, and always had custom cars. The Caddy awaits restoration, but doesn't have the "pop" of the Buick, in the way the C-pillar enhances its flowing beltline and SweepSpear contours. The Curtice Roadmaster is, to my eye, the loveliest of any '50-'52 Buick built, and its current owner got an incredible deal.

I visited the car and collection last year to get more pics for an upcoming article, and can report that the Buick is a strong #2.5-3, with an okay restoration that didn't pay alot of attention to details. The unusual "green" trim in the rear compartment is actually just a faded blue that wasn't addressed in the redo, and much of its chrome trim was left untouched. Not a flawless car, but what a beauty to behold! Built on a RM 72R chassis, it wears no cowl data plate (we looked and looked).

Sadly, it regularly shows up on ebay (as recently as Oct, 2012) where the nefarious "seller" compromises dormant ebay accounts and lists the car starting at $200! One of those listings led to my acquaintance with Mr. Kughn, when I alerted him to the fraud.

What a collection!

TG

[Pete Phillips]

The Buick Club of the Redwoods (northern California) just published an article about this car in their newsletter. It includes extensive photos. I don't know how to reproduce it here, but I could e-mail it to anyone interested. I think they got it from www.conceptcarz.com . The same issue has an article about the Howard Hughes 1953 Roadmaster with the unique air filtration system in the trunk.

Pete Phillips, BCA #7338

pphillips922@gmail.com

[Centurion]

Tom, thanks so much for coming through with the rest of the story about this beautiful car!

[TG57Roadmaster]

You're welcome Brian; I just ran across the thread and figured enquiring minds would enjoy an update!

What a beauty!

TG

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

You're welcome Brian; I just ran across the thread and figured enquiring minds would enjoy an update!

What a beauty!

TG

I will say thanks as well. Would have enjoyed the visit with you. Envious?? You Bet!!!

Ben

[Guest Rob McDonald]

TOM, I was wondering when you would chime in here. I didn't want to scoop your special relationship with this lovely car. The photos you've already shared of the Curtice Buick are a great gift to the hobby. Have you ever written up and photographed Dick Kughn's collection for a magazine? I'm pleased that he has allowed you at least some access.

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Tom:

Thank you for the info, great addition.

ConceptCarz. reported that the car sold for $110,000 in 2007, so the 2009 buyer had a great deal.

Did the car indeed go on the auction block twice in two years?

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

Here is my latest purchase from eBay. A Buick bow tie for 1952.

Now all I need is the Curtis Limousine.

On a serious note, does anyone know the history on this?

Advertising item or maybe for the salesman?

Edited March 25, 2013 by xp-300 (see edit history)

[Guest Rob McDonald]

I visited the car and collection last year to get more pics for an upcoming article

TOM, did that article ever get to press? Under what title? I'm too cheap to buy a lot of car magazines anymore but that issue would be worth my money.

[smithbrother]

Give me that 53 Skylark, in post #18, but you KEEP the tire kit.

Robert, eat your heart out for that 52, so called limo. Looks like a padded top addition to a standard RM to me.

Dale in Indy

[1953mack]

.....Looks like a padded top addition to a standard RM to me.....Dale in Indy

Not a "standard" Roadmaster with a padded top.....there's more to it. Note the absence of the rear quarter ventilator windows, different roof line, different rear window size, custom interior, and the list goes on, from a "standard" Model 72R Riviera Sedan. The photo on the wall shows you a quick comparison.

Like Barney mentioned in his Post #16 above, I took these pics while the Limo was on display in 2008 at the Sloan Museum in Flint, Michigan during the BCA Nationals in July......without a display placard informing visitors of the history or ownership......in a poorly lit Museum.....or the janitor forgot to flip the circuit breakers on that day.

Al Malachowski

BCA #8965

"500 Miles West of Flint"

Edited March 25, 2013 by 1953mack (see edit history)

[smithbrother]

IMO, and many others, a LIMO has extended wheel base.

It's a modified 1952 RM, nothing more. Show up at a wedding where a limo had been ordered, and the customer wouldn't be happy, no room for more than 6, maybe 7. Standard 52 RM leg room, and no room to party. LOL

I failed to note in my comments about the rear vent windows, but I had noticed such.

Don't take me wrong, I like the car, but I just don't see how anyone can call it a limo......, call it a LUXURY car.

That's my opinion, and only that. My 41 Limited was advertised as a limo, 139" WB. Folks ask me all the time, DID YOU STRETCH/EXTEND YOUR CAR. I laugh and say nope, Buick did.

Dale in Indy

Edited March 25, 2013 by smithbrother (see edit history)

[Guest my3buicks]

hhmm, I missed that, I have a huge collection of odds and ends like that - NICE

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

So, does any one know anything about this bow tie?

See post #25.

[Guest my3buicks]

I think it was worn by people associated with 1952 Buick's : )

[smithbrother]

Maybe it worn by 51 owners, WANTING to be 52 owners, like Robert, MAYBE.

Dale in Indy

[Guest shadetree77]

Lol, I do have plans to put together a replica of the outfits worn by Buick mechanics back then. That does require a blue bow tie. I've already got a line on some white coveralls which my wife is going to modify with a blue collar and blue cuffs. She's also going to make me a blue garrison cap. I'm going to affix some Buick service patches to all of it and have her stitch my name into the coveralls. Should be a neat little outfit to wear to car shows.

Anyway, If I had to guess I'd say it came from one of the auto shows. That looks like something one of the performers would have worn while on stage with a Buick.

[Guest BigDogDaddy]

Dale, I think you are mistaken in your definition of the limo. For 1941 ALL of the 90 Series Limited models had the same wheelbase, but only one model was designated as a limousine. So Buick did not stretch the wheelbase of the limo. Now I know that some people refer to all of the Limiteds as limos, but only one got the official designation. Therefore, even though this '52 did not get a stretched wheelbase, why wouldn't it be considered a limo ? I understand that we normally associate limos with having a stretched wheelbase, but throughout automotive history, that was not always the case.

[smithbrother]

Hey, call it what you want, no problem.

My limited came with a divider window, jump seats along with the long wheel base, it was called, and correctly a Limo. Other Limited's could be called a Limo with their long wheel base, but Buick didn't.

I like the 52, just don't feel it is a Limo.

Love you all though,

Dale in Indy

[Guest my3buicks]

[h=2]Definition of LIMOUSINE[/h]1

: a large luxurious often chauffeur-driven sedan that usually has a glass partition separating the driver's seat from the passenger compartment

Fits the bill in every sence of the word.

[Guest Rob McDonald]

DALE, I think at most times in Buick history, a car was called a limousine if it had a divider window. Wheelbases for Limiteds where all the same, except in 1940 I think. If it had a separate chauffeur's compartment it was a limo, if not, it was a touring sedan. Mr. Curtice's special Buick had the divider glass, so he could rightly call it a limousine if that made him feel better.

Heavens knows, there's plenty of leg room in the back of any '52 Buick, but the lack of jump seats in this car could have made it a Sport Limo, if the sales department was allowed to get involved.

[Dave Gelinas (XP-300)]

The Curtis Limousine Is On The Auction Block Again.

 

http://rmauctions.com/sj15/motor-city/lots/1950-buick-roadmaster-limousine/1075484

Edited July 6, 2015 by xp-300 (see edit history)

[Thriller]

Drool...time to check my lottery ticket....