Best Way to Remove a Timing Gear - 1934 Series 50

[Nevadavic]

I have a 1934 Series 50 with a knocking noise coming from the front timing gear area.  The noise is in time with the camshaft.  The engine is in the car now and I know I have to remove the hood and front end, generator, water pump, radiator, front motor mount, timing cover and pan to gain access. 

 

My question is, what is the best procedure to remove the existing fiber timing gear?  Do I need to use a puller, if so, what kind is necessary?  I do have an aluminum timing gear to replace the existing one.  What torque I should use on the new one?

 

I think this procedure may be similar for 1931-35 Buick engines.  Any help would be most appreciated before I begin! 

 

Nevadavic 

[dibarlaw]

Nevadavic:

 I was hoping someone who has this year engine would chime in.

I changed the fiber gears on both my 1925 Master and Standard. I am sure that there is a specific puller for these as there should be for mine.

 I used a universal type puller and was able to use the split bearing attachment on the outer flange.

   

Master gear being pulled.                          My original gears have a metal hub.

    

Standard Gear being pulled.    The new replacements are solid fiber. No steel hub.

 I had to machine a washer to make up for the missing steel components to get the gears parallel in tracking.

What is needed is a puller to have the 2 legs get behind the puller at the hub through the holes in the center cross section. When trying to pull as I had to the split collar does put extra pressure at the point of pull at the shoulder. Compressing the hub bore a bit making it harder to remove. It was a tough pull.

Hope someone else can help.

Edited December 23, 2020 by dibarlaw
Added content (see edit history)

[Rooster]

When I need to remove the timing gear on my 1929 I find it easier to pull the complete camshaft and gear out. It does mean taking off rocker shaft and pushrods / cam followers.   Then it's easy to press the gear off and press new one on. It takes "maybe" a bit longer and might have to cut a new gasket.   But I don't know if the 1934 engine has a similar setup.

[Robert Engle]

Not sure when the switch was made on the oil pump drive, but in 1932 the oil pump would need to be removed before pulling the camshaft.  I removed one gear on a 32 engine by drilling two 13/32 holes near two large holes.  I put a 3/8 course thread bolt through the holes and slid a thick washer and then a 3/8 nut and then proceeded to use the bolts as jack screws against the block.  

 

Bob Engle

 

 

[Nevadavic]

Thank you dibarlaw, Rooster and Robert Engle for your helpful responses!  I do think I'll try Robert's removal procedure.  By the way, the oil pump on the '34 is driven by the camshaft.  I think that may be common from 1931 - 35.  The distributor and water pump are driven by the generator gear.  I don't want to remove the camshaft if I don't have to.

 

Thank you for all responding,  Nevadavic

[dibarlaw]

I am sure that there is a Buick specific puller for this gear. I marvel at Robert's ingenuity with the 3/8 bolts in such a manner! I did a similar expedient to remove the starter drive gear shaft on my 1925 Master.

Making a short bolt /nut arrangement to press out the shaft against the starter generator.

This was so I did not have to remove the water pump and starter generator.  It took several hours to remove the shaft. Backing off the nut, adding a washer pushing another 1/16". Repeat. All this only to find out that the starter gear would not come out of the case with the starter pinion gear in place. So I should have removed the S/G anyway. Without the S/G in the way, several solid taps with a sized punch would have knocked out the gear shaft.

 

I had to make a slight modification to the aluminum trunnion case. 

Just enough room to remove the damaged gear.

 

 

[147 Franklin Airman]

On 12/23/2020 at 9:46 PM, Rooster said:

When I need to remove the timing gear on my 1929 I find it easier to pull the complete camshaft and gear out. It does mean taking off rocker shaft and pushrods / cam followers.   Then it's easy to press the gear off and press new one on. It takes "maybe" a bit longer and might have to cut a new gasket.   But I don't know if the 1934 engine has a similar setup.

Can you tell me what held the camshaft in place? 

[Robert Engle]

On 31 thru at least 34 engines there is a flange behind the gear held against the block by two bolts. this retains the camshaft in place.  The bolts can be removed through the holes in the gear.

 

Bob Engle

[147 Franklin Airman]

43 minutes ago, Robert Engle said:

On 31 thru at least 34 engines there is a flange behind the gear held against the block by two bolts. this retains the camshaft in place.  The bolts can be removed through the holes in the gear.

 

Bob Engle

Thanks Bob, that sounds really easy. Hope it's the same on my 29

[Hubert_25-25]

Vic,

    Some things to think about regarding timing gear removal for your Buick.  The 2 holes in the timing gear are to provide access to the brass plate that holds the camshaft in place.  Notice in picture #1 you can see the gear set punch marks for 1-6 TDC.  Notice that the punch marks are not aligned, so just before hitting TDC, you can actually get to the 2 screws that hold the camshaft in.  Odd to me also that they used screws and not bolts but that is another issue.    Good luck too if something seized and you can not roll the motor to get to the screws.  

See also photo 2 which is a breakdown of the parts.

See photo 3 which is my "Do not do this at home" photo - but that is only if you are going to reuse the gear.  If the gear is ruined or you have an aluminum gear, you may consider using a large jaw puller to pull the gear and leave the camshaft in place.  

Photo 4 is using a puller and it is attached to the brass plate that holds the camshaft from moving too far.  I removed the gear from the end of the camshaft with this method, but I did stress that plate a little and had to hammer it back into shape.  Better to use a press, but that means removing the camshaft.

If I had to do it over today, I would see if you can get  2 metal plates in behind those two bigger holes.  The plates would be 1" wide x 1/4" thick by maybe 3" long and with a 3/8" tapped hole.   

The last photo shows using a double split collar and a puller set to remove the gear.  This works well with no stress to parts.  Notice the hand mallet.  I think I had to use that.  I would get the puller tight and then it would require a smack on the end before I could make another tighten of the puller.  Not an issue if the camshaft is out of the car.   

Consider also drilling and tapping two 3/8" holes into the new aluminum gear so that it can be removed if necessary without pulling the camshaft.

Hugh

 

 

 

 

Edited September 24, 2021 by Hubert_25-25 (see edit history)