gpdc

1925 Master question.....

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Okay, FWIW, my second car was a '65 Mustang with a 289 cid and 3 speed manual shift. Besides having a clutch chatter, every now and again the engine would be hard to crank. It wasn't due to the battery or starting system, the engine would just seem to bind up. The only way to get it going was to roll along and "pop" the clutch. All this was driving me crazy. I took the clutch apart and resurfaced the flywheel and replaced the disc (twice), also checked flywheel runout and crankshaft end play, all within spec. I never fixed the problem and eventually sold the car. Some years laterI drove a Ford stake truck with a 6 cyl / stick that had the same clutch chatter. The only thing that I can figure is that even though the crankshaft end play was in spec (barely), the lateral position of the crankshaft would shift enough to cause the engine to bind up. I believe that a tighter end play spec would have solved this problem. I don't know if you have a clutch chatter, but the engine binding sounds a lot like my Mustang. My suggestion would be to check and maybe tighten up on the crankshaft end play. I invite others to weighin on my theory. Larry W

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wow......never gave tight end play a thought.....

the pan is still off so I'll check it tomarrow.......

fwiw dept:

      I bought a used '70 Mach 1 'Stang in  '72........pretty 'lil thing with a Cleveland, 410 locker, Hurst ontop of the BW T10

      The car had been parked for months by the original owner when I bought it......

      much later I heard the thinking was it had bent crank......evidenced & experienced by me everytime it wouldn't turn over

        fast enough to start when warm.....

      I learned to carry cables, not to start it warm & always park it pointed downhill.......

      I lived with the inconvience......

     Then one day I installed Hooker headers, street cam, bigger Holley on an Edelbrock intake & a hot ignition.....

        and drove it to Florida the next day......

     The car NEVER had starting problems after that.........

  Can anybody guess why?......

SPOILER ALERT:

       The stock CI exhaust manifolds were transfering too much heat to the starter motor......the headers were routed to minimize that

        and also too..... there may or may not have been a missing heat shield involved from day one....

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Excessive end play (which is what I think I had) can be just as bad, if not worse, than too little end play. At any rate, neither condition is good, so it's worth having a careful look at. Good luck; let us know what you find. Larry W

Edited by Larry W (see edit history)

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Well....we're getting closer & closer now........

the tight/hard turning (manual) crank problem may have had something to do with a hard turning distributor shaft....probably a pot metal  dist. housing problem.....

a recent stumbling block is shown in the attached pic.....does anybody want to take a guess as to what function the black wire with the small white paint spot on it has?.......both ends have ring type sta-kon crimp ends (avail 1925?....kinda doubt it).....the larger ring terminal is fixed to the case (a ground) by the hex bolt shown.....the small ring terminal end goes onto the threaded stud that sits above the lifting starter brush & is kinda buried out of sight.......the mystery is in the fact that w/o that wire, the s/g arm won't "motor" at low speed like it needs to.......

we put that wire back in to get the "motoring" & the starting system never engaged so smoothly, effortlessly or smoothly.....we're there on that...

stay tuned!

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gpdc,  The wiring looks different to the shop manual.  But I expect if it all works thats what is important. The blue wire from the top commutator brush goes to terminal  A and then the ignition switch.  The field coil wire comes into terminal  F and then to the ignition coil  and then to the ignition switch.  Power comes from the battery terminal through the amp meter to the ignition switch.  The field coil,  commutator brush and power are all connected through the ignition switch.  When I bench tested my S/G you can see I connected terminal  A and F ( yellow and black wire )  which could then receive power from the + battery terminal.   I don,t know why you have that black earth wire there.

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ya Rod, your pictures, directions & the schematics in the shop manual for a bench test for the "motoring" function were what I was going on.....

couldn't get it to run....then, desperation move.....stuck that black wire back in & it motored......

The car started, ran & charged when he first got it & it had that wire installed....so....methinks a call to Jason is in order next week......

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Hello all......'lil update on the car :

       put it up for the winter around Turkey day last November....ya, 'bout 6 months ago......

     prior to that & more recently, thrash sessions installed a new , 90 yo old flywheel (with the teeth cut into the solid as the original),

   new ignition components included properly crimped 8mm wires & their proper spacer sleeves in the cap, 90 degree terminals on the plugs,etc, etc

new cap & rotor, points & (a biggie, me thinks), the capacitor ( ref here: L Bibarlows' problem with burned points....we had it) & a (correct) replacement distributor (more thanks Jim B ).......and various other bits, pieces & parts.......so.......we're now successfully driving around the yard with it & dealing with the over amp draw seen when "motoring" the s/g......which (it seems) has a possible field coil short to ground problem.

 The motor sounds so sweet at idle, it'll make your heart melt.........the whole system will get a super tuning once we get this amperage draw problem figured out & solved............

& I'm not sure if I voiced it, the problem with the hand crank was system "sticktion".......I could turn it with the pan & the rear main cap off......

   in installing the new flywheel....I had to.............& I could turn it from underneath the car using (gently) a bar between the clutch towes......AMAZED, I was !!

I believe now it's an oil problem that the starter motor easily overcomes....truth be told, we don't really need to hand crank it any more............(maybe!)

The orange glowy exhaust problem and subsequent (associated?) water overheating SEEMS to be history.....contributing factors could include accurate ignition timing, proper Marvel carb settings & carb heating component adjustments comlimentary to todays available fuel. 

again, thanks to all who chimed in........

GPDC

   

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GPDC, That's great you've got '25 master up and running and have solved most of the previous problems. 

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seems it !!!!......now, onto other stuff....so,....I'm asking you, or any other reader if the S/G coil from a Delco 249 S/G (from a '23 6 cyl) is

the same as the coil in the # 268 S/ G for our Master 6 ?..........

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