Rear Hub Removal?

[jvelde]

Okay, I have searched the internet, the Torque Tube and this forum to see how to remove the rear drums on a '39 Buick Special to no avail. If some kind soul can post a reply or even better, photos of this process, I would be able to work on my brakes (which I know nothing about either). Here is a photo of the hub I am trying to remove.

Thanks, JV

[1939_Buick]

You need to have the brake pads well clear of the drums.

Can you rotate the drum without feelling the pads touching?

Probably just rust holding it all together. Spraying WD40 will help.

Excessive force with a puller can break - distort a brake drum (do not ask how I know this)

Consider buying the 1942 Buick shop manual: has very good instructiions

Edited November 19, 2013 by 1939_buick (see edit history)

[trp3141592]

Hi,

Of course you have removed the wheel. Be patient. Back off the shoes. Did you remove the sometimes-there bolt through the face of the drum into the hub and the wheel alignment pin??

Clean/wire-brush the joint where the drum meets the axle hub to remove any corrosion that is jamming the drum/hub joint. Lube that drum/hub joint liberally with Kroil or MB Blaster over several days.

Bonk (More than a tap, less than a WHAM!) the drum with a heavy hammer (like a 4 to 6 pound maul) around the perimeter. Do not use a light hammer, carpenter's hammer, or the like--a light hammer will bend the metal where a heavy hammer will move it. Bonk it radially toward the center and also in the take-it-off outward direction. You want to break the rust connection of the drum to the hub, especially around that round center. Once the drum breaks free at the center, you're home free.

You may need to get a spidery-looking puller (see below) from Amazon or Eastwood--but don't think that this tool is a puller. It's really just a "tensioner," and it only puts some degree of stress on the drum to work in concert with your bonking to break the rust-connection that is holding the drum in place. It lacks the cajones to be a puller.

This guy's hammer is too light, but you get the picture. Bonk the tool and bonk the drum.

Be patient!

--Tom

[jvelde]

Okay, I think I have the idea. I had the wheel off but put it back on to get the car out of the middle of the garage so my wife's car could get in. So, I will remove the two through bolts and the locating pin/bolt and then wrangle the drum off. If it doesn't want to come off I will hunt down a puller.

Thanks to 1939_buick, Tom, and Allan who e-mailed me some photos and some scans from one of his manuals. I will be back on the project in the morning.

JV

[Bob Engle]

One more approach to try. Take a large piece of brass, about 3/4" in diameter and a good 4 # hammer and hammer the brass drift between the lugs as if you are driving the drum onto the axle. This will cause a vibration in the drum and often breaks the drum free to be pulled off by hand.

As a kid, I pulled many rear drums for the semi annual PA brake inspection.

Bob Engle

[jvelde]

Thanks for the suggestion Bob - hope one of these tricks work for me. I will try to post a follow-up report.

[1939_Buick]

24 hours after an application of WD40 (or equal) that rust can loosen

And get a bigger hammer

[60FlatTop]

Leave that locating pin until last and don't touch it if you don't have to at this point of your mechanic career. Be sure to research the brake lining thickness thoroughly before putting the new material on.

I have a puller you can borrow. It just takes a couple of days to get there in the mail. You'll only need it for the first pull. After that it will go on and off pretty easy.

Just PM your address, but you gotta send it back.

Edited November 19, 2013 by 60FlatTop (see edit history)

[DonMicheletti]

The '39 just had the wheel bolts, no studs. After the 5 wheel bolts and wheel are removed, Removing the additional 3 bolts that hold the drum on to the axle hub should loosen things. After the bolts are all out, the only thing that is holding the drum is the fit between the axle and brake drum to axle inner bore. Clean off the "step" there with a wire brush. Smacking the drum with a brass hammer might be necessary. You might have to back the adjuster all the off to get the drum off.

[trp3141592]

Hi,

Once you have done your brake work and are re-installing the drum, apply a coating of Never-Seize to the "step" area and the flange area of the axle where they make contact with the drum. When you do brakes again in 25 years, you will admire your own wisdom of having done that.

--Tom

[jvelde]

Update - well, no problem getting the rear hubs off. Didn't have to hit with a hammer or use any type of puller, just unbolted and wiggled side-to-side and they came right off. Got the rear brakes adjusted including the e-brake, but the front right is being difficult. I spin the hub and can hear and feel it drag, so I adjusted till it quit dragging and test drove it and I could hear and feel it. Jack it back up and it's dragging again. There is no brake fluid leaking around the wheel cylinder, but could it need rebuilding? Several days ago I drained the brake fluid and bled till I was getting clear fluid without bubbles at each wheel, so pretty sure there isn't a problem there. Ideas....?

Thanks, JV

[zeke01]

Hi,

Once you have done your brake work and are re-installing the drum, apply a coating of Never-Seize to the "step" area and the flange area of the axle where they make contact with the drum. When you do brakes again in 25 years, you will admire your own wisdom of having done that.

--Tom

I'm not at all sure about the never seize. I have read and believe that applying grease to the step area will help the drum slide even farther onto the step area and make it harder to remove the next time.

[Bob Engle]

I suspect you have a frozen wheel cylinder that isn't allowing the spring to retract after brake application. Take the springs off and swing the shoes away from teh cylinder remove the rubber boots and see whether there is crud inside the boot. If so replace or restore the cylinders. I prefer to have the cylinder resleeved with stainless rather than just hone the cylinder an install a kit. I do you one cylinder, you should consider doing all as they usually all are in the same condition.

Bob Engle

[trp3141592]

Hi,

"...the front right is being difficult. I spin the hub and can hear and feel it drag, so I adjusted till it quit dragging and test drove it and I could hear and feel it. Jack it back up and it's dragging again."

Here's another thought on this problem based on my experience: the RF rubber flex hose may have deteriorated internally and is blocking the return of brake fluid to the master cylinder. If your hoses are more than 20 years old, it's a safe bet that they have collapsed internally. This exact situation plagued both my 40 LaSalle and my 37 Roadmonster until I was advised to replace the rubber hoses. Replace them all.

Hmmm--strikes me also that the 37 Buick has a 4th rubber hose: a short rubber hose at the master cylinder as well as the three chassis hoses. Check your car to see if that 4th hose is present on yours.

Be careful about buying those el-cheapo hoses from Argentina on EBay. NAPA can supply US DOT-rated hoses for you as can Hoses Unlimited in Holland, MI. You should pay about $20 to $25 each for DOT-rated hoses.

As for using Never-Seize, I have found it to be a miracle release agent. I did brakes and hoses on my daily-driver 40 LaSalle in 1982, then again in 2010. All my Never-Seize'd connections, including the flex-hose-to-brake-line connections, opened up easily with no damage. I congratulate myself for using it way back then as it is a great investment in future repair convenience. Drums, brake lines, and rotors, et al on all the service vehicles in my company fleet are re-assembled with Never-Seize as part of their first rebuild.

--Tom

[60FlatTop]

I would check the hose to the right front as well. The fabric delaminates and can work like a check valve. It will maintain pressure in the wheels cylinder. The best test is to take it off and blow through it from the wheel cylinder end.

Bernie