vermontboy

Sorry for the quality - I have no idea how to do a "Screen dump" - converted printscreen to word, printed and scanned. Top printscreen is forum entry, bottom printscreen is first photo double clicked on screen. Can provide numerous examples from old postings if you need.

When I go to the old postings the pictures that were just right have been blown up so I only can view about 25 per cent of the picture without scrolling and I think it is cropping out some detail in the resize ..... any way we can view those pictures properly ???

Leaving any battery in your car for two years unattended will drain it - the voltage makes no difference. Since you are going to eventually need a new battery anyway when you want to drive it regularly just take a 12V battery and a set of jumper cables. Works great - I did it all the time for hot starts on a 50 Chevy until I replaced the battery cables with welding 00 cables. You do NOT want to use extended life antifreeze in your car - http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/257047/288065.html?1336871099 And after all that I concur with those who are telling you that if you keep your car in storage without driving it for long periods of time it will NOT age gracefully. Read what Hagerty has to say about things that will cause your car to deteriorate - one of the primary reasons is lack of use....... Just my two cents

<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <w:DontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--> How do you get it reliable ? Drive it. I bought the Model "A" in the avatar when I was 12 years old back in 1961. I pulled the body off the frame and completed a very amateurish restoration in the late 60's. The extent of mechanical work was pulling the oil pan and rmoving about 3 inches of gritty sludge, washing out the valve area with kerosene, and lapping the valves by hand plus setting the points, plugs and timing. It was finished at 4:30 in the morning the day I had to leave for college in Utica, 150 miles away. I drove it back and forth every weekend, 300 miles round trip, all winter and the next year as well. Never had a tow but here are the things that I remember had to be fixed. 1. The repro solenoid broke and shorted - lots of sparks 2. The repro ignition cable end came loose inside the distributor - wiggled it and got to a gas station - the guy soldered it for me.. 3. The generator and/ or cut out fried (twice). Once in a blinding snowstorm at 20 below zero at 2 AM. I was 25 miles away from school and after pulling the fan belt it made it all the way back with very dim lights. Had to pull the battery and take it in the dorm to keep it from freezing. 4. Threw a fan blade and I made the entire trip with the belt removed (it was cool out and daytime - battery had enough charge to keep going). That's it except for tearing a couple of teeth off low gear making a dropped clutch start on gravel without having low gear fully engaged - not the cars fault. That also broke one of the rear spring shackles and I had to have that welded once I discovered it a few months later (the ride did feel a little funny with that rear spring held by only one shackle and the other one bouncing). The "A" starts fine in second - even uphill if you slip the clutch a little bit. As for reliability get the best parts you can afford. Get all the catalogs and before you buy something and read the descriptions. Some vendors have different quality parts (condensers come to mind - some of the new ones have a fairly short life span.) After you look at the catalogs you will see a pattern and be able to sort the good and bad. By the way - in all the years I have been on other forums, including Ford Barn, I don’t recall anyone ever having anything bad to say about Bratton's. They seem to be recommended more often than any other vendor. When I finally find the Model "A" I want (hopefully this year) what will I be sure to take along on a long trip? A carburetor, a distributor, and a generator. All 3 will be items picked up at a flea market and cleaned up and adjusted. Add to that the usual fan belt, "tune up kit" and a few hand tools as well as a copy of a couple of books for when I"m stumped and I would feel comfortable. Back in the 60's a parts dealer drove from Rochester to Hershey every year in his 1917 Larrabee truck loaded with parts. Can’t wait to hear that your car is running and that you are out enjoying it …. they really are a great car.. <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156"> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if !mso]><object classid="clsid:38481807-CA0E-42D2-BF39-B33AF135CC4D" id=ieooui></object> <style> st1\:*{behavior:url(#ieooui) } </style> <![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} </style> <![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026"/> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:shapelayout v:ext="edit"> <o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1"/> </o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->

Personally I feel that the "A" pricing is spot on with what I would pay based on your description. I think your guesstimates on the late models (59 and up) are about 50% high - late 50's to 80's cars don't "clean up" like the old ones as the quality of materials just isn't there and you end up with dry rot in the upholstery and brittleness in the plastic. Miles of wiring and connections to oxidize, I would think 3 to 4K at most. The 24 Olds at 10-12K and it would be easy to get upside down on the 37 Buick at any price if you are thinking correct restoration - there aren't that hard to pick up in nice condition. I am admittedly partial to older vehicles and those are strictly my guesses out of the box.

I forgot to retard the spark lever once before I timed my Model "A" and it would barely run. Just a thought.

Yes indeed, same if you put a wanted ad in. I have a wanted ad for a 1924 - 1936 proven tour car to take on long trips. The first response I receive is a fresh restoration on a Model "A", and not a good one judging by the pics - owner said he went on two 10 mile shakedown "cruises" and it is A-OK. The second one I get is little more than a Model "T" chassis with a plywood platform and a cowl and late model bucket seat bolted to it.

Door handles at rear

I ordered a set from JC Whitney in either 1963 or 1964. If I remember correctly they did not exactly state that they didn't say "Ford"....

Looks like a good deal - thought I posted a few minutes ago but apparently forgot to hit something ... http://albany.craigslist.org/cto/4994983069.html

Yes, the the crank pulley must turn. I always just made sure the fan belt was tight, stood on the timing pin side, and put my left hand on the closest side of the belt and my right hand on the furthest side and pulled and pushed. You might want to pull the coil wire out of the top of the distributor so it doesn't start, however unlikely that might be. If for some reason it won't turn take a couple of spark plugs out ....

I never had any problem turning a Model "A" engine with the fan belt .... one hand on each side and turn .... make sure the key is off or remove the coil wire .

My guess is you have a fuel line blockage somewhere either in the tank or in the line from the tank to the shut off or shut off to sediment bowl. A friend had a Toyota truck that had a punch out in the gas tank that would float over the outlet and stop the vehicle. I had a 1950 Chevy truck that had some large pieces of rust in the tank that would do the same thing. Is the standpipe in the tank ? If not you could have a similar problem. Outside of that the only other thing I can think of is that perhaps you have a bad condensor - easy to check, just pull the wire from the coil to the distributor cap out of the cap and hold it 1/4 inch from the head. Crank the engine with the key on. You should get a bright blue spark .... if it is a weak yellow spark replace the condensor. It's a long shot but easy to check.

Back in the 60's I used methanol (methyl alcohol) as it was felt that if you did get a leak into the oil through a blown head gasket or whatever it wouldn't damage the babbit material the way the ethylene glycol did and was perhaps less prone to leakage (more prone to evaporation however). If you have ever had any of the new antifreeze in your oil for whatever the reason it makes a mess. Not even sure that methanol is available anymore. Short forum from the Model "T" Club on the dangers of some modern anti-freeze. http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/257047/288065.html?1336871099

Lead poisoning was first known about in Roman times. That said, all of the current crop of seniors grew up chewing on toys painted with lead paint, playing with lead soldiers, heating and pouring lead sinkers and or bullets, and living in houses clad in asbestos shingles, painted with lead paint inside and out, and playing on floors covered with vinyl asbestos tile. Cars deposited vast quantities of lead along the roadways and gas station attendants were exposed to fumes day in and day out. It's a miracle any of us survived. Just my two cents.

" Did just about everyone drive at one time or another, independent of age, gender, mechanical experience, or was it typically only folks in good shape, generally male, with mechanical experience--e.g., male, 20 to 50 years old, mostly?" If you look at old photos you will find many young drivers (some as young as 12). You will find many female drivers - as a matter of fact the Model "A" was considered an excellent car for women to learn to drive on. Lest you think that strange here is an excellent article on a 102 year old lady who still drives her 1930 Packard (a much larger car than a Model "A"). The article also states that she did her own maintenance until a few years ago. There used to be a movie showing her driving it - may still be around if you google. http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2012/08/michigan-woman-102-still-drives-her-1930-packard/1?csp=obinsite#.VTLyOfAllRq

I guess those of us growing up in the 50's had the advantage of driving a lot of different vehicles, started in all kinds of different ways. I have not driven a Model "A" since 1971 but if I got in one tomorrow I would 1) turn on the gas 2) turn the key 3) move the left spark lever all the way up 4) move the right throttle lever down a couple of notches 5) turn the choke knob in and then back it off 3/4 of a turn 6) hit the starter button and pull the choke rod out a couple of quick times. When it started I would then reach over and advance the spark and move the throttle back to top position - no rush, I love the "ticka-ticka-ticka" of a Model "A" at idle. After a couple of minutes I would close the choke knob down a half turn (leaving it out a 1/4 of a turn or so). If I missed something let me know ......

If it was mine I would just buy a new, or borrow a used, Tillotson carb and add an inline fuel filter to it. It takes less time to change out a Model "A" carb than to tinker with it. If that worked you would know the Zenith is the problem. If taking a lot of long trips, say a week or two away from home, it's easier to just carry a new carb and distributor with you for roadside repairs. Total cost for both is about what a modern car costs to fix at a garage when it breaks down.. and swapping out is a lot easier than trying to troubleshoot on the side of the road. An employee of Hagerty bought a Model "A" Ford and used it as his only transportation for a year - it was towed twice, once because of one the modern "improved" components. Just my two cents

You did turn the gas on, right (ask me how I know - a few times).

It comes down to 2 basics - is there spark at the plugs (have someone crank it and short across the top of the plug to the block with an insulated screwdriver- you should be able to jump a spark. Second - is there gas at the carburetor? You should be able to tell because if you crank it and hold the choke closed gas will drip from the carburetor. If you have both spark and gas then then the spark is coming at the wrong time and you have to time it (very simple - no tools required)..... Haven't touched a Model "A" in over 40 years but I could still do it blindfolded.

There are numerous hot rod forums out there for this kind of thing. While I agree that we don't want to become as stringent as some of the other clubs out there someone has to draw a line somewhere. If this organization becomes an open forum on "street machines" and "rat rods" you will soon have an entire new membership to deal with because many of your old members, myself included, will abandon ship. Didn't the Chevy club just go through a similar experience .....

If you are counting "votes" I am in favor of making location and price absolutely mandatory. If they want advice on pricing the General Forum would be the place for that question. I am also strongly in favor of allowing members to (politely) comment on pricing levels and especially on questions relevant to authenticity and titling .. those are questions of general interest and could indeed prevent one of our members from making a several thousand dollar mistake. If it is felt that a member perhaps needs a reminder of just what constitutes "polite" a PM could be sent by the moderator (or moderators to take personalities out of it) explaining the error of their ways and threatening suspension from posting for a period of time - works on other boards. Just my two cents

And let's not forget that distinctive sound of an early 90's Thunderbird SC with its real supercharger ? A very distinctive whine.

As the former owner of a small antique shop I can tell you that two things come into play as far as inventory are concerned - mark up and turn over (cash flow). Pricing on an overall basis must seek to balance out the two. I have purchased antiques from knowledgeable dealers at a fraction of retail pricing (say 20 per cent of retail) because they needed cash flow. Perhaps it's apples and oranges but there has to be money left over at the end of the month when all the bills have been paid. If you spend a few minutes calculating the amount of profit required to stay in business, generated by either mark up or turnover, you will begin to appreciate just how difficult it can be. As Matt pointed out previously, there is a point in the first few months that either make or break a business. I reached that point and discovered that even though I had access to the capital required to do what had to be done, I didn't have the intestinal fortitude to actually do it with my own money and folded the business. It was a humbling experience. It wasn't a lack of knowledge, just a lack of willingness to take that leap of faith. If a successful businessman is down to his last dollar he is out looking for something to buy with that dollar and sell for a profit. I have a friend who does that very successfully, I can't.

I was born in Vermont and consider myself a Vermonter but unfortunately my family moved to Rochester, NY back in the early 50's in order to make a living. I lived near Syracuse,NY for 40 years and moved back to the Rochester area 10 years ago.. I will be watching for your listings.