Duesenberg J in 60s Romania

[adrian_pt]

Hi all,

 

Also in a Bucharest storage yard alongside a 540K (photos elsewhere on the forum) was this very sad looking Duesenberg J. The body is the interesting bit. Bumpers are French and often seen on French-bodied Duesys of that era (including on the Prince of Romania's car in photo 7); bodywork up to the doors is very Fernandez & Darrin esque; but the rear is a rather ungainly mystery. F&D did do a speedster design for a Prince Ghyka which has similarities; and the Ghykas were a major Romanian landowing family... To complicate matters a F&D-looking Duesy was allegedly spotted in Kiev at around the same time...

Edited June 30, 2022 by adrian_pt (see edit history)

[alsancle]

I stand corrected from my previous post showing only the very back of the car.

 

That is definitely a model J Duesenberg!

 

Thanks for posting!

[alsancle]

My friend Chris Summers agrees with your Fernandez reference.

 

The Fernandez boat tail was  last known to be with the Romanian army in 1940.

[adrian_pt]

Fascinating. That makes sense - the boat tail could have been modified for people-carrying purposes. Amazing to get so much history from just a few photos!

[alsancle]

Bottom of the door, door handle, and front fender aprons, windshield all look like a match.

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by alsancle (see edit history)

[George K]

12 hours ago, adrian_pt said:

Hi all,

 

Also in a Bucharest storage yard alongside a 540K (photos elsewhere on the forum) was this very sad looking Duesenberg J. The body is the interesting bit. Fenders are French and often seen on French-bodied Duesys of that era (including on the Prince of Romania's car in photo 7); bodywork up to the doors is very Fernandez & Darrin esque; but the rear is a rather ungainly mystery. F&D did do a speedster design for a Prince Ghyka which has similarities; and the Ghykas were a major Romanian landowing family... To complicate matters a F&D-looking Duesy was allegedly spotted in Kiev at around the same time...

With Cromos bumpers it has a French connection.

[58L-Y8]

23 hours ago, alsancle said:

Bottom of the door, door handle, and front fender aprons, windshield all look like a match.

AJ:

You beat me to it, for comparison.  The deck modifications were without doubt done for practical reasons...but frankly looks like hell!

Steve

Edited June 30, 2022 by 58L-Y8
syntax corrected (see edit history)

[edinmass]

 

The ultimate European barn find! Let's start looking........

[adrian_pt]

Here it is again, in a 1961 film made in Romania, "Setea" (Thirst) in slightly better condition. So we can surmise that it was driving in 1961, and most likely the studio photos were taken after that.

 

[chief5]

Our friends did some research on this car..  so here is the summary:

Recently, Mr Stefan Eugen Chriac placed a series of photos on Facebook showing two cars at the Buftea film studios at some stage in the 1960s. They were used as props and, according to him, were subsequently scrapped. But the photos show two very special cars indeed: as well as a Mercedes 540K Sindelfingen Cabriolet, and a Duesenberg J. 

Not just a Duesenberg J, either! After a fair amount of research and some lengthy conversation with Duesnberg experts, the conclusion seems to be that this is a rare European-bodied Duesenberg from the Fernandez and Darrin coachworks in Paris. Only six F&D Duesenbergs are known to have been made, including, in 1933, a Boattail Speedster, exhibited at the Paris Salon that year. It is unclear exactly which chassis it was on, although the consensus seems to be that it was on car no J-373. This car was last heard of in 1940, in the service of the Romanian army, although there have also been rumours that it was later seen in Kiev. 

The Buftea car has remarkably similar details, with the exception of the rear of the bodywork, possibly a later modification. The Cronos bumpers are a feature of many French Duesenbergs, including another Romanian car, Prince Nicholas's Letourneur et Marchand Faux Cabriolet. So although we cannot be quite sure, the chances are this is the Boattail Speedster.

The fate of the car remains a mystery. It appears in at least one film, Setea (Thirst), filmed in 1960, where it can be seen in rather better condition. The archivist, Mr Chiriac, claims the cars were scrapped. And yet ... Even in the 1960s people must have known better than to scrap two such impressive cars. So did they follow other exotica to the West? If so, then surely a unique car such as the Duesenberg would have surfaced by now. Or East? But by then, pre-war cars were no longer really sought after as transport, as there were more than enough newer, more practical ones being made locally. Might it therefore still be in Romania? One can only dream, that one day, a Bucharest garage door creaks open, and underneath, covered by decades' worth of dust...

(along with the photos to be found at http://volganeagra.blogspot.com/2022/08/duesenberg-in-comunism-communist.html)

[adrian_pt]

On 10/9/2022 at 10:28 PM, chief5 said:

Our friends did some research on this car..  so here is the summary:

Recently, Mr Stefan Eugen Chriac placed a series of photos on Facebook showing two cars at the Buftea film studios at some stage in the 1960s. They were used as props and, according to him, were subsequently scrapped. But the photos show two very special cars indeed: as well as a Mercedes 540K Sindelfingen Cabriolet, and a Duesenberg J. 

Not just a Duesenberg J, either! After a fair amount of research and some lengthy conversation with Duesnberg experts, the conclusion seems to be that this is a rare European-bodied Duesenberg from the Fernandez and Darrin coachworks in Paris. Only six F&D Duesenbergs are known to have been made, including, in 1933, a Boattail Speedster, exhibited at the Paris Salon that year. It is unclear exactly which chassis it was on, although the consensus seems to be that it was on car no J-373. This car was last heard of in 1940, in the service of the Romanian army, although there have also been rumours that it was later seen in Kiev. 

The Buftea car has remarkably similar details, with the exception of the rear of the bodywork, possibly a later modification. The Cronos bumpers are a feature of many French Duesenbergs, including another Romanian car, Prince Nicholas's Letourneur et Marchand Faux Cabriolet. So although we cannot be quite sure, the chances are this is the Boattail Speedster.

The fate of the car remains a mystery. It appears in at least one film, Setea (Thirst), filmed in 1960, where it can be seen in rather better condition. The archivist, Mr Chiriac, claims the cars were scrapped. And yet ... Even in the 1960s people must have known better than to scrap two such impressive cars. So did they follow other exotica to the West? If so, then surely a unique car such as the Duesenberg would have surfaced by now. Or East? But by then, pre-war cars were no longer really sought after as transport, as there were more than enough newer, more practical ones being made locally. Might it therefore still be in Romania? One can only dream, that one day, a Bucharest garage door creaks open, and underneath, covered by decades' worth of dust...

(along with the photos to be found at http://volganeagra.blogspot.com/2022/08/duesenberg-in-comunism-communist.html)

Many thanks Chief5 - I know the above as I wrote it! (Volganeagra.blogspot.com is my personal blog which I confess I fail to update frequently enough...)

Edited October 12, 2022 by adrian_pt
Typo (see edit history)

[chief5]

That is funny 🙂

 

I just want to say that if there are any news on that car, my friend Wolfgang offered his help to look after it, because he is located near by

[8E45E]

On 10/12/2022 at 11:19 AM, adrian_pt said:

One can only dream, that one day, a Bucharest garage door creaks open, and underneath, covered by decades' worth of dust...

Many thanks Chief5 - I know the above as I wrote it! (Volganeagra.blogspot.com is my personal blog which I confess I fail to update frequently enough...)

We can only hope!!  Perhaps one can enlist Tom Cotter to do the searchin'!

 

CRaig 

[edinmass]

 

🤔 I wonder where it is?

[wayne sheldon]

Is someone hinting that someone may know?

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, wayne sheldon said:

Is someone hinting that someone may know?

Someone is always hinting they know more than they know.

[edinmass]

49 minutes ago, alsancle said:

Someone is always hinting they know more than they know.

Let’s see…….who is the last known human being to pull a Duesenberg out of a barn?  🤔

 

Seems to me I know who it is…………? 😏

[alsancle]

2 hours ago, edinmass said:

Let’s see…….who is the last known human being to pull a Duesenberg out of a barn?  🤔

 

Seems to me I know who it is…………? 😏

Doesn’t count. It was a known car. Even if it spent 40 years locked in that garage.

Edited October 15, 2022 by alsancle (see edit history)

[edinmass]

Barn……..horses were living with it.