1935 Gearbox problems, Hello from Germany

[jaMAIKa]

Hello, this my first topic.

My Name is Maik i live in Germany and drive a 1935 3WD.

I swapped the 233 Engine to a 248 with Dual Intake from 1941 Serie 50.

The Gearbox  ( Toploader ) is the old one from the 233 but not the best, there are some gears broken but its drive.

I am looking for parts or a replacement gearbox. Can you tell me if I only have to look for 1935 transmission parts or maybe something Parts of the gears of other years of construction fits..

Do you know addresses that can help me with spare Parts ?

 

Greets Maik

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bloo]

Hi Maik,

 

Transmissions of similar construction were used in Buick 40 series as recently as 1938. Larger cars have a completely different transmission. I don't know if a whole transmission from another year will fit. For the internal parts it takes a Buick parts manual to see what internal parts from other years might fit. What parts do you need?

 

Similar transmissions were used in Pontiac from mid 1935 through 1937 or 1938, and also in some Oldsmobiles. These transmissions are not close enough to fit directly, but may use some of the same internal parts. Here is a thread where I overhauled one from a 1936 Pontiac. Welcome to the forum!

 

 

 

Edited April 26, 2022 by Bloo (see edit history)

[DonMicheletti]

That is one great looking car!

[Buick35]

In the Buick buy/sell section there's 34 Buick parts for sale by Edwin the kid and it shows a transmission in the pictures.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Buick35
Spelling (see edit history)

[Jim Nelson]

Maik,   I would consider using a '38' tranny.   (bolts right up to the 37 and 38 engine.).     Better syncho's and parts more available.   I replaced my '35-50'  series engine and cooling assembly,  and installed a '38-40' series engine with a '38' 40 series tranny.    That required more mod's to use it.   `But'  my '38-40 series engine was in great shape.    Plus the 35-40 series engine matched up nicely.   I had to make brackets to use the clutch and brake assembly but that was easy.       Love the three window coupe body style.  I am a coupe fan.   My '1935' is a 2  door sedan - 'Vicky' body style but I'll put up with it.   There were not many made and the economy had crashed  in 1929,  so that with WW II destroyed many.   I feel lucky to find one in decent shape.    In '35' the '58' model was only available from the factory in only two color options.   First was Douglas Green and the only other was two colors.  A brown for the fenders and a 'yellow-ish tan'  color for the body.     I got the two tone one.   I would have loved the Douglas Green.  Oh well.    BTW,  I made new brackets to use the original parking brake lever now attached to the '38-40' tranny.     I found a guy in the New York  area who had synchronizer's and gears for my '38' tranny.   I think he is still around so if you need him,  let me know as I have his address and e-mail for contact.  

 

[jaMAIKa]

Thanks for your posts.

I'm currently driving it, but when I looked at an old photo of my Gearbox I think fuck, something's wrong.
I only have this photo of my gearbox and thought it was something is broken .

But when I look at the drawing I think it's normal

[Bloo]

Those are part number 1300501 Synchronizer Detent Spring, there are three of them. They are the part that broke in my Pontiac transmission. The one in your picture looks normal to me. It might be a good idea to replace those as the ends can fall off from wear. I bought some NOS ones and I don't know where to find more of them. Northwest Transmission Parts would be a good place to ask.

 

https://nwtparts.com/

 

The two square-headed bolts holding your shift forks on the shift rails were safety wired originally, and probably should be again.

 

 

[Ugly Rumor]

I have a 1934 transmission complete.  You can call me at (540) 493-8756, e-mail at rmullen28@hotmail.com, or reply here.  

[DonMicheletti]

I got those detent springs for my '38 Special at Notrhwest Transmission. They had NOS parts.

[Leon Piniuta]

I have a 1935 Senior  series transmission - servo assist chamber and thru out bearings ... completeSerial # 1271785-2.. $50 .too bad you are in Germany....and I am in Toronto, Canada... Air freight prohibitive on that heavy item?

email is  leonpiniuta99@gmail.com  or text 416 579 7699.

Cheers, Leon

[Jim Nelson]

Or just ship the guts and gaskets.   Cheeper that way.   

[Bloo]

And always verify the reputation of any potential seller before sending money.

 

[jaMAIKa]

Good morning, Thanks for your help.

First i will drive it this summer and look for parts.

Alternatively I think about an T5 S10 Gearbox with open drive and Ford rear Axle .

But its the same problem, find parts in Germany 🙂

 

[Bloo]

It is an easy transmission to rebuild, as you can see from the Pontiac thread I linked above. Most of the parts inside your transmission will look the same. Many of them are the same. Good luck whichever way you go.

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

15 hours ago, Bloo said:

And always verify the reputation of any potential seller before sending money.

 

 Here is a reputable dealer.

 

DME

625 Forest Hills Road

 Forest Hills, KY  41527

 

  Phone 606 237 6648 

 DMELL@SUDDENLINK.NET

 

 

  I'll bet Dennis has anything you need.

 

 

  Ben

[jaMAIKa]

I decided to convert the Transmission to an S10 T5 Gearbox.

At Tranmissionadapters i see a Kit for T5 to Straight eight.

Does anyone know if its possible the original rear axel reconstruct to opendrive ( maybe with Ford parts ? )

If not, i will try to change to 8" or 9" Ford Axle with my manuell Brakes.

First of all, I have to look for parts, its not so easy in Germany.

And end of the year i will startet.

 

 

 

[Bloo]

It is possible, just complicated and expensive. Others have done it. Buick is a poor choice of a car for such a conversion, as the torque tube acts as most of the suspension links, and when you remove it, there is little suspension left. The only car I can think of that would be more complicated is a 1950s Nash.

 

On Buick's with coil springs, most conversions I have seen involve using the long "Truck Arm" control arms from a 1963(?)-1972 Chevrolet 1/2 ton 2-wheel drive truck. These have geometry similar to the Buick torque tube, and like the Buick, only require a Panhard Rod to function. If the Buick has leaf springs, I don't recall if there is a Panhard Rod. The side-to-side location might be handled by the springs(?). No other suspension functions, such as torque reaction or front-rear axle location are handled by the springs. The suspension collapses to one side when the torque tube is disconnected, as the springs are shackled at both ends. in this case, you will need some springs intended to take axle torque, and you will need to mount the springs from a normal spring hanger in the front rather than the Buick shackle. You might look at Oldsmobiles of about the same year as they had open drivelines.

 

The other issue is the T5 transmission itself. First of all there are two front bolt patterns, GM/Chevrolet and Ford, but after some specific year (1987?) GM/Chevrolet started using the Ford pattern. The GM/Chevrolet pattern is the one used on the Saginaw and Muncie passenger car transmissions of the 60s and 70s, and the Ford pattern is the one used on Ford passenger car Toploader 3 speeds and 4 speeds. You should find out which bolt pattern the adapter fits. The T5 input shafts can have various lengths, splines, and pilot bearing diameters depending on the original application.

 

At the rear of the transmission, most T5s have an extremely rearward shifter that will be way under the front seat in most antiques, possibly behind the front seat. This includes the Mustang and Camaro/FIrebird transmissions. Additionally, the Camaro/Firebird has the transmission leaning at an extreme angle, leaving the transmission mount flange at an extreme angle when the transmission is mounted upright in a normal car. The fill and drain plugs are located for the original tilted application. The usual way around the shifter problem is to use a transmission from an S-10 pickup or Astro Van, as it has the shifter further forward. It is still much further back than your transmission, but might not hit the seat. Most of these are the "Non World Class" version of the T5, a fairly ordinary and weak transmission that happens to be in a similar case to the "World Class" T-5. The "World Class" version is the one that uses automatic transmission fluid, and has all the needle bearings and lined synchronizers. These have higher torque ratings and the "snick snick" shifting that made the T5 famous. World Class T5s do exist for the S-10/Astro application with the shifter forward, but they typically have Ford bolt patterns and no provision for a mechanical speedometer.

 

Your original transmission (and mine) have a very low profile on top. Not only is the shift tower extremely short to not protrude through the floor, the shift rails are in the sides of the case and the whole top plate is quite low. At some point I compared my Pontiac transmission to the T5 from my truck, and as I recall the t-5 was roughly 2.5-3cm taller. The floor would probably have to move up. There is no clean way to bring the shifter up on top of the transmission, the S-10/Astro location is as good as it gets. I saw a posting on another site where a guy custom made a linkage to get the shifter up on top, but then it needs even more floor clearance. I estimated the floor would have to come up about 7.5-8cm.

 

T5s for conversions like this are usually made up from more than one transmission, using an S-10 tail housing, probably an early one that can accept a speedometer gear, and internal parts from one of the stronger World Class Mustang transmissions. You may have to do some machine work on the output shaft to move the speedometer drive gear to a location that will work with the the older S-10 rear housing.

 

My advice is if you are going to do this, measure everything carefully, and above all else, build the transmission first.

 

 

 

Edited May 11, 2022 by Bloo (see edit history)

[jaMAIKa]

Many Thanks for the long answer.

In the Back i have Leavesprings with Panhard Rod an change to Teleskop Suspension.

When i change the rear Axle i think its not so tricky to attach them correctly

I will use a T5 from chevy with the front Shifter size, I have measured this and it fits exactly in front of my seat.

My floor are 3 pieces, and the middle part i can build it new, that is not a problem.

I know, its not plug and play but i hpe after the conversion its drive bedder.

It would be nice to cruise with 65miles in the 5th gear

 

Here are some pictures from my Cars and Girlfriend 🙂

Mitchopolis: Jenni & Maik as Bonnie & Clyde (mitchopolis-space.blogspot.com)H

 

Edited May 11, 2022 by jaMAIKa (see edit history)

[Jim Nelson]

That is very nice.  Did you say you have a 40 or 50 series car?    Next,  are you going to use the original mechanical brakes ?    I have the 50 series  Buick.  I have changed the cooling system to the 40 system.   The 50 series cooling system was - interesting in design.  Copy the 40 series system because was the firstborns  that matched todays systems.   If you want to put hydraulic brake's   on your 1935,  can be done.    I dd .   

[jaMAIKa]

I have a serie 40.

The mechanical Brakes are komplete rebuild and works great, maybe i will do not change to hydraulik when i have enouth space for the redirection from the Brake Cable.

 

@Bloo my Speedometer is convert to GPS and KM/H, so i can use mechanical or Elektro Speedo Transmission ( one Problem less 🙂 )

 

[Jim Nelson]

As long as your mechanical brakes work safely,  and you drive in very light traffic,  you will be fine.   I live in very busy traffic area and would not survive.    My  local housing / homes - traffic is 35 mph and if you want to go to the grocery store - requires driving on 4 and 6 lane roads put me in dangerous traffic.    Just to keep with traffic.   So I need dependable , good strong brakes.   Mechanical brakes require constant adjusting to TRY to keep them so all four wheels work at the same time and together.   ( one always seems to lock up early  or lock up late giving me 3 good brakes and one 'best guess' ).    So I converted to hydraulic brakes.   BTW, having over drive on your original drive train - gives you a change from a 4.88 rear (slow car) to a 3.41 rear moderate speed (keeping up with traffic)  car.     There is no way to easily get to a faster car .     You just accept the original  design  ( with the 4.88 rear ratio)  or  put your big boys boots on and make the changes.     I chose to instal the 1937 rear  to let me get a rear that  uses the original spring style and also a  faster rear (4.44 ratio).    Then to over drive and the best  cruising speed but will  still  have the regular 4.44 - ie 55-60 mph speeds.   Then either drive the car with the engine just happy rpm's and 35-50 mph or move to 45 - 70 mph big traffic  driving.           My friend told me  "layes your money down and takes your chances ( results).    We are trying to take a 1935 car and operate it in todays - not designed for - environment.    I chose to modify and accept the results,  increased costs to have a very neat 1935 car that is fun to drive  safely and help educate the general public about cars that you can still drive that are 70 - to 90 years old.    But,  thats my humble opinion....    BTW,  my car looks like  ( on the outside )  like it did in 1935 and only those who are mechanically inclined who look under the hood, will appreciate the safety improvements that allow you drive - safely - neat mid 1930's cars today.  

[jaMAIKa]

That is all right what you say.

As i become the Car first thing that i want was Hydraulik Brakes !

But i dont find good parts and rebuild my cable Brakes and must say it works like Hydraulik Drum Brakes without Booster.

I come from an area where we don't have 2 lane roads 😂

 

I'm still thinking about.

T5 S10 with opendrive ( first option )

or

T5 4x4 with Torque Tube

it always depends on what we find here for parts.

 

I will first look for parts and want to see what I can do with it.

 

The most important thing is to drive the summer 🙂

 

 

 

 

[Jim Nelson]

If you go the open drive line ?  are you trying to mix hydraulic brakes with the modern rear but your fronts - mechanical ?     If you go modern - open rear,  you need to convert your fronts to hydraulic also..    You can not mix those systems.   This is why I went to hydraulic brakes.    If you go hydraulic,  you will go the way I went.   I have lots of pix to show you how.    Basically you need '38-40 ' stuff.   Every thing from the '38' shock (not the shock itself) down to the lower shock.    With the front end stuff including 'knuckles,  knuckles supports, backing plates, drums and shoes,  you will have the basics ready to modify.    I rebuilt the front end with new bearings and the usual drums and matching shoes.    You will need to have a good machinist to get things ready - cleaned up to install the new brass bushings etc.   It all works with minimal alterations.   I spent several months working out how.   Again,  if you want to go that way,  I've been there, done it.   oldbuickjim@gmail.com 

[Jim Nelson]

here is a pix of the modified  35 / 38 front to be able to have hydraulics up front.     Rear was easy using '37-40 rear end on leaf springs.