buick man Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) Just getting a consensus on what is most likely the best engine hood pad adhesive to use. It seems some folks like to use 3M's spray canned 08090, but also hear it likes to eat on paint and our under hood areas from the factory have a baked on enamel protective coating so this stuff may lift this off since it is sprayed from the can and is not catalyzed. Perhaps there is a superior 2 part component system that one can mix and shoot through one of 3M's Sput undercoating guns. This would seem superior to anything non catalyzed out of a spray can. https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/bonding-and-assembly-us/structural-adhesives/epoxy/two-part-epoxy/ Another factor is of course our era cars use the thick woven glass wool insulation pads. I am intending on re-using my car's factory original pad since it is in structural and visually good shape and relatively clean on the bottom. Also, since we are on this topic of hood insulation pads, I recall having read more than a few posts in the past few years on just how crappy the new replacement pads are compared to our original factory pads. Has anyone found a source for a good like kind / quality replacement pad that fits and looks like it should be under the hood of a post war classic and not some mid seventies whatever or the like ... ? Edited August 31, 2019 by buick man (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 I used the 3M spray adhesive. The paint has not lifted. The hood insulation has not come off. I believe I ordered the insulation from one of the usual Buick parts outfits we all use from time to time. The quality is fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 1, 2019 Author Share Posted September 1, 2019 (edited) Well thanks of the reply but 3M makes a lot of different adhesives and some lift non catalyzed paints as per a simple google search. As for Buick suppliers some are good / some not so good and apparently if some of the reviews on pads from various posts of the past that I recall here have been any indication the pads can be not of the right material or shape or thickness. Of course I suppose one could source out the material that is correct and use your factory pad for a template and cut your own. Just wondering if anyone knows what exactly the material that was used by the factory was is called and if that material is still being manufactured and available ? Edited September 1, 2019 by buick man (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lrlforfun Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 OK Buick People: NO INSULATION FOR MITCH ! Why, you may ask? Mice and wahtz. We're in the country and those little rodents love the insulation.. Mitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted September 1, 2019 Share Posted September 1, 2019 13 hours ago, buick man said: Of course I suppose one could source out the material that is correct and use your factory pad for a template and cut your own. Just wondering if anyone knows what exactly the material that was used by the factory was is called and if that material is still being manufactured and available ? Find some suitable gray material and cut your own from existing (some supplier will send yellow or green boiler wrap). Spray the inside of the hood and the pad and don't worry about softening the paint...you will never see it again. The original stuff was some sort of rock wool. I would never consider using or re-using that nasty stuff: hair, caps and hats get dirty just looking under the hood. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 4, 2019 Author Share Posted September 4, 2019 (edited) Tank thanks for the input .... if I recall right I believe you yourself had a post last year or so regarding the state of affairs regarding engine hood pads. Did you ever resolve and find one suitable or are you going bare naked under the hood ? If the spray one uses can lift non catalyzed paint regardless if it is sprayed on an area where no one will ever see it, it stands to reason the glue will come off with the paint so kinda defeats the whole gluing process to begin with. I had spent a little time doing a search for a source of hood insulation Rock Wool aka Mineral Wool and also Uni-Therm Ceramic Fiber as a possible 2nd choice but finding it hard to find anything in a size large enough to cut down from a template. I have however found a size wide enough for the task but you need to buy 2 miles of it on a roll to get it. I was hoping someone else has mastered this and it would not lead me into another parts safari. Edit: Oh it's a good point that forfun posted regarding rodents eating the insulation. I have found that buying some eucalyptus oil and using a spray bottle is a good way to keep them away from under the hood during storage months as well as spraying it around the parked car around the wheels and such. In the spring just wash off. Kinda pricey but it works very well. Edited September 5, 2019 by buick man (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 David, my issue with the pad was that the vendor sent YELLOW. I got that resolved and a friend gave me a section of gray and the shape was duplicated from the old pattern. The old pad was installed 30 years and 150,000 miles ago and was nasty from the (expected) slobbering of the A-5 A/C compressor. It removed easily with a plastic bondo spreader leaving some old adhesive residue on the black semi-gloss acrylic enamel that was still intact. After cleaning with simple green and then mineral spirits the area was masked, sprayed and the pad installed after spraying. If you spray wet and then scrape, then your paint will come off, but after everything is dry, it will outlast you. Just do a test piece to satisfy your concerns... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Phillips Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 The 3-M product comes in two different strengths in the black spray cans. One says "Super" adhesive and the other says "General" adhesive. No matter which one I use, I almost always experience a falling down hood pad after a few months or years. This is after I spray both surfaces, follow directions on the can, etc., etc. Maybe it's the extreme heat (like we are experiencing now) in Texas, I don't know. I do know that I can't really recommend either of these products for hood insulation--and they aren't cheap! If someone knows of a stronger, better brand, I would like to know. Would prefer not to use 2-part epoxy, after getting used to the convenience of the spray cans, but that may be the answer. Pete Phillips, BCA #7338 Leonard, TX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 5, 2019 Author Share Posted September 5, 2019 (edited) Thanks for the update info. No secondary product is going to adhere very well to a surface that has embedded petroleum byproduct steamed into the surface. So I suppose the overall prep cleanliness of one's under hood surface area after pulling the old pad out and before applying the adhesive is a key element involved with achieving longterm adhesion. I think a must is to obtain a can of wax and grease remover from a paint jobber. This stuff is used on the surfaces before any sanding of a car that is to be painted so old wax and such is not ground down into the surface and again used after cleaning the metal with something like dawn dish detergent. But under the hood I suppose one can cover the engine and fenders with plastic. Attach a garden hose to a hot water pipe sourced faucet and wash the surface with hot water and soap. You do not want to use anything that is a Orange cleaner/degreaser based product because these citrus cleaners leave organic oil residues on the surface so grease cutting dish detergent that is not plant based is best. After this thorough cleaning let dry. Them apply the wax and grease remover with a hand held sprayer bottle. Use blue shop paper towel sections folded so as to wipe easily and in one direction doing a small section of the hood at a time. Then use another clean piece of folded blue paper shop towel to wipe again in the same direction in the same sectioned area. Repeat this process working the area until no residue appears on the paper towels then proceed to work your way into a new section repeating the process until the entire under hood area is de-waxed clean. No doubt a real pain to do but I believe if one follows this you are most likely only going to be doing this once giving your adhesive a clean substrate on which to do it job well. The other "adhesion" factor may also be just what quality the actual new hood pad fiber is and how dense and interwoven it is. If not, it can defray leaving an adhered patch of pad to the surface and fall apart due to moisture vapor and heat so a quality tight woven thick pad would no doubt be the best to select. If you can pull it apart by your fingers easily it no doubt will pull apart of it's own weight once set in place. I am currently in the process of reconditioning the underside of my hood and will post some photos since we all like pictures. I am still in the process of sourcing a good candidate material for the hood insulation so stay tuned ... Edited September 5, 2019 by buick man (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancemb Posted September 6, 2019 Share Posted September 6, 2019 On 8/30/2019 at 11:29 PM, buick man said: Just getting a consensus on what is most likely the best engine hood pad adhesive to use. It seems some folks like to use 3M's spray canned 08090, but also hear it likes to eat on paint and our under hood areas from the factory have a baked on enamel protective coating so this stuff may lift this off since it is sprayed from the can and is not catalyzed. Perhaps there is a superior 2 part component system that one can mix and shoot through one of 3M's Sput undercoating guns. This would seem superior to I am intending on re-using my car's factory original pad since it is in structural and visually good shape and relatively clean on the bottom. Usually these start to fray badly. I have an original I'd like to use if I could figure out a good way to shore up or rejoin the loose fibers. I am wondering if simply applying a spray adhesive on it and patting it down might work well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 5 hours ago, lancemb said: I am wondering if simply applying a spray adhesive on it and patting it down might work well? Anything you spray will make it flammable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 This is what I used. https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/3m-super-trim-adhesive-yellow-19-oz-08090/7160016-p?c3ch=PLA&c3nid=7160016-P&adtype=pla&product_channel=local&store_code=8425&gclsrc=aw.ds&&gclid=Cj0KCQjwh8jrBRDQARIsAH7BsXfkDuCE2dwZ0V-CHy1V5X1kn3U_zx4xRsy9DcnpBQ_p0-Wc7-UqVKcaAvGXEALw_wcB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 Summit racing. Biggest cheapest can they had. Even worked on loose sole of athletic shoes. Stay tuned for brand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 7, 2019 Author Share Posted September 7, 2019 Well the dirt out on the street is the yellow stuff from 3M is flammable and is noted to separate and liquify spray can lacquer paint. But then what doesn't ? Be ware but there's a guy on eBay who is pushing gray/or yellow "Fiberglass" pad mats supposedly cut from an OEM template. Well that's all fine and dandy for shape but Fiberglass mat is what Tank referred to above and is an industry specific wrap for boilers, heat exchangers and water heaters. It's flash point is well below that of Rock Wool btw. The problem with fiberglass is it's sparse airy weave pattern which allows it to achieve a good R-value however it is not dense enough to adhere longterm given our environment and needs. If we were attempting to just wrap something that would be fine but we are adhering to an overhead substrate and a dense weave material just like rock wool or ceramic wool is what is called for. These fiberglass mats are what you see where the glue is adhering to a glob of spun cotton candy fiberglass fiber mat and the mat itself has separated and fallen. Junk ! Regarding flammability of adhesives, I would not worry at all about how flammable the adhesive is because if it got hot enough to ignite the milli-Mil spec thickness of glue adhered to the metal hood the pad would of been toast anyway and you no doubt have bigger fish to fry ( pardon the pun ) then worrying about if your adhesive will ignite ... 😩 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancemb Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 12 hours ago, old-tank said: Anything you spray will make it flammable What about this stuff? Says Hi temp. Might be worth a shot! https://www.summitracing.com/parts/dei-010490 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 (edited) Its to my understanding that propellent in the spray can is flammable. Some qualities of the adhesive are also flammable but this characteristic is gone after curing. The high heat adhesive works fine. My application is still adhered to the hood and has need for several years. Edited September 7, 2019 by avgwarhawk (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 2 hours ago, lancemb said: What about this stuff? Says Hi temp. Might be worth a shot! https://www.summitracing.com/parts/dei-010490 This is what I used. It performs as expected with no separation or lifting of paint after drying/bonding. My comment about flammability referred to sprays on TOP of the material (clear coat, hair spray...) Anything you buy will be fiberglass boiler wrap in various colors (pre cut or cut your own) and really has no function other than some sound deadening and looks sorta good and will pass any BCA judging. Even if the nasty original stuff were available "you can't run fast enough to give to me"! This has been an interesting thread, but I still don't understand the concerns...there are more important details out there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 What year Buick is this good insulation being installed? My 54 has the two rods and sombrero to secure the insulation. Not much glue is required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted September 8, 2019 Author Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) My 57 Buick Chris. It may turn out my existing original pad may look out of place after all my handy work on the underside of the hood, if so I would be looking at possibly the ceramic wool as a possible candidate. There is however an outfit online that sells rock wool in bulk rolls wide enough for our purposes. I would need to approach them to see what the minimum runout on the roll they would be comfortable with without having to buy the whole roll. I am in no hurry but whatever I put under my hood will look like the real deal or I may just have to keep my original pad installed since it's in pretty good shape anyway. Gee don't know Tank but we learned on this post that pads are falling down and too the ones available look like crap and are of the wrong material and may just be the reason some folks are constantly having to glue it to keep it up ... I would consider that a concern but then again each to his own .... otherwise in whole Great replies, input and ideas. I will continue my search for the "right stuff" and see what rock I can turn over and come up with. Edited September 8, 2019 by buick man (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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