63 Riv carburettort / dynaflow linkage

[tapjar]

I have an aftermarket four barrel Carter carb in 63 Riviera. I checked the linkage from side of the carburetor to dynaflow, it should be some kind of "passing gear" function I suppose?

 

In my case the linkage to transmission didn´t move at all even on full throttle, so I guess it doesn´t work like it should. I found some info that the carburettor lower linkage movement should be 1 1/4 inches from idle to full throttle and the trasmission linkage should move on about last 1/2 inch of the throttle linkage movement. Is this how it should be? I´ve been driving happily for a year with this setup so it would be very nice to see what the effect of correct adjusted "passing gear" is.

[Jim Cannon]

It will not work.  In fact, it will prevent you from ever opening the carb to full wide open throttle.  Just leave the transmission linkage disconnected (take it off and toss it in the trunk.

 

I helped a guy in Austin several years ago that had the aftermarket Edlebrock carb on his '63 with the transmission kick-down linkage hooked up.  He complained of "no power" (which I did NOT understand :-) ).  I could see right away that the transmission linkage was not allowing him to fully open the throttle.  I took it off and we went out on a test drive.  OMG!!!  He drove that thing like a mad man! I asked him to back off at 100+ MPH. He had never experienced the full power of that 401 CI V-8 with the 4 BBL carb.  That smile was on his face for an hour!

 

Learn from the mistakes of others...

 

[telriv]

Remove the original throttle shaft from the '63 AFB carb. & install it in the Edelbrock. Problem solved.

[RivNut]

You can also remove the top of the 63 AFB and put it on the Edelbrock.  That allows you to use the original air cleaner without an adapter. 

[Jim Cannon]

Tom is correct.  You can move the original parts over to the new carb and make the kick-down work.

 

I do not recommend it. 

 

Think about it.  Unlike the '65-'66 transmission, this '63 setup has the vanes inside the torque converter changing position during the last 10% or so of throttle movement, when the carb is near Wide Open Throttle.  Maximum power and torque.  Do you really think you want to apply all that force on a 50+ year old torque converter?  I predict you are replacing the TC before long.  (An ROA member in San Diego just contacted me about this very issue on their '63 Riv.)

 

 

 

 

[steelman]

I think chances are good that he bought the car this way and the original 63 AFB is long gone.

[tapjar]

Pardon my french but what is AFB? Air filter bucket?

 

I really appreciate your input guys, I have to reconsider this. I don´t want to destroy the torque converter or anything else, and I don´t do full throttle accelerations for fun, I prefer cruising attitude with old car. But it would be interesting to get all working like they are desingned to work.

[Guest Kaber]

AFB= Aluminum Four Barrel

 

T

[tapjar]

AFB= Aluminum Four Barrel      of course

 

That would be great, Ed, but I bought this car with replacement carb and I don´t have the original one.

 

I planned to convert the hole of the original filter housing to fit on Carter, so I get the right look in engine bay. I already have new aluminium decal and snorkel sticker.

 

Thanks again for good advises! Have a nice weekend, guys!

Edited May 13, 2016 by tapjar
additions (see edit history)

[carbking]

Since you have the car running, and can enjoy it, you now have plenty of time to look for an original Carter AFB.

 

I believe you will find the original has much better drivability than the clone, will get better fuel economy (if that is important to you), and will make the car more valuable and easier to sell if you ever decide to sell it (or, if you are like me, when your heirs sell it ).

 

And of course, with the original, everything fits and works as it was originally engineered to work.

 

Jon.

Edited May 13, 2016 by carbking (see edit history)

[RivNut]

In the back of the Riview, there are quite a few vendors who might have that correct carb for you.  Larry Daisey @ Rancho Riviera comes to mind as well as others who are in the business of dismantling Rivieras and gathering parts for resale.  Buy the car, get a kit from Jon, and you'll be in tall cotton.  I think that for the most part, those of us on the forum have one or two cars and the parts that came with those cars.  If you're trying to find a part, you'll probably have to reach farther than this forum.

 

I know that when I bought my '64 it had an Edlebrock on it.  The first things that I did was to replace tires, the second was to find a correct carb.  I found an AFB from a '64 401 that had been rebuilt.  The only difference between the 401 and the 425 carb was something like .0005" on the secondary metering rods.  I don't know if I could tell a difference if I had the 425 carb.  BUT at least I had the correct throttle and transmission linkage.  The 401 w/ Dynaflow was first introduced in '59.  Without a chassis book for each subsequent year, I can't tell you what the differences are.  But they all had the same transmission, so therefore they probably have the same external throttle linkage.  The other thing that you might need to be aware of is the position of the fuel inlet.  It can be at the front or the back or on the left or on the right.  It can face forward or to the side.  These little things are what make the car look and run correctly. Don't "make do."

 

Ed

[steelman]

Ed also suggested replacing the top of the existing Edelbrock with the correct 63 AFB top. As when these carbs go bad it is usually on the bottom due to the lack of the proper heat shield, you might be able to find just the top reasonably priced and just swap the top.

[tapjar]

OK now I got pair of extra eyes and hands to check the carb. When pedal was floored, the throttles opened only 3/4, not fully open. The throttle linkage just wasn´t correctly adjusted. In purpose, to save dynaflow and fuel, I don´t know.

 

Now throttles open fully and last half inch of the movement also moves the linkage to transmission. I went for a test drive, the effect wasn´t dramatic but of course there´s more power at full throttle. And yes, I´m gonna be careful and not to destroy the 50+ years old fine running machine, I absolutely enjoy more smooth and slow ride. I think I´m gonna keep this carburetor because it works ok for me.

 

We also replaced front break reaction rod bushings and motor mounts yesterday, and I can tell that the effect was huge. Now when the swing arm doesn´t move front and back anymore, the car isn´t wiggling all over when braking hard. Also there´s much less vibration because of the new motor mounts.

 

Thanks again everyone for your great comments and advice.

[EmTee]

Slightly off topic, but from the discussion above, just how concerned should I be about occasionally 'dropping the hammer' on my '67 Riv?  It also has a switch-pitch converter, however, the Super Turbine 400 controls the converter pitch and kick-down engagement electrically.  I just repaired the switch connected to the carb linkage as mine wasn't energizing the downshift to 2nd gear at WOT.  Appears to be working properly now.