1950 lincoln

[Guest mena]

Hi

Came across a wrecked up 1950 lincoln with a running 337 flatty, is this a good hot rod engine, desirable etc. any info is appreciated.

Mena

[CarlLaFong]

No. This is the "Big Block" truck engine. It weighs about 15 thousand pounds and there is little speed equipment available for it

[Dave Mellor NJ]

I, also have wondered about this and other similar scenarios. Hot rodders never seem to get seriously into big block, preferring to soup up Fords instead of Lincolns, Chevies instead of Caddies or Plymouths instead of Chryslers. Maybe it's because of the greater availability of the smaller stuff or monkey see, monkey do.

[CarlLaFong]

It's always been cost and effectiveness. Ford flatheads (the passenger car engines) were cheap and responded well to hopping up. The truck engine was just that, a truck engine. When the SB Chev came out in 55, it was an easy swap to pull out your old flattie and drop in the Chevy. Many of the other engines had built in problems such as breathing issues, poor valve trains, weak components, thin cylinder walls, etc.

Plymouth instead of Chrysler?!?! Ever heard of the Chrysler Hemi?

[Rusty_OToole]

Little known fact: this was a brand new engine the same year as the trend setting Cadillac OHV V8. It was practically the same in size (337 vs 331 cu in) and power (154HP vs 160HP).

The only person to use them outside of Lincoln was Earl "Madman" Muntz. He put them in his Muntz Jet sports cars. In stock condition they performed as well as the Caddy.

The Lincoln set no trends, and did not catch on with the hot rodders either. It would make an interesting change of pace in a rod but there is practically no speed equipment for it. Everything would have to be made by hand.

I would love to see a hot rod with this engine in it. You would certainly cause some double takes at any hot rod meet you attended. But you would have to be prepared to do it the hard way, no aftermarket support.

[Guest]

Little known fact: this was a brand new engine the same year as the trend setting Cadillac OHV V8. It was practically the same in size (337 vs 331 cu in) and power (154HP vs 160HP).

The only person to use them outside of Lincoln was Earl "Madman" Muntz. He put them in his Muntz Jet sports cars. In stock condition they performed as well as the Caddy.

The Lincoln set no trends, and did not catch on with the hot rodders either. It would make an interesting change of pace in a rod but there is practically no speed equipment for it. Everything would have to be made by hand.

I would love to see a hot rod with this engine in it. You would certainly cause some double takes at any hot rod meet you attended. But you would have to be prepared to do it the hard way, no aftermarket support.

As far as Muntz Jet goes the very first cars were powered by Cadillac engines. By the time Olds and Cadillac OHV engines came out (49) the hot rodders were abandoning their flat heads. The hot rodders knew that a OHV engine could take tons more compression than a flat head without detonation. When the new version of the Lincoln V-8 came out to replace the V-12 Ford engineers made the same classic mistake they had made with the original Ford V-8 and that was to exit the exhaust ports through the block and water jackets out the side of the block ( notice the capacity and size of radiators of even the flathead Ford V-8 cars) which when hot rodders tried to raise horsepower created a engine that was a real boiler maker. At least Ford was smart on the old V-12 engine because the exhaust ports exit out of the top of the engine which avoided the afore mentioned new 337 V-8.

So from 1949- 1950 the engines of choice for hot rodders was the 303 Olds and the 331 Cadillac. In 1951 the engines of choice would be the Olds 303 Calillac 331 and the new Chrysler hemi 331 V-8. In 1953 a new engine appeared which some hot rodders of early fords liked , that engine was the new Nail Head Buick. Even though the Buick Nail Head had some horsepower limitations ( because of it's long radius exhaust ports ), the Buick engine was by the nature of the cylinder head a very narrow engine which fit very nice in a early 20's-30's Ford. Lastly by 1955 when Pontiac and Chevy introduced their V-8 some Pontiac's were used but because of the volume of Chevy cars produced and the compactness of it's engine and the proliferation of speed shops producing racing parts this has become the engine of choice for most rodders. In this day in age people trying to recreate an era of hot rodding must pay close attention to what engine they use to the time period they are trying to recreate. Just like with AACA and stock is stock, the hot rodding clubs have not so much rules , but deduct for a recreation of wrong engine/equipment in the wrong time period if the car is stated as so.

Don

[CarlLaFong]

When the new version of the Lincoln V-8 came out to replace the V-12 Ford engineers made the same classic mistake they had made with the original Ford V-8 and that was to exit the exhaust ports through the block and water jackets out the side of the block ( notice the capacity and size of radiators of even the flathead Ford V-8 cars) which when hot rodders tried to raise horsepower created a engine that was a real boiler maker. At least Ford was smart on the old V-12 engine because the exhaust ports exit out of the top of the engine which avoided the afore mentioned new 337 V-8.

Don

The Linclon V-12 was, basically a V-8 60 with 4 more cylinders. The exhaust did NOT exit out the top, but out the side like all other flathead Fords. That is unless you are talking about the real early V-12s. Ford had little to do with them. They were Leland designs.

[Guest]

I'm talking about the early V-12 in that context. I did mention old so I thought that was enough to distinguish between old and new V-12.

Don

Edited March 10, 2010 by helfen (see edit history)

[CarlLaFong]

I'm talking about the early V-12 in that context. I did mention old so I thought that was enough to distinguish between old and new V-12.

Don

I kinda thought that's what you meant, although Ford wasn't so smart since, as I said, Henry Leland was responsible for running the exhaust out the top. Ford was smart enough to buy it, just not smart enough to copy it.

[Guest]

John, what really gets me is by the time the small block Chevy came out (1955), The Ford Y block was already out. Now me being a Pontiac and Olds guy I always think "if you are a Pontiac or Olds guy even if you hot rod it you always use that particular brands engine". Now I know this is a AACA forum and stock is stock, but if I ever go to a hot rod show and I see a 40 Pontiac with a small block Chevy I always think to myself Why did that guy try to make a Chevy out of a Pontiac?? Why didn't he just by a 40 Chevy! Fortunatly for you John, some of these rods are now using SBFords in their rides.

Don

[Marty Roth]

In the 50s (I think) one of the well-played songs of the day was entitled "HOT ROD LINCOLN"

The hot-rod in the song was , as I recall, really a cut-down Model-A with a hopped-up Lincoln engine (the brakes are good, the tires are fair -- phone poles goin' by looked like a picket fence -- Pop said "Son you're gonna drive me to drinkin' if you don't stop drinin' that Hot Rod Lincoln).

I realize this is somewhat off-topic, but folk-culture being what it is, there was some use of 50s era Lincoln engines -- both flat-head, as well as mid-50s OHV where I grew up in New Jersey (OK, I was a teen-ager even if I never really grew up).

[Guest]

Heck no! Marty, your not off topic! You will also remember in that song that flat head Lincoln overheated and it's rods started knockin and that's what we've been talking about. Gee I forgot about that song, and all along Ford-Lincoln flathead engines souped up with overheating problems preserved in a song!

Don

[Rusty_OToole]

I think it would make a real gone hot rod engine but purely as a nostalgia kick.

For sheer horsepower it would be easier to use a (yawn) Chev 350.

It would be a great conversation piece and have plenty of power in stock form to take you anywhere in the US at the legal speed limit or higher.

[Guest mena]

Well folks You have givin me a lot of info. I agree with rusty that it would make a real gone rod, and I'm not afraid of a challenge. I think I will just hold on to it till I finish up with my 25 chandler. Thanks

Mena

[Larry Schramm]

I remember when I was younger that if you got one horsepower per cubic inch that was astounding. Today's cars make that seem paltry. For example, if you want raw horsepower currently, get a current model 2010 Corvette ZR1 at 638 base horsepower.

[Guest]

I remember when I was younger that if you got one horsepower per cubic inch that was astounding. Today's cars make that seem paltry. For example, if you want raw horsepower currently, get a current model 2010 Corvette ZR1 at 638 base horsepower.

So are you saying "Mena" that flathead V-8 is a waste of time"? or "go out and by a corvette"?

Don

[Guest kaycee]

I'm trying to pick my brain on the flathead Lincolns, being a Buick man, but was'nt it in 1953 that Lincoln was so successful in the ?Mexican road race circuit? I forget what the race was named at this time (Pan American?), but Lincoln should have had their last flathead in '53 I would imagine, so it can't have been a 'dog' to have done that well.

kaycee

[junkyardjeff]

Lincolns went to OHV in 52 and 51 was the last year for the flathead,I think Edmunds made some speed parts for the Lincoln flathead motor but good luck finding them.

[Guest]

I'm trying to pick my brain on the flathead Lincolns, being a Buick man, but was'nt it in 1953 that Lincoln was so successful in the ?Mexican road race circuit? I forget what the race was named at this time (Pan American?), but Lincoln should have had their last flathead in '53 I would imagine, so it can't have been a 'dog' to have done that well.

kaycee

As Jeff said the Lincoln went to a OHV V-8 in 1952, but for the restyled Cosmopolitan and Capri. The engine was a 317.5 cid, the first of the "Y" block family. They used GM's 4speed dual range hydramatic. In 1952 Lincolns take the top four spots in the 2,000 mile Carrera Panamericana road race, beating Ferraris, Chrysler hemi's, and Hudson Hornets. They also won their class in the 1953 Panamericana race as well as a first place in their class in the Mobilgas Economy run. Lincoln also entered in 1954 in the same race and came in second in it's class, but a private owner won in a Lincoln.

A special note: for those years the cars were special pre production vehicles.

Don

[Rusty_OToole]

About 6 months ago in a Chapters book store, I saw a book about rebuilding and souping up old engines.

One of the engines was a Lincoln flathead V8.

I don't remember the name of the book. It was the size of a car magazine but thicker with paper covers.

You might be able to find it with a web search, it should still be in print.

[junkyardjeff]

I got one of those small hotrod type magazines that had a feature installing Lincoln Y block in a 52 or 53 Ford 2 door wagon when both were almost new.

[Dave Mellor NJ]

While we're on the subject, Ford also went to overhead valves in their six cylinder in 52 and they kept the flathead an extra year (54) in their cars in Canada. Those are both good trivia questions for your next club meeting.