Old vinyl records

[rocketraider]

Another collecting passion of mine is old vinyl LPs, specifically box sets or annual collections.

Decided to goof off in a local antique shop Saturday afternoon and went straight to the shop's back room, where the books and records are. 45's, 78's and LP's all over the place.

Dug thru a stack of LP's and found:

Two Longines Symphonette Society box sets, and three Reader's Digest sets which appeared to have never been on a turntable. $50 for all five sets, which have between 5 and 10 discs each.

The Longines Symphonette discs were very high quality pressings in the early 1960s, and the RD sets are RCA Victor custom label pressings.

Yah, they're pretty much background or easy listening music, but I appreciate that music more as I grow older, and there's just something about firing up my old Dual turntable. Unlike many record collectors, I play and enjoy my vinyl. Between the Dual 1225 and a Technics direct drive table, both of which track at < 1g, I figure the vinyl will last a while.

A favorite ebay search is RCA Victor, and I've gotten some really choice Victor pressings in all genres of music. I have a 1958 Victor demonstration LP "Sounds in Outer Space" designed to show off the "New Orthophonic Stereo High Fidelity Victrola" and put it thru its paces. Amazingly engineered and mixed record, all analog! Then there are the Esquivel LP's...

I also have 1961 Chevrolet, 1965 Oldsmobile, and 1962 Buick dealer promo LP's. (See, here's the old car connection! )

What started this mania for sets were the 1961-70 Goodyear and 1961-2 Carling Breweries Christmas sets, which were both part of my childhood and unfortunately worn slap out. Managed to find complete near mint sets of both, plus the Firestone and Montgomery Ward sets. Got a bunch of Zenith, Magnavox, Curtis Mathes etc demonstration records too.

And I have the nerve to wonder why the house is crammed full of stuff.

Anyone else do vinyl?

[1937hd45]

I've got boxes old LP's that aren't worth the trouble to list on eBay. Is there any practical use for them?

[Guest Leonard Shepherd]

I have a house crammed full of stuff too. I have all my old records. Here are just a few, and a car content.

[novaman]

I did have a blue record with the story behind the advertising "Go Greyhound, and leave the driving to us". If I didn't wear it out as a kid, I should still have it somewhere. My grandfather drove for them.

[Dave@Moon]

I got started collecting records by DJing my BCA Chapter's annual car show. Before that I only bought music I liked as it came out. It's now my main hobby in the winter.

Between surf, soul, blues, and some rockabilly I've got around 4000 lps now. I buy very few 45s. I just don't like the sound quality relative to lps, and they're usually more expensive than the same songs on lps (even 1st pressings).

You can get a turntable and softwear to burn cds of vinyl, or add them to an iPod, for about $150.00. You can listen to them anywhere.

Records are very much like cars in value. The authentic, first issue pressings are the most valuable, and re-creations (greatest hits, compilations, "<span style="font-style: italic">Oldies But Goodies</span>" releases, K-Tel, etc.) are shunned with very rare exceptions much like replicars. Also demand is more of a factor than supply. Rare can be valuable, but popular <span style="text-decoration: underline">is</span> valuble! Any mint first pressing Beatle lp is worth at least $50.00, and most are well over $100.00 (a mint [or sealed] monophonic copy of <span style="font-style: italic">Sgt. Pepper</span> is a $300.00 item). Truly rare Beatle records are worth thousands. Who or Kinks lps, much rarer, are lucky if they're worth $25.00.

The most popular artists with collectors are the Beatles, <span style="text-decoration: underline">early</span> Bob Dylan, and Elvis (but his star is waning fast as that generation ages). Other artists just as popular (Sinatra, Rolling Stones, Bee Gees, etc.) are minimally collected at best. The aging factor is hard to overcome (see Elvis), and music is usually only collected by the generation that grew up with it. The only reliable exception to that rule is early blues records, which are the only perennial music among collectors. Even seminal jazz records don't hold their value like Muddy Waters, Leadbelly, Howlin' Wolf, Ma Rainey, etc.

Probably my rarest, most valuable lp is a 1st pressing of <span style="font-style: italic">The Chirping Crickets</span>, Buddy Holly's first lp. It's in fair condition at best, but the first pressings are so rare that it's still quite valuable. In mint condition it'd be $1200-1500 record.

If you're going to get into record collecting there are a few books you need to get. The first is the Goldmine Magazine series of record value guides. There are about a half-dozen in print at any given time, limited by age, genre, or format (45 vs. lp). The second is a guide/checklist of the type of records you enjoy. My favorite: <span style="font-style: italic">The Illustrated Discography of Hot Rod Music 1961-1965</span>. I've got a review of it posted on Amazon.com.

[stock_steve]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Leonard Shepherd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a house crammed full of stuff too. I have all my old records. Here are just a few, and a car content.

</div></div>

Nice job Leonard including the Dylan album with the conspicuous VW Microbus!

[Guest SwiftBuicks]

Actually the Album covers are worth a lot more than the discs. I've worked flea markets and have had a number of friends in the business of collectibles. However, if you are into listening to old records, you need the equipment. They aren't making these records anymore so the production equipment manufacturers have dwindled.

[Durant Mike]

I understand that there is a resurgence of collecting and buying albums. A few companies are pressing newer artists on vinyl and you can buy turntables that hook into your audio and computer via USB connection. Some swear that the sound quality just can't be matched digitally.

[Guest SwiftBuicks]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: durant28</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Some swear that the sound quality just can't be matched digitally.</div></div> This is a rather subjective area to explore. You can't escape from opinion. Some people think walking is still the best form of transportation. However, I'm a bicycle fanatic.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: durant28</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I understand that there is a resurgence of collecting and buying albums. A few companies are pressing newer artists on vinyl and you can buy turntables that hook into your audio and computer via USB connection. </div></div> The trouble with vinyl records would be that they're rather delicate and misuse can ruin their quality.

[R Walling]

The only Albums" that I have in my collection are single 78's that are in Books of sleeves for each record. They include Al Jolson and other popular favorites that my Great Aunt purchased with her RCA Victrola in the 20's.

Now you know where the term “Album” comes from.

[Dave@Moon]

Album covers, and especially 45 rpm picture sleeves, are valuable in and of themselves. However many really collectible vinyl releases didn't have such luxuries (especially low demand 45s and early 78s), and nearly all valuable albums are found in covers and sleeves that were reprinted many times with newer pressings inside that are relatively worthless. They're really only valuable in combination. If any part is diminished, the whole is.

Vinyl sales have been increasing rapidly of late. Although it's still less than 1/4 of a percent of music sales, vinyl lps sales have grown by more than 15% for each of the last 2 years. Virtually every major record release from a serious artist has a vinyl version at this point, and total annual sales have cracked the 1,000,000 mark again.

As a result, turntables are really rather easy to come by...especially USB turntables. Macy's (of all places) sold lots of them this Christmas, and they don't even sell TVs any more. My USB turntable is an Ion brand, one of 10 different models they make!

[Dave@Moon]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: stock_steve</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Leonard Shepherd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a house crammed full of stuff too. I have all my old records. Here are just a few, and a car content.

</div></div>

Nice job Leonard including the Dylan album with the conspicuous VW Microbus! </div></div>

The best example of what I'm talking about regarding vinyl vs. jacket value is the <span style="font-style: italic">The Freewheelin' Bob Dylan</span> lp in Leonard's post. The very first pressings were in sequence error and were recalled (supposedly before they made it to record stores). The only way to tell if you have a recalled one, except for playing the record, is to read the matrix number pressed into the wax inside the trail-off track. Exactly ONE stereo copy of the recalled lp has been recovered (at a rummage sale in New York). It's currently valued at $30,000. It's the most valuable record in existence. In mono it's valued at $12,000 in mint condition.

The stock copies that immediately replaced them are worth no more than $50.00, and later pressings of the same album can range down to a value of $8.00 in mint condition. All of them have exactly the same album cover.

[Guest Skyking]

I used to collect 45's. Had around 5000 groups & doowop. Sold the collection to finance the restoration of my last Met. Prices have dropped in the last 10 years. Certain copies still bring high dollars. I remember selling one on ebay for $700.00. It was listed in the book for $2000.00. Before selling the collection, I recorded the rare one's from my turntable to my PC.. They sound much better in CD format after running them through a program called CoolEdit. Now I have the same or more songs that take up less space.

[Richard Lichtfel]

I started collecting records 60 years ago. I rebuilt a wind up 78 Victor that was in our attic and started playing the old records. My Grandmother then gave me her 1916 Victor that was in mint condition and all her records. As people learned that I had 78 records they would bring over cases of them instead of throwing them out. I now have between 7 to 8,000 78's cataloged and I still play them. I have also picked up a lot of 33 records. I have a question for Dave Moon, you seem to know a lot about these records. In a collection of Beatles records I had given to me a few years ago there is a plain white record that says "side one" & "side two" and on the cover is a glued on news paper cliping of Bob Dylan and the Beatles at the Isle of Wright.

It is in very good shape but I cannot find any information on it. Would you know anything about it?

Thank you,

[oldohioan]

These people have a very neat device for recording digitally -directly- from a record player if you want to put any/all of those LPS into either WMA or MP3 file types on your computer.

http://web.mac.com/mobiblu/Site/MobiBLU.html

Ive been using one for three years now and only charged the battery three times! Good for 153 hours.

Stereo 1/8" jack for audio into it for recording; USB into the computer. Has FM radio and can record from that, record from mike (for meetings or college notes, etc). Listen with earphones. Can be had with different size memory for bookoo music files.

Its a multi threat device for a great price.

[Big Beat]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">specifically box sets or annual collections.

</div></div>

I have a bunch of these to sell, PM me.

As for records in general, I have been collecting them for over 20 years now. Mostly LP's, but some 78's as well. The oldest record in my collection is a Victor from 1899. And yes, I have an original vintage Victrola to play it (and the other 78's) on. If I had a 1920's or older car, I'd bring the Victrola and some records to the car shows. Some people do that, and I think it's great. This wouldn't work with my '79 Chevy, though. With that, I sometimes bring a big 1980's JVC boombox

These days I'm just as likely to get the music on CD, just for the convenience. By now, just about everything has been reissued, and the stuff that hasn't, you're not likely to find in any format anyway. Some records sound better than CD's to my ears, but not always. The collection is still mostly vinyl though.

[Dave@Moon]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I have a question for Dave Moon, you seem to know a lot about these records. In a collection of Beatles records I had given to me a few years ago there is a plain white record that says "side one" & "side two" and on the cover is a glued on news paper cliping of Bob Dylan and the Beatles at the Isle of Wright.</div></div>

What you're describing is a classic bootleg lp, likely from 1970. The Beatles never played the Isle of Wight Festival, but John, George, and Ringo were present at Bob Dylan's rehersal sessions with The Band prior to the concert. It's possible that this is a bootleg of tapes made at that rehersal.

It's also possible that it is this bootleg lp of Beatles songs mixed with 3 Dylan performances at the festival. Or it could be one of the many bootlegs of Dylan's performance and the Beatle pictures were just there to hook the suckers. Dylan's performance that day was not his best, and the tapes are said to be of poor quality. With bootlegs it's what's in the tracks that matter the most.

You'll need to play the record to know what you have.

Beatle bootlegs abound (see link for a history). Some are rubbish. Some are fascinating. Many are outright frauds. The better the sound quality (if genuine), generally the better the value. A really good volume 1 or 2 of <span style="font-style: italic">Sweet Apple Tracks</span> (among the best) can fetch $50.00 or more. I bought a copy of <span style="font-style: italic">The Black Album</span> (3 lps) for $30.00 last year, which I still think was a great bargain. A nice copy of the 4 lp greatest hits box set <span style="font-style: italic">Alpha/Omega</span> (which is just the Capitol releases repackaged illegally) is probably a $500.00-$1000.00 item by now. However there is no real value guide for these (technically illegal) records, and what value they did have is rapidly being eroded by cd-r copies people pass around for free. I've got 2 Beatle concert bootlegs, one you can almost listen to, that were sent to me free and unsolicited by a guy in Australia I bought a couple Beach Boy lps from.

[Richard Lichtfel]

Thank you for the information. I think one side is Beatles and the other is Dylan. The record quality is OK but not great. I will play it tonight and make a list of the songs and post them here tommorow.