West Peterson

One more. A couple of years ago I found a Jeager 8-day wind-up clock that fits in the back compartment of Classic limousines: Packard Cadillac and probably more. It was in a tent full of other clocks, so I was extremely surprised that the price tag said just $20. That seemed odd, since I know that if these clocks are working properly, they bring more than $500. Again, since it was a vendor that specialized in clocks, I walked away thinking he knew more than I did and that it probably was caroded beyond repair on the inside. This time, I returned thinking it was worth $20 just in parts. It was still there. Wound it up that evening and it kept perfect time. Sold it for $500. You win some, you lose some.

And you found out about the car, how???

It looks to be a standard Bosch unit, used on several different cars. It's identical to the ones on my 356 Porsche, except for the unique logo on the front of it. I don't recognize the logo. Maybe Adler???

Last year, near the CCCA tent, a vendor had some pieces on his table that looked like a perfect set of plastic pieces that would fit on the dashboard of my 1940 Packard. Well, they weren't plastic, they were aluminum that had been woodgrained to look exactly right. I asked him about them, and he said they came out of a Darrin, and the owner wanted the correct-type plastic instead. He was asking, if I remember correctly, $300. Cheap, considering that the reproduction plastic runs more than $2,000. I thought to myself that this set would be better than plastic, because it wouldn't crack, and once on the car, no one would be able to know the difference. I didn't care if they did, as they were just going on my "driver." They sat on his table for about a day and a half, and I got cold feet because I figured if the Classic Car Club people didn't think they were worth $300, then he was surely asking way too much. When I finally went back to bite the bullet, they were gone. I learned this past weekend that the set was made by a Darrin, himself, and that it was spotted this summer on a swap meet table in California for $3,000!!!

K8096 is correct in that the dual-cowl is probably the most desirable. Which is probably why there are so many "fakes." Not many people faking them on the Standard Eight chassis, however. Most of the authentic Standard Eight Dual Cowls (as well as Standard Eight, or even Super Eight coupe roadsters) have been moved over to a more desirable chassis. Which is also the case on the Cadillac side of the aisle. However, K8096's argument for Classics losing favor because "the people that remember them when new are getting to be fewer each year" doesn't really hold water by itself. Take a look at the older "Antiques." There's hardly a sole out there that remembers them when they were new, and those cars are thriving in desirability. While his statement may be true as a part of the big picture, it certainly can't be explained that easily. Things go in cycles, and I believe that is also part of it.

I'll be there... with my camera and two sons (both budding photographers.. smile when you see 'em. One of them may be writing a story for the kids' magazine as part of a school assignment. I wouldn't doubt that a couple of their photos may also end up in Antique Automobile).

Matt, That's a lot of Packard photos from a Buick lubber. Love the Olds Limited photo.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As the day wore on, that tire got heavier and heavier. It began to cut into his hand. </div></div> SUSAN!!! Them there tires are round for a reason!!!

I tend to agree, however, I'm also interested in the preservation of rare and interesting cars, such as the afformentioned 1933 Buick Series 85 victoria coupe that will almost certainly go back to the earth (or street rodded). If, however, it became Classic, and there really is a good argument for it, it would be saved because of its rarity. It doesn't look a whole lot different than than that Cadillac sedan you mentioned. cio. See you tomorrow.

Thanks, Jon, I know it's not an easy job making the selections. I suppose the six-cylinder Peerless was rejected for the same reason?

As the Swedes like to say, "oof dah!" But... it's still the right car. Paint mine dark (including the grille), or earth tones, and slap a set of agressive-looking black sidewall tires on it and I'd be about as happy as a ... well... nevermind.

Keep up the research. That's what professional appraisers do. In my opinion, it's okay to overpay for the right car, but you can't get the wrong car cheap enough. The 1932 903 is the right car.

I was thinking of the earlier 1930s cars, but to move up to the 1940s (by the way, the Limited is considered Classic), the Series 60 AND 70 used the same engine as the 90. So why isn't that Roadmaster Classic? As John said in a different post, if you're going to call the hogs, you gotta call 'em all. (This is NOT to imply that Buicks are hogs ) What got me started on this rant is a 1933 Series 86 for sale in another post. I sure would like to see that accepted as Classic.

There's a 1939 on eBay right now.

They're both Fords, I believe, 1940. Looks like the black one has had a Volkswagen sunroof installed on it.

Yeah, I think that's quite steep. It's hard to say without seeing the car, though. Color doesn't sound bad to me, but then I kind of like those earth-tone colors on that period of car.

And if you're in Kalamazoo, it's not that far from Chicago... Before you know it, we'll be getting recommendations for the Nethercutt and Petersen Museums in L.A.

I would like to know why the Buick Series 80, which shares the engine with the Series 90, does not enjoy Classic status. It cost a lot more than a similar Auburn, and was certainly a quality-built car. Has there been discussion on this before? If so, why was the 80 left out when the 90s were let in? Certainly not because its wheelbase was a little shorter???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The 32 903 is a florentine color. </div></div> What in heck is florentine!!! That one's not even in my dictionary. Though florin is in there as an Italian gold coin. Is the car gold? That's not terrible. At least it's not pink (or mint green )

Yes, the car in the museum. I had to remove myself from the museum, so I'm not sure what the current situation is with that car. The Doctor that was going to buy it has an office just down the street from my new office, but I left before the "deal" was made, so I didn't know if he actually completed it (the deal). There have been a lot of problems with the museum this summer, and I assumed that the Doctor would have walked away until things smoothed out. I'll have to go over there and find out how things are going. I forgot about the maroon convertible sedan that was recently available. Are you talking about David Miller's car? I was referring to the grey one in Arizona ($285,000). The convertible victorias are indeed hard to drive with the top up. The one available for $185,000 is not "perfect," but very nice. It is Tom Lester's car, and mechanically perfect (engine, drivetrain, front end and steering).

My first choice would be the 1932 903 coupe roadster, and I'm not sure I'd care what color it was. In fact, I think I'd even choose a standard eight coupe roadster from 1932 over the 1937 super eight convertible sedan. 1932, IMHO, is the best year stylingwise, as I prefer the open fenders. I would enjoy the car as long as i could with the bad color choice, and then, as time and funds could afford, paint it a more desirable color. (BTW, what color is the 903 that you found?) My step-father has a 1937 Twelve coupe-roadster, and K8096 is right, they hardly ever show up in the classifieds. A mere phone call or two is all that is needed to send one on to the next owner. The convertible sedans, however, seem to show up quite often. In fact, I know of at least two 1937 Twelve convertible sedans for sale at the present time, and two 1937 Twelve convertible victorias. The first victoria is priced at $185,000 for a 95-plus point car with an engine built by, IMO, THE best twelve builder in the world. The other victoria is about 85 points and the asking price is $125,000 (rod knock developing). One of the convertible sedans is a National Award-winning car, concours-perfect, and he's asking $285,000. It's been for sale for about a year, now, and I don't believe he's had any serious bites at that price. The other convertible sedan could be bought for about $50,000, but it's all apart and many parts may be missing. That may include a freshly rebuilt engine, though, so the price isn't totally out of line.

Detroit's about three hours away. I agree, there's plenty to see in the Cleveland area.

Historically, the 1935 models have been the least desirable of the 1930s vintage Classic Packards, followed by the 1936. That may have changed with time, I don't know, but you might want to keep that in mind. And yes, the coupe-roadster is more desirable than the convertible sedan (and the convertible victoria, for that matter). The difference in desirability between a coupe-roadster and a phaeton is about the same. Probably the least desirable of the open body styles is the touring (like a phaeton, but usually has jump seats and the back seat is set further back). Some convertible sedans have a division window and some don't. I don't know which is more desirable, it might be a personal preference. Also, $8 g's won't go very far on a V12 engine rebuild, and it probably wouldn't cover the whole cost to rebuild an 8 either. I'd say $10-12 for an 8, and you're about on the mark at $30 for a quality 12 rebuild.

Where are you located? Maybe we can put you into touch with a Packard 12 expert in your area to help you look at it. It sure would be worth a couple hundred bucks to have an expert appraising its condition. Of course, that doesn't guarantee you wont have problems down the road. I know someone who always tries to buy a car with the assumption that somewhere down the line he'll have to do an engine job, and offers a price accordingly. This way, he sometimes loses out because his offer is so low, but it's better than paying retail then having to do the engine. He gets enough cars this way that if the seller doesn't accept his offer, he knows there are a ton of other cars out there that are available. If, however, you are looking for a specific year, make, model AND body style, your offerings become a lot more limited, and you end up not wanting to walk away from a deal if the price is not just right.

I'll be busy photographing feature cars (starting at noon, til around 3:00 or 4:00). Come by and say hi.