BearsFan315

1929 Chevrolet International - 4 Door Sedan Project

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Well I am on my Official Second Antique Project, this being a 1929 Chevrolet International, 4 Door Sedan. Picked it up from a gentleman Out in Indiana. Partially restored, mainly the interior, roof, and a few cosmetics left to be done...

Beautiful car, mainly origianl parts n pieces, Engine has been recently rebuilt/ overhauled (will tear into it and check out everything) Paint looks great, frame great shape, as well as most of the reast of the car.

It has not earned a name yet, hopefully in tiame it will get a name :) Have the kids working on that as well, a good name for the car.

Here are some photos from the seller: 1929: Resto DVD

Very Nice Looking car, just needs some TLC and finishing up.

Hope to get it all finished up and driving then it can be the sunday driver for a trip to a local eatery or park, peaceful sunday drives.

Edited by BearsFan315 (see edit history)

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OK, in Doing a Simple Engine Tune-UP & Setting the timing on the 1929... [based on the Rough Running and such from this Video:

]

Here is my Current Plan of Action:

Based on my homework & reading the forums

Oil Pan Gasket

-- Drain Oil & Inspect for Metal particles/ Other Contaminants

-- Check Lower Half of Engine

---- Rods, Bearings, Dippers, Oil Lines, Oil Pump

-- Clean Pan Gasket Surface (Pan & Engine)

-- Inspect & Check Dipper Clearance (What Should This Be ? & Best Way to Check this)

-- Install New Oil Pan Gasket Set

-- Fill with oil [10w-30]

Plugs & Wires

-- Remove, Inspect & Check

-- Regap Plugs to .040" [AC Delco C-86 Plugs]

Points, Distributor Cap, Rotor, Coil, Condensor

-- Inspect & Check

-- Set Point Gap to .018" per recommendation

Valves COLD SET

-- Inspect & Check w/ Engine Cold

-- Check Each Cylinder & both Valves on Each Cylinder when that Cylinder is TDC (Under Compression Stroke, when both valves are CLOSED)

---- Set Intake Clearance to .006"

---- Set Exhaust Clearance to .008"

Test Fire Engine/ Warm-Up

-- Fire Up Engine (Cross Fingers for Starting Up & Running)

-- Set Timing

Timing

-- Check & Set to 18 deg (Per Recommendations on Here)

-- Warm-Up to Operating Temperature

-- Shut Down Engine & Check/ Set Valves at Temperature

Valves HOT SET

-- Inspect & Check w/ Engine Warmed up

-- Check Each Cylinder & both Valves on Each Cylinder when that Cylinder is TDC (Under Compression Stroke, when both valves are CLOSED)

---- Set Intake Clearance to .006"

---- Set Exhaust Clearance to .008"

Also Will Replace These Gaskets while I am in there:

Push Rod Gasket

Valve Cover Gasket

-- Seems Stright forward, remove existing, clean up surfaces on Engine & Cover, Install New Gasket.

-- Should I install any form of sealant or Adhesive, i.e. Permatex No 2, and if so on which surface, Engine or Cover ??

Edited by BearsFan315 (see edit history)

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Your plan looks pretty comprehensive. You can use permatex to hold on the valve and pan gaskets. I would use straight 30 weight, detergent now that you have cleaned the pan. The rough running is probably on the ignition side.

I would also open up the float bowl on the carb and check for debris. How is the fuel filter/bowl and fuel tank? What does the fuel smell like? In any case I would drain the old gas out if it is more than 6 months old and replace with new. You should have a plug in the bottom of the tank or you can pump out.

Keep us posted. A great find too.

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OK, in Doing a Simple Engine Tune-UP & Setting the timing on the 1929... [based on the Rough Running and such from this Video:
]

Here is my Current Plan of Action:

Based on my homework & reading the forums

Oil Pan Gasket

-- Drain Oil & Inspect for Metal particles/ Other Contaminants

-- Check Lower Half of Engine

---- Rods, Bearings, Dippers, Oil Lines, Oil Pump

-- Clean Pan Gasket Surface (Pan & Engine)

-- Inspect & Check Dipper Clearance (What Should This Be ? & Best Way to Check this)

-- Install New Oil Pan Gasket Set

-- Fill with oil [10w-30]

??

If your pan has troughs for the dippers, fill the troughs with grease and level with the edges, reinstall the pan temporarily and spin the engine backwards so the dippers don't pick up any grease. They should leave a groove in the grease. They should be about 3/8" deep and uniform. I attach photos of mine when I did it.

post-59904-143142056759_thumb.jpg

post-59904-143142056768_thumb.jpg

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Where in VA are you?

Some of your winders are shot as you know. A vendor in Australia is making stainless steel reproductions. They are pricey, but then you only have to replace them once. Welcome

Also your top material should or probably was long grain cobra with hidem welt around the edges. The cobra fabric is available from several vendors. I think that Restoration Supply Company has it. Restoration Supply Company

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Thanks, my plan on the Oil Pan Gasket, I have made 4 Guide Pins, took 4 .250-20 UNC bolts about 2.00" long, cut off the heads, ground and rounded that end off. This way i can thread them into the four corners, so when I install the pan i know that I am going straight up and even, as not to disturb or move the gaskets. With it being a 4 piece gasket set it is my understanding that the side pieces must be installed first as the end of the end corks but up against them, then use permatex 2 in the corners to seal them, but just a dab. Also have been told to Wet the end corks and wrap them around a can and let dry to preform them into shape for easier installation, also that I can use a thin coat of grease to hold the gaskets against the block surface, Or could use a thin film of the permatex 2, i just want to ensure that IF i have to replace the gasket again, that I can easily remove it and not have to clean off the permatex. Previous owner did away with the cork gasket and opted to use a black rtv to seal the pan on, granted it leaked on both bearing ends, it was a royal pain to remove, took time and patience, then more time to clean the surfaces !! Think i made up a few new words in the process :)

As for the Fuel tank and carburetor, it is a fresh clean tank. Also the system was drained & flushed recently. I also bought the filter from The Filling Station that drops in the Glass fuel bowl for an added level of security and Filtration.

Edited by BearsFan315 (see edit history)

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Landman...

Thanks for the info, I have actually heard about doing this. The pictures really help. How can I spin the Engine Backwards ?? Understand that my Engine and all is Still installed in the Car, Fully connected.

While I have the pan dropped I am also going to prime and paint it. In cleaning out my oil pan to prep it for priming and painting, realized that some of the dipper trays have pin holes in them, looks like from rusting/ sitting around during rebuild from previous owner(s) ?!?

So Now I am looking for a way to either fix/ repair my pan or buy one from a fellow Member... Took it by the local Radiator Shop here and the guys says he can braze/ solder/ weld them up really nice with no problem. He gave me a great price, so I am going to see what he can do. They specialize in Radiators, building, repairing, desigining, etc... They restore antique radiators as well, plus they custom build heat exchangers from little guys to monsterous large ones for large diesels and ships. They are also going to dip it, which will strip it back to bare metal.

Holes in Dipper Trays:

Dipper Holes 01

Dipper Holes 02

Dipper Holes 03

Edited by BearsFan315 (see edit history)

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unimogjohn...

I am in Portsmouth/ Norfolk area, far SouthEastern Tip by the Mouth of the Chesapeake Bay.

Yeah most of the cranks will need to be replaced, as well as some of the tracks. I have found a few places that actually carry them, figured I am going to hold off on replacing them till i get to the interior, unless I come across a steal of a deal on a set !! First priority is to get the eingine assembled and running right, then will set the brakes. Has a compltely new brake job, as I was informed when I bought it. So I am going to build a brake tool based on Chevrolets Specifications for one, also see that I can buy one from a few shops as well, but being in the Mechanical Design Engeering Field I think it would be more fun to design one out and have one made.

As for the Roof Top found out that Hampton Coach (now part of LeBarron Bonney) carry a complete kit for the roof, as well as the kit for the interior ALL THE WAY. Actually got the sample kit from them with samples, colors, and pricing. And there is a local guy here that can do the installation as well.

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As a side note, while i was in the lower half of the engine, I checked out what was in there and it's condition.

Here is what I Found:

1-Missing both Oil Pump Suction Pipe Screen Part No 835579 & Oil Pump Suction Pipe Spring Part No 346804, but talked with a local supplier about a few hours from me, up in Glen Allen, VA and he actually had a set of NOS on hand, so I picked it up and now in my possession.

2- Several of the Connecting Rods were so loose that i could move them EASILY by hand, so have set teh clearances on ALL 6 Connecting Rods per the manual. Funny part is the engine Turns easier my hand then before.

Also checked the two oil pockets/ reservoirs on the bearing ends to make sure they help oil, as well as the ball checks and the flow paths to ensure oil coild freely flow.

I am waiting on hardware, had to order some .250-20 UNC Round Head Slotted Machine Screws, all the local stores only carry the phillip head type, so ordered what I really wanted and original to the car. Also waiting on local shop to clean & fix up the pan, then I will prime and paint it. Also have a new Oil Pan Gasket in Hand.

Some Picts of the Oil Pan:

Oil Pan 01

Oil Pan 02

Oil Pan 03

Oil Pan 04

Edited by BearsFan315
Added Photo Links (see edit history)

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As for the Side of the Engine...

I have removed the Push Rod Cover, it has also been sent to the local Radiator shop, it will be Stripped so that I can prime and paint it up. Also have a new Gasket as well. I plan to install the gasket to the cover using Permatex 2, using a thin coat. THen clean up the block surface and reinstall the cover with new gasket.

All the rods look great, none of them seem bent.

Here are some shots of the cover & gasket:

Push Rod Cover w/ Gasket

Push Rod Cover Gunk

Push Rod Cover Gasket Backside

Push Rod Cover Gunk 2

Push Rod Cover Rough Clean Up

Edited by BearsFan315
Added Photo Links (see edit history)

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As for the Top of the Engine...

Removed the valve cover, as I will eventually need to set and adjust the valves. But for now I have cleaned up the Cover, and sent it to be cleaned so that it can be primed & painted. Someone along the way punched holes in the cover for venting, I am going to have the holes cleaned up and welded so that it will look original.

Also noticed that I need to get some wicks, as there are NONE !! 1929 Oil Wicks: MIA

Ordered the wicks when i ordered my gaskets. Need to remove the rocker arms and install the wicks per the manual.

Detail of Oil Wick from Manual: 1929 Oil Wick Detail

Already have a New Valve Cover Gasket, just need to get things done so I can close up the top half.

Edited by BearsFan315 (see edit history)

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Checking the current Timing before I start the above Plan of Action (underlined Text is a Picture Link)

When I have Cylinder 1 @ TDC (under Compression Stroke), I should be able to see the 12 deg Timing Mark in the window, IF the timing is relatively close, if not it should at least be just outside the window ?? Is this correct ?? Thinking before i set the timing this would be a good way to check to see if the timing is even close ?? or is there a better way to do this ??

So I have piston 1 set at TDC top dead center, under compression (confirmed with compression guage) Flywheel Timing Mark @ 12deg, (Freshly painted timing marks for visibility). Now when I have this set where should my Rotor be pointed (Distributor) ?? My thought it should be pointed towards Plug 1. based on the 1929 Repair Manual and vairous postings on here the Firing order should be 1-5-3-6-2-4, and this is the order the plugs should be connected with Plug 1 being located approximately at 5 O'clock, going clockwise for the remainder. Looking like this: Distributor Firing Order Diagram however this is where my Rotor/ Distributor Sits with this configuration: Rotor Location at TDC & Rotor Removed at TDC Looks like it is getting ready to fire Number 6 !! Well in my case with the mixed up wiring would be firing number 3 :/

Am I Correct so far: YES or NO ?!?

If so I found one issue already, that being that they have the Number 3 & Number 6 plugs reversed, so they are currently firing 1-5-6-3-2-4, which may be a major cause in Rough Running & Sounding and the knocking/ tapping hopefully was from improper bearing clearances which i have already addressed and fixed.

So looks like I need to pull out Distributor and rotate 180 degrees, so that it is pointing at Number 1 not Number 6.

Swapping the wire is cake, only takes a few seconds.

It is amazing that the engine ran, but hey... hoping it runs smoother once i get it all done and back together.

End result would be to have piston 1 at TDC (Compression Stroke) timing window reading 12 deg, and distributo rotor pointing at the number 1 Plug Wire.

This should get me really close in the Ball Park. Once I get it all back together & running I will Fine Tune the Timing. Still things to do on my Plan of Action List Above.

Trying to keep moving forward, while I am waiting on parts, pieces, etc...

Edited by BearsFan315 (see edit history)

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Landman...
Thanks for the info, I have actually heard about doing this. The pictures really help. How can I spin the Engine Backwards ?? Understand that my Engine and all is Still installed in the Car, Fully connected.

The crank only works forward, as does the starter. The only way is with a large screwdriver on the flywheel teeth. Mine was upside down on a stand. gentlemen, please correct me if I'm wrong.

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I admire you for digging into this project because I don't have the skills for it. great looking Chevy BTW so keep us informed on your progress.

Love my old Chevy but it came with much heart ache. I had a new 03 Corvette that was my dream car but was rammed and destroyed while parked by a refugee my city took in after hurricane Ivan from New Orleans . he as on crack and stole a locally owned SUV and crashed it into my parked car. I was lucky to find a man who traded me the 30 Chevy I own for my 03 Vette plus $12K after 6 months in the shop. really hurt to loose my car but I enjoy the 30 Chevy.

I was at Marine Barracks Portsmouth Va back in 71 before I went to Vietnam 0311 Marine Corps . lived in Chesapeake on the water. great fishing

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Coach, Pat, John - can you put it on jackstands, in gear (1st), clutch out, and turn the wheels backwards to turn the engine backwards? I know, in theory, it sounds good, but is it feasible? Echoing my thoughts! It's such a nice car Coach - keep up the great work!

Chuck

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You'd have to try it with an observer before putting the grease in the troughs and the oil pan back on. I would take the plugs out to relieve the compression.

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Good Thought Wood Fiddler...

Currently it is up on four jackstands, all four wheels off the floor, plugs are out, top & bottom of the engine is open (No Valve Cover, No Push Rod Cover, & No Oil Pan).

1929 Photos up on Stands:

1929 Up On Stands: Front View

1929 Up On Stands: Rear View

1929 Up On Stands: Rear View

Also if I spin one back wheel, I will need someone to hold the other back wheel or it will spin opposite direction not turning transmission/ drivetrain or will it. Or do I have to turn both wheels at the same time in the same direction to turn the engine ?? I will try this if I get time this weekend, put my son to work and help me.

General 1929 Photos:

1929 Photo Op

taken while it is in the garage, right after delivery. Once I get it running and stopping I will roll it out and get some better photos in the clean crisp outdoors ;)

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Landman...

just a thought, what happens if you do get grease in the dippers ?? granted you can clean the grease out, but the grease should not hurt anything, should it ?? as long as it is compatible and soluable.

what kind of grease did you use ?? I have a tub of Valvoline General Multipurpose Grease for GM VV614 and a tub of Valvoline SynPower Full-Synthetic Multipurpose Grease VV986 That i can utilize for this purpose.

I know in my current position, with engine installed and connected, a whole lot easier to spin forward than backwards. Still gonna try when I get time, was a long busy weekend here. Caught up on yard work and cleaning the daily driver !!

Edited by BearsFan315 (see edit history)

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You'd have to clean out the dippers. Might even have to remove them to do so and ensure the hole in the bearing cap isn't plugged. Other than that, no harm done. I used white lithium grease.

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Back to work on the 1929 with my 1929 Engine Timing/ Tune-Up [Plan of Action].

One thing that was mentioned to me was to check the check ball in the bearings to make sure they are free. Now is there a ball in the front and the rear, or only the rear ?? On my 1929 on the front there is a passage, no ball, but on the rear there is a pin, ball next to it and I can move the ball around and push it back freely with a small wire.

Is there any way to clean out the passage and the Oil pockets above while the engine is in the car ?? Would like to drain the oil out of hte pockets, make sure the pockets are clean of sludge and grime.

Want to take care of this before i close up the bottom end and move to the top end. Still waiting for parts to get back from shop.

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Back to work on the 1929 with my 1929 Engine Timing/ Tune-Up [Plan of Action].

One thing that was mentioned to me was to check the check ball in the bearings to make sure they are free. Now is there a ball in the front and the rear, or only the rear ?? On my 1929 on the front there is a passage, no ball, but on the rear there is a pin, ball next to it and I can move the ball around and push it back freely with a small wire.

Is there any way to clean out the passage and the Oil pockets above while the engine is in the car ?? Would like to drain the oil out of hte pockets, make sure the pockets are clean of sludge and grime.

Want to take care of this before i close up the bottom end and move to the top end. Still waiting for parts to get back from shop.

That is a good idea to check those check balls. It was the culprit in an oil leak that it took me a week to chase. See pages 15-17 of my thread http://forums.aaca.org/f190/reconstruction-34-chevy-master-coupe-297983-15.html.

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